An excellent concise explanation of why polyamory is queer from Ready for Polyamory today... https://www.instagram.com/p/DZCp2cfnCv8/?igsh=bDN6MHowb2N4bGM3

Does anyone else find it lowkey annoying when you’re interested in someone and they also seem interested. You give them your phone number and they give you theirs instead of actually calling or texting you?

Oh hey, are you a parent and polyamorous/ENM? I'm talking to you!

My free Polyam Parenting community group is meeting this Sunday at 10am MDT.

We'll ask questions, share wisdom, laugh, cry, make jokes about dating our google calendars (iykyk). If you're a polyamorous parent (or adjacent to us) you don't want to miss it!

Www.polyamparenting.com <--- register to get the link, and see upcoming dates through June!

Hey y'all! Me and my partners are exploring the concept of raising a child together. I would love books, blogs or other good resources to be able to make an informed decision. Also common pitfalls and "think about this firsts' are much appreciated!

We're currently:

Living in two houses 1+h apart of each other, with me traveling between A and B, and B also having a partner C.

We're not a quad, A and B are not dating, nor are me and C, or A and C. All relationships are stable.

A and me would be the biological parents.

We all have jobs and careers we enjoy, dividing the child-rearing amongst us would be one of the main reasons.

We're socially out as poly, just a bit more closed at family and work.

I'm the anxious overthinker and we've just really started the children talks. I'm scared to not know what I'm getting into, that the other people are not as committed, or that doing this non-traditionally will give us/the kid struggles.

I do not comprehend the preoccupying increasing numbers of hypocritical gay people recycling homophobic arguments into transphobic, biphobic, aphobic & polyphobic arguments to exclude trans people, bi people, asexual people, aromantic people & polyamorous people from the queer community spaces.

Gender variant people, gay people, bi people, asexual people, aromantic people & polyamorous people should unite empathetically in advocating for basic rights for existence outside heteronormative monogamy because they are consensual love minorities socioculturally discriminated in similar manners for similar reasons.

Im poly and basically this started cause when I was little I met a friend online who id play Minecraft with. And we decided to date cause we wanted to "get it over with," so we dated (played Minecraft) and we decided to be "open" because we wanted to "date other people cause we like physical affection without hurting each other" (we liked hugging people). So when I actually started dating, I presented as poly because that's been my experience, but I said I was open to monogamy. I started dating my current partner about 3 years ago and she was poly so I said id give that a try and see how it went (I've had other relationships during this period). As for the relationships, I've had about 3 healthy ones and id say 2 of them i was very pleased with and sad they ended, and the one that's continuing I'm conflicted on. At some point they also asked how many partners I was looking for (might not be the correct wording they used), but im not really "looking for partners," just kinda seeing what happens but I've had a separate relationships at once previously, and id prefer to not go above that so I said i guess 3 max (once again, not the exact wording but that general idea)

I also said you have to go about dating in polyamory kinda like how you go about friendships, you can't expect everyone to fill every niche, and that's okie

I was having a convo with someone and they repeatedly told me this sounded unhealthy, that i was shopping for partners, that I never gave monogamy a try, that it was a childish mindset to follow, that it wasn't real dating, and other stuff like that, but in my understanding didn't really explain what was wrong with it and kept speaking over me

And this pissed me off so I wanted to ask if I was tripping or not

Sorry if this is worded weird, I wanted to keep the wording as close to the convo I had since I'm not always the best at expressing my ideas and thoughts outright. And that third paragraph this applies to the most since I'm not 100% sure what they were getting at but those were the phrases that stuck out to me

Disclaimer: I am not looking to argue or incite heated debate on broad opinions. I am looking for a nuanced discussion with different people about their personal lived experience. In this sub specifically, I am willing to discuss the idea of whether poly belongs in LGBTQIA+, but even still, it would be a secondary discussion to the point of those post.

So this has been an interesting discussion to me just because of how... "contentious" it can be for some. Now, obviously most spaces are quite understanding and accepting of all perspectives, but occasionally I see it get oddly heated. This subreddit in particular has had some very good, accepting discussions on this topic before, so it seemed like a good place to pose the question!

