r/Genshin_Lore Mar 08 '26

Abyss The Abyss Isnt Whats Destroying the Universe

510 Upvotes

I originally posted this in a yt comment section but I thought Id put it up here too to cast a wider net.

Spoilers for "Homeward, He Who Caught the Wind"!

I'm starting to think the Abyss isn't actually what's killing the universe. How Octavia described it, the universe is dying because it is past its prime. Things peaked once, but are now crashing down. With Alice's revelations, we've learned that the Abyss is the vengeful ghost of possibilities that were discarded. It tries to destroy reality out of jealousy. But destructive as that is, that does not match how Octavia described it. If the universe was being destroyed by someone/something, her words would be very different.

The Abyss is just a side effect of the heat death. The cosmos is dying fast, simply, because of "old age". In a dying universe, less and less is possible. And with the shrinking range of possibility, more and more possible paths die. The universe is a graveyard, and the Abyss is the collective ghost of everything and everyone that could have been.

Asmoday might be rebelling because she realizes that the HP's approach wont work. As the universe becomes increasingly dead, it will only get more full with the ghosts of stillborn possibilities-- until they inevitably break through the barrier. The Traveler might be Asmoday's solution, because we can purify the abyss in a way that not even our twin seems capable of. Perhaps as a Descender, Traveler can take these discarded possibilities and weave them back into reality. This eliminates the eldritch hatred, while renewing reality with new possibilities-- revitalizing the universe.

EDIT: The comments corrected me that the Abyss is not inherently malevolent, as per Skirk and the other abyss users. So the Abyss could be more accurately defined as the remnant ghosts of dead possibilities. Not inherently good or bad, but dangerous when not subdued.

r/Genshin_Lore Oct 25 '25

Abyss The mastermind behind Genshin Impact is Woobakwa.

428 Upvotes
The evil squirrel sorcerer Woobakwa

But one day, when he was hunting in the forest, he ran into the evil squirrel sorcerer Woobakwa!
Of all the beings in the ancient world, none were more evil than Woobakwa — not even demons and dragons. Woobakwa despised everything nice, and swore to transform beauty into ugliness and turn light into dark.

The Boar Princess

The mastermind behind Genshin Impact is Woobakwa. Woobakwa is the evil squirrel sorcerer who appears in The Boar Princess. He is the source of the Abyss, the one who corrupted Nibelung and instigated the war between Phanes and Nibelung. Woobakwa is the true enemy of Teyvat.

The Boar Princess

Octagram

Because of the curse, the pup's heart was pierced and frozen by an icicle. The pup became cold and mean forever after, and whenever other animals showed kindness to him, he would repay them with the harshest of words or the most woeful of deeds. In the end, every animal loathed him.

The Boar Princess

The wolf pup that appears in The Boar Princess represents Nibelung. In Imaginarium Theater, the wolf pup is marked with an octagram, which is the symbol of Nibelung—the sun of Teyvat. In The Boar Princess, the wolf pup's heart grows cold after he eats the evil squirrel sorcerer Woobakwa. This symbolizes how Nibelung was corrupted by the power of the evil sorcerer of the Abyss.

But why is Woobakwa a squirrel? It's because Woobakwa is inspired by Ratatoskr, the squirrel from Norse mythology.

Woobakwa=Ratatoskr

Yggdrasil

The story of Genshin Impact is partly based on Norse mythology.

Phanes is Hræsvelgr. Hræsvelgr is the eagle that sits at the top of Yggdrasil. It is said that Phanes was born from an egg and has wings, which are characteristics of a bird.

Nibelung is Nidhogg. Nidhogg is the great serpent that gnaws at the roots of Yggdrasil. This evokes the theory that Nibelung is connected to the underground kingdom of Khaenri’ah.

And Woobakwa is Ratatoskr. Ratatoskr is the squirrel that lives on Yggdrasil and serves as a messenger between Hræsvelgr and Nidhogg, but it deliberately stirs up quarrels between the two. This represents that Woobakwa is the mastermind behind the war between Phanes and Nibelung.

The evil sorcerer

The evil sorcerer controls the dragon.
Narzissenkreuz

Where there are heroes, there must be wicked mages, and where there are knights, there must be evil dragons.
"Now, now, ██, ██, do get along. Don't fight."
The two who would always play the knight and the fell dragon nodded reluctantly.

