[ILLINOIS] Appeal process

[u/CollegeSnitch]

Hi,

I'd love some feedback and guidance on what to do. I live in Illinois and quit a job after 5 months of them barely treating a mouse problem at a small local bakery. It was to the point that the bags and boxes we use for desserts were covered in mouse poo and just so many other problems. I was concerned I would get sick or someone else would and I couldn't live with it, so I quit. I applied for unemployment but it was rejected and I'd like some feedback on how to successfully appeal or if I'm out of luck?

The first time I applied i stated the issue of mice and provided them photos and info on the first food safety report. This time around I have the report that was published one month after I left that says "they believe the situation is under control now." But it wasn't for nearly the entire time I was here, it was only addressed successfully after I quit.

Aside from this, there was a lot of other problems that I didn't publish to unemployment as I didn't know if less was more. For example, I started at the end of September I have in writing from the owner where she admitted in January that herself and multiple of us didn't have food handlers cards. I personally didn't get mine until February as it was never enforced.

Either way, is there anything here that could be fruitful or is this a lost cause? If its fruitful, what wording should I use, is there certain things that need to be said a certain way?

I'm more than willing to write about the concerns of Hantavirus and other mouse related diseases if there is any benefit to that.

[u/musical_spork]

You’re not gonna win that.

[u/CollegeSnitch → u/musical_spork]

Is there really no way to argue an unsafe work circumstance with several documented health violations? 🥺

[u/Antique-Bat-4463 → u/CollegeSnitch]

Yes, if you have proof. Images, correspondences, multiple times being it up and them doing nothing, how it would be unsanitary and could affect your physical health (with Dr backup would be even better), etc.

Without significant proof, it's highly doubtful

[u/CollegeSnitch → u/Antique-Bat-4463]

I have nearly everything. I have the first encounter in October recorded by myself and emailed to the owner, I have dozens of pictures dated from November to March. I have two seperate health reports, I have photos of mouse poo on packaging, bags, boxes, the floors etc. I have reports from after I left that they still had mice. 

Most of my conversations were verbal unfortunately. But I have all the reports to back up the existence and the images, videos, and first email.

[u/Embarrassed-Sun5764 → u/CollegeSnitch]

If you were in noncompliance because they never had you get a food handler card that’s 2 strikes against you- 1) they say you didn’t have proper documentation and 2) health department says you didn’t have proper documents to work there to begin with ; so your claims are more of a “she said, he said-“ nature. They can get an exterminator to clean it up.

[u/CollegeSnitch → u/Embarrassed-Sun5764]

I have in writing from the owner that she didn't have her food card and she said some others didn't have there's. It doesn't directly name me, but herself 

Also the reports say nothing about the food handling cards, they never checked at either inspection. I also have zero idea how they weren't close, it's 100% as bad as I'm saying, slightly worse, and the health inspection barely did jack all other then say yeah they have mice. 

[u/Embarrassed-Sun5764 → u/Embarrassed-Sun5764]

They disallow your employment because of non compliance getting a health card, and then for causing disturbance to the establishment. I THINK THEY SHOULD BE SHUT DOWN. You have a bit of navigating to go through. I wish you the best

[u/CollegeSnitch → u/Embarrassed-Sun5764]

I'm well aware. They violated so many laws that this was not the only issue, frankly every time I had to go back and address issues with this it gets worse. Like they didn't notify anyone of labor rights, they withheld overtime payments (in my county it's required to be paid out), they messed up my social so that unemployment and Medicaid never got my paid, they didn't enforce health cards, after 2 months of staff being constantly sick in november/ December she admitted to cleaning the bathroom with water. They also only paid for pest control after I left. 😅 I can't even begin to remember all the other issues, but the current one at hand is the state is arguing I was complicit by staying 5 months and accepted the risk of mice. Accept they A, shouldn't have been anywhere near food. B should have been handled immediately, and C it wasn't a massive problem day 1, it got worse and worse as time went on and I was hopeful they would address it past minium work and they did not, so I left once it became a daily problem of them dessert boxes and bags being covered in mouse poo.

[u/ChefCharmaine → u/CollegeSnitch]

This is exactly what you should not do at a hearing. You are bringing up a laundry list of violations, but not addressing the fact that you stayed for five months. Food handler cards are the employee's responsibility, btw.