To get right to the point, to me it seems to obviously be both an inherent, inborn trait for some, and a choice for others. My reasoning for this starts with my own experience as a bisexual person. The feeling of being bisexual, and the realization of it, as an inherent part of who I am that I could not change, is almost exactly the same experience I have as a polyamorous person, except for one major difference. I could not choose to be straight, but I can genuinely choose to be with someone of any gender, which is where the one major difference comes in.

For a clearer comparison, a gay person cannot choose to be straight either, but they can choose and have chosen to participate in relationships as if they were straight. This does not make them straight though, as most would readily agree. This is where my experience differs from being bisexual, because while I can and have participated in monogamous relationships, I do not feel comfortable or fulfilled in them, in fact, they cause me a great deal of personal distress. It was even to the point that it was contributing to my depression, which my therapist agreed with. Where my experience is the same as my being bisexual is in the feeling of it being an immutable, inborn trait. I know both implicitly and empirically (from my experience in mono relationships) that I could not choose to be monogamous in any capacity besides disingenuous participation.

To clarify, I have been in four relationships in my life, first two mono, second two poly, which includes my current relationship. I have never cheated on anyone, and I never would. My first relationship was with someone who wasn't very good to me, and ended with her dumping me. My second relationship I ended myself after realizing that I simply could never do mono and communicated that to her. I am always honest and open with any and all potential partners about my identity and needs. I of course can understand why these things can be a concern for many, and I don't take my identity being used as an excuse lightly either, but focusing on these concerns does seem to side-step the core question, and I don't think the existence of bad actors is enough to deny or discredit a whole concept. It honestly almost feels to me like a re-hashing of the same claim that some mono people make against polyamory as a whole, that it's "just an excuse to cheat" or "your just incapable of real, committed relationships". I'm not preemptively accusing anyone here, just to be clear, just being thorough with my thoughts.

Now, as to why I say it's both, and not just how I experience it, well, firstly I trust people's reports about their own life and lived experience, and secondly because I don't see why you couldn't be naturally monogamous, polyamorous (like myself), or ambiamorous, just like being straight, gay, or bisexual/pansexual. I, as a bisexual person, can genuinenly choose to be with a man or a woman, and an ambiamorous person could genuinely choose to be in a monogamous or polyamorous relationship. I believe this to be the case for those who feel it's purely a choice, even if I obviously don't think that anyone should be required to self identify as ambiamorous. Now, I am genuinely curious about how you all personally identify, but I'm also genuinely curious as to why any position on your own identity and lived experience should be contentious at all. I'm happy to hear from everyone!

Additional information for reference: I am a cis man, am 22, realized I was bi at 14 and poly at 16, there were signs for both as early as 10 (as far as I can recall), and I have had other arrangements in between my romantic relationships, including FWB and casual play (which I do not view or feel as being related to my need for polyamory), and I'm currently in a healthy and committed polyamorous relationship with someone who feels the same way.

Relationship insanity

Hi everyone,

Need some advice/outside perspective to a situation I am in (warning- it’s a long story)

I am a pansexual single man and I have been in a FWB relationship with a trans woman for the last year. For the sake of anonymity, we’ll call her Jessica. Jessica js married to a cis woman (we’ll call her Stacy) who has allowed her to explore sex outside of their marriage, partly because their sex drives are not compatible and partly to allow Jessica to explore her newly developed bisexual side. Back in December, I met another trans woman (we’ll call her Laurie) and we connected immediately, both sexually, mentally and emotionally. We have recently developed stronger feelings for each other. I am in love with her and she loves me too, but can’t commit to an exclusive relationship as she has only recently come out as trans and feels she needs to do some exploring and figure out who she is as an individual as she has been married for the last 15 years being “husband” to a terrible woman.

After we met, Jessica suddenly revealed she was in love with me and hoped we could pursue a relationship, supposedly with Stacy’s approval. I don’t have romantic feelings for her and expressed I wasn’t interested in being a side piece. I am hesitant about polyamory and “ethical non-monogamy” and never allowed myself to catch feelings for her since she was married and had expressed boundaries I wasn’t allowed to cross. After I met Laurie and expressed interest in her, Jessica’s boundaries suddenly started coming down.