Wicked Mage's Plumule

According to the story of Narzissenkreuz, there are five characters in the story: the hero, the evil sorcerer, the knight, the evil dragon, and the princess.

The hero is most likely Traveler, and the evil dragon is, of course, abyssal Nibelung.
Since the knight stands in opposition to the evil dragon, it is probably Phanes.
As for the princess, her identity is unknown, but she might be the First Angel.
And the remaining evil sorcerer — that one is Woobakwa.

In the many tales and books of Teyvat, evil dragons appear frequently.
These are, in essence, all metaphors for abyssal Nibelung.
While they are far fewer in number compared to evil dragons, a few stories also feature an evil sorcerer.
The true identity of that evil sorcerer is Woobakwa.

What is important here is that the true enemy of Teyvat is not the evil dragon, but the evil sorcerer. The dragon is merely being controlled by the sorcerer.

Then, they encountered a chipmunk demon king, which her comrades had claimed beforehand was also a species of demon king.
A complete vacuum was used to dispatch it in the end. It seems that it still required aerobic respiration.

The Little Witch and the Undying Fire

His Iktomisaurus companion carried him up and up through the clouds, and at last, they caught the cunning sorcerer. Realizing that there was no way out, Rumi simply turned himself into a giant rock. Surely, Kuntur could do nothing about him now! Yet the young warrior grabbed the giant rock and would not let go, crying, "Fly! Higher, my friend, higher!"
And so higher and higher they flew, until they soared above the very highest cloud layer, and there, Kuntur beheld the sun for the first time.

The Tale of Kuntur

According to The Little Witch and the Undying Fire, and The Tale of Kuntur, we may one day become friends with Nibelung and fight against Woobakwa in outer space.

Further speculation

Let's take a look at Hroptatyr’s weapon, Ardent Storm!

Squirrel !?
Hroptatyr... are you Woobakwa?

What do you think about this idea? I would love to hear your comments!

r/Genshin_Lore Jan 19 '23

Abyss The "Abyss" is The Second Who Came and I bring an essay to prove

842 Upvotes

"Mom, Aesion is posting huge threads of Genshin lore again, I'm scared"

Ever since “Before Sun and Moon” was a thing, people tried to guess who was the Second Who Came that rages a war against Phanes. One of the most popular interpretations usually say it is Celestia, some say the Heavenly Principles, some think we don’t even know what it is yet. However, in light of recent updates, I think it is safe to assume that the Second Who Came is not Celestia or any god but, in fact, the Abyss.

It is not a clear connection at first, so in order to make this assumption as clear as possible, I will guide you through the thought process I think is the best in order to see it. I will establish some key information first and then tie it up at the end.

Starting with the information in “Before Sun and Moon”, since it is the foundation of this theory. I will only mention the key details, as I assume most lore enthusiasts are familiar with the book.

When the eternal throne of the heavens came, the world was made anew. Then the true lord, the Primordial One, came forth and did battle against the seven terrifying sovereigns, dragon-lords of the old world.

The Primordial One may have been Phanes. It had wings and a crown, and was birthed from an egg, androgynous in nature. But for the world to be created, the egg's shell had to be broken. However, Phanes, the Primordial One, used the eggshell to separate the "universe" and the "microcosm of the world."

Forty winters entombed the flames, and forty summers churned the seas. The Seven Sovereigns were vanquished, and the seven nations submitted to the heavens. The Primordial One, the great sovereign, began the creation of heaven and earth for "our" sake — that of its creations which it cherished most, who would soon appear upon this earth.

[...]

The Primordial One had a sacred plan for humans. As long as they were happy, it too rejoiced.

[...]

If there was hunger, the heavens would bring down food and rain. If there was poverty, the earth would bring forth its riches. If melancholy were to spread, the heavens would reply with their voices. The one taboo was to succumb to temptation. But the path to temptation had already been sealed.

The second throne of the heavens came, and war was rekindled, as it was in the world's creation. That day, the heavens collapsed and the earth was rent asunder. Our ancestors and their ancestral land fell into this place during that conflict.

The era of darkness had begun.

Before Sun and Moon.