The state is arguing I was complicit by staying 5 months and accepted the risk of mice.

They are not wrong. Yes, mice are disgusting and a health hazard, but not so much of a hazard that you continued to work there.

I worked under similar conditions, right down to the bathroom that was cleaned once a week and the moldy changing room that flooded once a week with raw sewage. It was so bad that I never ate anything at work. I documented the conditions, showed the chef, tried to clean some of it myself, filed a complaint with the health department and was out of there in less than two months.

[u/CollegeSnitch → u/ChefCharmaine]

Yeah I didn't submit the above to unemployment, what i gave them was simply the complaint of mice for 5 months. Though I recognize now I needed to organize and document it a certain way. I've never done this before. 

Anyway, October 30th sent the owner the video of the mice in the basement so she knew where they came from, we spoke in person minutes before about her addressing it so which she said she would, so I didn't question it. I simply didn't break downstairs in the break room. November / December comes im asked to move some dessert boxes downstairs and I discovered the problem is way worse and is certainly upstairs and in the back of the kitchen. To which by early December they brought in home traps and glue boards and told us that in January we would close for 2 weeks and patch the mouse holes. 

Well closed in January they patched the holes but the problem spread to the rest of the bakery due to limited human activity. A little less than two weeks later I filed my first health and safety report as I was worried and scared for my safety and customers. As the problem was now in the products and all over the front room. 

The health district came in and confirmed the mouse problem, adjusted the traps. The reason the problem was deemed small was due to frequent cleaning which gave me hope we were handling the problem. 

By the end of February / early March we had mice out in the day light, mouse poo on pastry boxes and bags. I addressed this with the pastry manager multiple times, but as she confirmed that the owners didn't want to pay for pest control and I didn't seem the problem lessoning I quit. 

I honestly had no idea there was a structure to this. So I'm going to try again and explain it a lot better and see if I can make it stick. By any chance could you tell me if this is a better format / explanation? 

(Ignore the typos it'll be polished later)

[u/CollegeSnitch → u/Embarrassed-Sun5764]

To note, from what I was told my managers verbally, the health district never checked the cards, they were never fined, and they were never asked to close despite having a very active mouse problem, like there were mouse out and about during the day time. 0/10.

[u/ChefCharmaine]

In the case of a voluntary quit, the burden is on the claimant to establish cause that is attributable to the employer, that you notified your employer and requested a remedy or accommodations, and gave them a reasonable opportunity to address the issue before being compelled to quit. Each of these points need to be documented in order to qualify, and this is how you need to present your case when appealing.

You met the first two points in documenting objectively unhealthy working conditions and notifying your employer. Where your case falls short is how long you continued to work under these conditions and that they were remedied shortly after you quit.

To your point that hantavirus is real and immediate health concern, why did you continue working there for so long? A reasonable person who fears for the health would have quit much sooner, regardless of their financial circumstances. After your first complaint and the problem persisted, did you then file a report with health department?

Submitting a report that documents the situation was remedied shortly after you quit doesn't help your case either. It demonstrates that the employer had been making concerted efforts to fix the situation and ultimately did.

Bringing up issues unrelated to your reason for quitting makes you look like a disgruntled employee who is throwing mud at the wall and hoping something sticks. Avoid this approach.

[u/CollegeSnitch → u/ChefCharmaine]

In your opinion, so report from the district clarified that they still had mice about a month after I left and that they are still being treated, but they believe it's in control now (as of about a month later) this proves that action was taken like you claim, but not at the time I resigned where I was seeing a constant problem that i deemed unsafe, as I didn't see improvement and had been told that pest control hadn't been hired up to this point. As the self treatment was seeming to not work and professional care hadn't been arranged, I didn't find it safe anymore.

[u/AdMurky3039]

In the future the best way to deal with that situation is to report them to the Department of Health and file for unemployment (or potentially file a lawsuit) if they fur you in retaliation.

You could see if a lawyer is willing to take your case. My understanding is that they usually handle unemployment cases on contingency so you won't owe anything if you don't win.

[u/CollegeSnitch → u/AdMurky3039]

I didn't know what the right format was for this. When I asked unemployment about it in February, they told me to document everything and then leave and apply, so that's what I was trying to do 😔. I just didn't know and I don't really want to sue, I don't want to deal with the business. I just want unemployment so I can stop burning my savings as I'm applying for work