At the same time, Jessica and Stacy decided to open up their marriage for exploring and set their sights on Laurie. This made me angry and jealous and I had a big fight with Jessica. Essentially, she decided that since I wasn’t returning her feelings, she felt she didn’t have to consider mine in pursuing someone she knew I had feelings for.

Meanwhile, Laurie has been dealing with some hardships, concerning finding a job, separating with her ex and being there for her three kids. She has moved in with me as my roommate and we are close friends. We still have sex and are intimate, and have many conversations about dealing with our feelings and the changes that may arise when the time comes. As of now, we are in a good place and I am willing to wait until she feels she can be with me exclusively.

Jessica and Stacy have continued their pursuit of Laurie with red flags arising left and right, largely concerning Jessica. Laurie and Stacy have a stronger connection with each other while Jessica seems to primarily want Laurie for sex. Recently, the three of them have been fighting due to some double standards arising on behalf of Jessica. She wants to be able to have a 1 on 1 sexual relationship with Laurie but does not want Stacy to have the same. She has decided she only feels comfortable of they all hang out and explore equally and together, but still finds ways to try to be alone with Laurie. Laurie now sees the double standards and hypocrisy and has realized the red flags are due to striking similarities between Jessica’s control over Stacy, and her own history with her mentally/emotionally abusive ex-wife. Jessica does not see the double standard and while Stacy is frustrated, continues to talk in plurals like “this is how WE feel”, “what WE’RE comfortable with”, never really speaking for herself. Laurie is going to have a talk with them tonight to make it clear, she no longer has any interest in Jessica except platonically and to address the red flags she’s observed.

Ok, so what do I do? Do I try to just be platonic with Laurie? Keep developing our relationship at her pace? Cut Jessica out of my life? Re-establish some kind of friendship? What do you all think??

UPDATE:

Thanks for all your advice and thoughts, everyone. Things have been…. Smoother. Laurie had to have a sit down with Stacy and Jessica to address the red flags she was seeing in Jessica. She got annoyed because she hoped Stacy would speak up and advocate for herself a bit more, but she didn’t. Laurie and Stacy agreed to a hard reset on their relationship, feeling things should stay platonic as Stacy and Jessica clearly have issues to work on. Jessica thought a hard reset meant they would start from scratch exploring things sexually and romantically, but ONLY between the three of them- no 1 on 1 time. Laurie called her out because earlier that day, she called Jessica telling her they needed to talk, and Jessica agreed, invited her over, even though Stacy was at work. She even asked Laurie if she could have some “kisses and cuddles”. The hypocrisy and double standard pissed Laurie off, so she threw Jessica under the bus about it so Stacy knew what Jessica was doing. Laurie told them that IF they explored more than platonic, she was only interested in doing that with Stacy, not with Jessica. Jessica gave her the ultimatum, “it’s both of us, or neither of us”. So Laurie said, “then it’s neither of you”.

So I guess things between them are now strictly platonic, though it’s obvious to me that neither Stacy or Laurie are happy about that. Laurie has since moved in with me (not as my girlfriend) but out of necessity. I am happy to help her out, because she’s my friend. We talk a lot about our relationship. She knows I’m still in love with her and she loves me too, sees that a future with me is possible, but is not IN love with me at the moment and is worried she will do something to lose me. I want to give her her space and try to be understanding, but I sometimes wonder why she won’t just give me a chance. She has her own room/bathroom here in my house, but sleeps with me every night, keeps all her toiletries in my bathroom, we shower together every night, and have sex. It sure feels like we’re dating, even though she isn’t ready to date anyone.