Considerations: in the entirety of the lore sources as of now, we never see any resident of Teyvat mention this belief regarding the origin of the world. Be it books, stories or dialogues, they never mentioned Phanes, or their shades, or the Second Who Came. The only humans that appear to know about them are the ancestors of Enkanomiya, which were part of the first, unified civilization and therefore lived with Phanes. Other than them, it always only dates as far back as when “Morax was still young” or about the Moon Sisters and Seelies stories, but lacking the details of when and where such creatures lived

This situation appears to be what is expected by Phanes, as we know how it is later mentioned in this book that the people were prevented from “finding the path home” (supposedly to avoid their knowledge from spreading) and that Orobashi was slain for acquiring the information that this book has. This story is not supposed to be common knowledge.

However, this limitation appears to only be related to general human knowledge. In the Flower of Paradise Lost artifact set we can see the Goddess of Flowers warning King Deshret about Phanes, as we learn that she was part of their realm.

"But the master of the heavens, consumed by fear for the rising tide of delusion and breakthroughs, sent down the divine nails to mend the land, laying waste to the mortal realm..."

"Heed my warnings: seek not the Master of the Four Shades, and inquire not of the mysteries of the sky and the abyss."

So let’s make sure we are on the same page. Until now, we have the following considerations;

  1. The Primordial One arrived and “the world was made anew”. They created all the creatures and provided them with their necessities.
  2. In the same manner the “eternal throne of heavens” of Phanes came, the “second throne of heavens” also came and rekindled a war. It mentions how “the heavens collapsed and the earth was rent asunder”, which resulted in Enkanomiya falling from their unified civilization.
  3. Since both the first and second thrones are said to “came”, in addition to Enjou mentioning that this book is proof that “Celestia is not from this world”, one strong hypothesis which will only grow stronger with future evidence is that both thrones are not from this world. This includes not only the Second Who Came, but also Phanes.
  4. Enkanomiya people were banned from going back and in the future Orobashi was killed, both supposedly to avoid the information above from being spread. The result is that no one other than gods know about The Primordial One today.

Regarding the third consideration, the relevance of this information is that it would make both thrones to be considered “Descenders”, as according to the information Nahida received from the Fatui, Descenders are “external beings, ones that don't belong to this world.”

And unless someone came even before Phanes, it would make them the “Heavenly Principles”.

Nahida: That's right. My current hypothesis is that the "First Descender" was likely what we now call the Heavenly Principles.

Archon Quest Chapter III: Act V - Akasha Pulses, the Kalpa Flame Rises: A Toast to Victory.

Admittedly, even Nahida assumes it to be a hypothesis and says it is “likely”, so it could not be a precise information. There is merit to it, however, as the behavior of Phanes preventing Enkanomiya to get out of the depths could be considered similar to what the Heavenly Principles have been doing all this time, which is preventing certain knowledge from spreading.

And don’t worry, I have not forgotten that we are looking for the conclusion as to why the Second Who Came is the Abyss, but we will have to develop the timeline of some events better before proceeding. And the secret to that lies with the Goddess of Flowers.

Two pieces of the Flower of Paradise Lost set tells us the following;

In a bygone time which only the Jinn recall, the Lord of Flowers was cast aside by the heavens.

Her magnificent vessel was left a savaged husk, her kinsfolk punished by way of being stripped of their minds…

And…

"It was a faraway time of calm and peace. Divine envoys spoke openly with the people then, bringing them the word from the heavens..."

"But, in time, invaders descended from beyond the firmament, bringing with them destruction, overturning rivers, spreading plagues..."

"And though the invaders brought war to my former kin, they also brought about illusions that could break through shackles to the land."

"But the master of the heavens, consumed by fear for the rising tide of delusion and breakthroughs, sent down the divine nails to mend the land, laying waste to the mortal realm..."

"We then suffered the torment of exile. Stripped was our connection to heaven, to our powers of enlightenment..."

"Since the disaster, I have long been cursed to never again look upon the heavens. It is my fortune that I have been able to maintain myself till now..."

She starts by recalling a time of peace where the divine envoys spoke with people, something very similar to how the Before Sun and Moon describes Phanes’ ruling of humanity; full of prosperity. In addition to that, considering that she also knew who Phanes was, it is safe to assume she lived during the first, best years of the world that Phanes created. That is, at least, until “invaders brought war to my former kin”, something that interrupted the peace during said ruling. Therefore, we can already establish a connection that the Second Who Came was part of this invasion, as they are the only thing in record that 1. appeared (“from beyond the firmament”) during Phanes' reign and 2. brought war to the world during it.

The war and disaster came from these invaders just like the “war was rekindled, [...] the heavens collapsed and the earth was rent asunder” due to the Second Who Came, according to “Before Sun and Moon”.

Back to the artifact description, the first part tells how the Goddess’ kinsfolk were stripped of their minds and how she left merely a husk. So we have a kin that was punished of their glorious form after a disaster? This information is complementary to what we already know about Seelies, which makes me believe she was, in fact, a Seelie in her original form. Let’s check again some of the Seelie lore and look for comparisons;

Her skin was ashen white and her head was bowed down, her slender fingers gently stroking the fragile strings of the lute as she played a long-forgotten and mournful melody.

"The chirping of insects on a long-gone autumn night is the chorus of exiles, singing mankind's most ancient song as they live out their plight..."

"Stripped of all that the body once held close and the soul once held dear, song and memories are all that now remain of yesteryear."

"The last singers, the first Seelie, they played their final tune in the halls of angels."

The tiny Seelie playing in the forest were also drawn to the young maiden's tune, and flocked to her to pay their respects.

"What is this song that you play?"

The wolf asked, puzzled, for it understood every line, every word, every syllable she spoke — and yet, hers was a language that it had never heard before, quite unlike that of any other living being.

"A song of the Seelie," Replied the pale young maiden in a soft voice.

"Long, long ago, we wrote this song for the human savages. Yet now, we sing it to mourn our own fate."

A Drunkard's Tale.

At a far-flung moment in the distant past, the ancestor of the seelie met a traveler from afar, with whom they swore an oath of union witnessed by the three sisters of the Lunar Palace. Just thirty days later, a sudden disaster struck. The seelie and their lover fled into exile as the world collapsed around them, fleeing until the terrible calamity caught up with and seized them. Their cruel punishment was to be separated from each other for eternity and to have their memories wiped without a trace.

The graceful but heartbroken seelie and the sisters grew more sullen and withdrawn with each passing day, to the point where their wondrous forms withered away, leaving fragments of their former selves scattered in the mountains and ruins, where they turned into tiny little life forms. They had forgotten so much, lost so much, and been stripped of their voices and wisdom, yet they continued to sing the same songs of grief.

Records of Jueyun.

The first passage tells us more about the ultimate fate of the Seelie, while the second doubles down on that in addition to mentioning the Moon Sisters and a sudden disaster as the reason for their downfall.

So far, we can draw a clear connection to the following interpretation; The Second Who Came appeared after the civilization of Phanes already existed, which included the Seelies and the Moon Sisters, and with their arrival, war and disaster happened; in turn, this event punished the Seelie and also resulted in the collapse of the three moons.

The “Flower of Paradise Lost” set works as a link between two pieces of information that we had before; we knew of the war between the two thrones and we knew of the disaster that struck the Seelie. Now, when the Goddess of Flowers, a former Seelie, connects the two events with the phrase “invaders descended from beyond the firmament, bringing with them destruction”, we suddenly have a better timeline of events. We know that it was The Second Who Came war against The Primordial One that brought the tragic fate of the Seelie and Moon Sisters.

Now, wait. Before we proceed we must take a quick look at another topic, “Forbidden Knowledge”, the thing responsible for The Withering, Eleazar, crazy scholars and all that jazz. Because in this concept lies the answers to who is the Second Who Came.

At first glance and for a long time, the concept of “Forbidden Knowledge” was ultimately seen as some kind of truth, one so twisted, possibly regarding the gods, that mortals were never supposed to know. The community was set in stone about Celestia pursuing any type of human civilization that was “too advanced” that could rebel or become arrogant. And yes, that is partially correct. Historically, they indeed do this. However, said knowledge about the gods or technology are not the SOURCE of what Celestia wanted to combat, it was the PRODUCT; the result of the thing they aim to take down, which is the Abyss. “Forbidden Knowledge” is not merely gossip about the gods, it is an incomprehensible alien concept that poisons the mind and seduces those who hear it. This corruption can eventually lead to inhuman technological and magical feats, but it is also extremely dangerous.

Greater Lord Rukkhadevata enlightens us with what she knows about this concept;

Nahida: So what exactly is... forbidden knowledge?