Things with Stacy and Jessica haven’t been great. Jessica says she’a depressed and “heartbroken” (not sure if it’s over me or Laurie). Laurie tried to hide it. Ur I know she’s pining a bit over Stacy. She revealed to me that Stacy has also told her she loves Laurie. I find this odd as they’ve only hung out three times, but I admit it scares me that Laurie might have stronger feelings for Stacy than she admits. She’s not exactly entirely forthcoming about it, feeling that talking about it might hurt me. Right now, I’m trying to be supportive of her journey and I still hope one day she will give me a chance. But I’m starting to feel if maybe I should set some boundaries about us living together or begin to look elsewhere for romantic connection for my own peace of mind. 🤷🏻‍♂️

UPDATE: good news. We had a conversation last night, after some initial strong reactions and me staying calm, we got to a place where they recognise sex has always been difficult for them (shame/panic etc) which we’ve always known, it would useful for them to talk to a therapist, and we’ve agreed some little exercises we can do to build up to having sex/feeling sexual together again without pressure, and to keep talking about it. Also mentioned non-monogamy a bit but I think we’ll do this first. It has made me wonder if it was the right thing for me to stop dating other people - they’ve never like stopped or banned me but it would have been useful not to have such a long pause cos now it feels like even more of a big deal.

Original post;

Years ago now, I had a partner L, we’d been together 9 months and both regularly dated other people and L had other partners.

I met my now-partner B and we decided to be partners too (fell in love etc). My relationship with L ended, at about 6 months in to my relationship with B. B was dating J.

A few months later I was ready to date again but this was very very hard for B and I realised we needed work things out in order for me to be honest and straightforward with any potential new partners. They broke up with J, unrelated. So at this point we’re like 9 months in, both not seeing anyone else sexually, nor dating. Have very close intimate non-sexual friendships.

We decide to move city with another friend, form a bit of a commune, so I don’t start dating again but we also don’t talk that much about it.

They attempt to have top surgery but it doesn’t work out, when we’re about 14 months. Time passes.

They successfully have top surgery at almost 2 years in. I figure we can start dating again once they’re recovered, or perhaps we’ll wait until we’ve settled in to our new city’s scene. The sex between us has become tricky, post top-surgery.

At 2 years 4 months we move in together and spend the next year settling in and getting to know people. The sex between us gets more infrequent.

At 3 years 5 months I say maybe we should pause sex (it’s been 2 months since we last had sex) for a bit then come back to it, take the pressure off. I try to come back to this conversation but very difficult.

6 months have now passed since we had sex, 4 months since we agreed to pause.

I really really want to have sex, to be reached for, to share that intimacy with someone. I don’t mind if it’s with my partner or not. My ideal is we can have sex as it’s good for our closeness, but I also want to have other types of sex outside of this anyway. It’s driving me a bit loopy. Feel like I’ve been waiting 3 years to resume dating and possibility of sex outside the relationship. Their relationship to sex has got really difficult but they don’t seem to be doing much about it. They have chronic pain and health problems, as well as c-ptsd. I had to heal a lot of sexual trauma in my 20s so I feel very protective over my sexual self, and this feels quite unfair to have to wait so long.

I really need to be able to talk to my partner about sex and about non-monogamy but every time I do I am told I’m rushing things or it’s not a good time. They talk sometimes about us being non-monog in the future or having other partners. I just want to begin to bring that future a bit closer to now.

I haven’t had sex or been physically intimate with anyone in about year. It’s been almost as long since I went on a date. Without going into too much detail I’m nonbinary and last two people I went out with both misgendered me and ignored my needs / preferences. So I decided to “take a break” bc I’d rather not deal with that.

I go to local queer events and I have friends tho I identify as polyam / relationship anarchist and so do most people I hangout with. They’re all in multiple affirming relationships and have active, enjoyable sex lives while I do not. I’m happy for them of course but I still struggle with jealousy and feelings of missing out.

I’ve been focusing on my hobbies, performing, artwork, exercise, mutual aid, etc. It helps but overall my mental health hasn’t been great. I’m in therapy trying to work on some sexual shame and body negativity from family and trauma from a previous relationship. While some parts of my mental health have gotten better, other parts have been getting worse. I think I’m developing an avoidant attachment style and a lot of anxiety around intimacy.

I was sexting with someone the other day, something I haven’t done in months, and I after I felt much better both emotionally and physically.

I feel like something’s wrong with me that not having sexual or romantic intimacy affects me so much when I have other connections and positive things going on in my life.

People move at different paces. I’m new to poly, and new to saying I’m in love first without having it reciprocated. The discrepancy is more painful than I thought it would be, and I’m not sure how to sit with the pain and still be vulnerable and normal with them.

They treat me right, we support each other, we see each other and talk all the time- but they say they need more time. We did agree falling in love was one of our desired goals for the relationship. They say they’re falling, but they’ve said that for 5 months (dating for over 10), and I’m not sure how much longer I can sit in this space. Which perhaps isn’t fair to either of us.

In monogamy it’s expected you’ll fall in love by a certain point (perhaps a year, year and a half at most), or it’s never gonna happen. But in poly there are other loves, you're not the sole romantic focus, and perhaps it takes longer.

I’d like to be a normal person and wait and just sit in the difference and see how things play out for the next six plus months, but for some reason this discrepancy just... hurts. Being with them is hard. I don’t feel like I can be “in love“ and vulnerable in the way I had to be to get there, because I’m always aware they don’t feel like I do, and I don’t know that they ever will.

I’ve told them how I feel, what I need in the short term, how I need to be in mutual love to be in a long term romantic partnership with someone (they were surprised by that for some reason.)

I just don’t really know what to do from here. Open to thoughts and reflections.

Follow up to this post:

https://www.reddit.com/r/queerpolyam/s/wzImybCAjz

I’m reconsidering my decision to take a break from s_x parties. Even if my relationship with them feels unhealthy.

I took a break because I wanted to focus on dating and building intimate more connections, get more comfortable expressing and exploring my s_xuality in other settings, and prove to myself that I don’t *need* to go to s_x parties to have fun s_xual experiences.

It hasn’t worked out as well as I’d hoped.

I feel more disconnected from my s_xuality than ever, I feel worse about my body, less attractive, more repressed, my confidence is underground. Doesn’t help that my last date+hookup sucked bc the person was enbyphobic and didn’t respect my identity or my preferences.

At this point it’s been so long it feels weird to even put myself out there again. And I know it will probably hurt my mental health to go into such s_xually charged environment after a year-long dry spell but I feel like I don’t have a choice unless I want to be celibate indefinitely.

I just want to celebrate a small victory. It's not related to being queer, but it is absolutely related to being polyamorous, and I felt like this was the best place to post, since it's a nice community here.

Background: I (43nb) have a spouse (47nb) and a nesting partner (32nb), and my spouse and I live separately (we still have a strong marriage, it just works out better for us because we're very different people). My spouse lives with their landlord in a shared unit. I am disabled and an ambulatory wheelchair user. My spouse is also disabled, but has significantly less mobility than I do. My spouse and I don't drive either, so the easiest way to see each other is for me to go over to their place.

Now onto the story: I used to take the bus to see my spouse, until their landlord got an additional couch, which takes up the only space where I'm able to park my chair when I visit. Their landlord knows damn well that means I can't come over with my chair anymore. To pour salt in the wound, nobody even uses that couch! Anyway, since then I've been dependent on my nesting partner to drive me over. Thankfully we have a KTP relationship, and my spouse and nesting partner and I play D&D together. That said, I'm pretty independent, and I hate having to rely on others.

You can imagine I've been pretty pissed at my spouse's landlord about this. My spouse is, too. Well, they finally convinced their landlord to get rid of the couch! It's such a relief that I'll be able to get there on my own again!

Tomorrow, I am going to the tell the non-binary couple The Thing!

I'mma tell them that I've been awkward and twitchy wasn't Just the undiagnosed AuDHD... but that I've been attracted to them both since I was introduced to me by their partner... Who was my manager.😵

My mama didn't raise no rude dude. I wasn't gonna do any thing with those feelings. So opack 'em nice and neat in a pretty box... And hide on a shelf in my attic.

Welp, the attic floor gave out a month ago and I've been sorting through boxes. I found theirs... And I'm not gonna miss my chance again!

If 3 Enbys can't make a decision, we can at least make a great cuddle pile!