Greater Lord Rukkhadevata: It's a kind of knowledge that doesn't belong to this world, and a form of "truth" that can't be understood.

It came from the very bottom of the Abyss. Even I could never understand it.

The world is constantly rejecting it, leading to all kinds of bad phenomena.

If we allow forbidden knowledge to pollute Irminsul, I'm afraid the entirety of Teyvat could fall apart.

Archon Quest Chapter III: Act V - Akasha Pulses, the Kalpa Flame Rises: Where the Boat of Consciousness Lies.

The first detail here that I want to bring your attention to is to these two facts; 1. it is a knowledge that does not belong to this world and 2. it comes from the Abyss. In some form, the Abyss is related as the ORIGIN of a concept that is NOT from this world. The Abyss is alien. And it is also not the first time the Abyss is mentioned in direct relation to stuff that is not from Teyvat. To name a few:

It is stained with a profound color that is not of this world, no doubt due to the land of endless darkness that the young boy saw with his own two eyes.

Shard of a Foul Legacy.

Chiyo, a warrior of the oni tribe with the Electro Mitsudomoe emblem emblazoned on her back, was once swallowed whole by a beast from beyond this world that had a tiger's body and a serpent's tail while holding back the forces of darkness.

[...]

Few among those who fought against the abyss in those days were spared pitch-dark dreams. Those who slew monsters and then became them were hardly the minority. The border between worlds grows fragile, and corruption of this kind is perhaps not merely monodirectional.

Mask of the Kijin.

Khaenri’ah, which has a strong link with the Abyss (and had its residents turned into Abyss creatures), also has connections with “not from this world” concepts, both in their organic creations and technology.

A twisted beast from another world.

Golden Wolflord (Creation of Gold.)

The machine it once powered may have been destroyed, but it continues to rotate all the same.

There should be no such thing as an energy source that can sustain itself forever in this world, and most research results obtained in the field of "perpetual motion" have been eventually proved false. Yet, this device is proof that a now-destroyed civilization once reached heights that present-day nations could not hope to match...

Perpetual Caliber.

With this evidence, we can draw a very safe assumption that things related to the Abyss are described as “not from this world”. There are also two more concepts regarding the Abyss that I need to go through; their power to corrupt and their conflict with the heavens. Let’s start with the corruption.

This is what one of the Loading Screen tips says about the “Abyss Order”;

Driven on by the Abyss, they covet the lives of those who live on the surface, and dream of overturning the rule of the gods.

The Abyss is what drives them. The reason for what they do what they do. Cool, what else do we have?

There is the Kitsune Saiguu, that while she was in “this darkest of places”, the Abyss, she states “then, the dark will that gnaws at me…” in the Hakushin Ring description. It is very interesting to describe a “will” being imposed on you.

The Electro Abyss Lector description explicitly tells us about a dark wisdom that corrodes the mind with “dark wisdom”:

A monster who serves the Abyss Order and commands lightning while singing the praises of the darkness.

These are the evangelists and the scholars of the Abyss. Their violent lightning strikes the hearts of unbelievers with dark wisdom, warped by the shadowy depths of an eternal night, its violet glow proclaiming the existence of a great power that corrodes human intellect.

Abyss Lector: Violet Lightning.

We also have Tsumi, from the Three Realms Gateway Offering event, stating how creatures of the abyss find their presence to be addictive.

Tsumi: I don't know why he is doing this. For us, the Abyss is highly toxic, for them... intoxicating is more the word. Addictive, but still destructive.

Three Realms Gateway Offering: The Eve.

And going back to the Mask of the Kijin, we have a mention how the people fighting the abyss were not spared from “dark dreams” and eventually became monsters themselves.

Few among those who fought against the abyss in those days were spared pitch-dark dreams. Those who slew monsters and then became them were hardly the minority.

The description of the Mask that follows also ties in with the theme of conflict that I want to cover;

The border between worlds grows fragile, and corruption of this kind is perhaps not merely monodirectional.

This mentions a “border between worlds” that is suffering to maintain itself. I believe these “worlds” to be specifically the Heavens and the Abyss, both otherworldly concepts of Teyvat. There is more going on to this belief, for example the Goddess of Flowers mentions how a disaster between the two places is ever emergent;

"But my home calls to me nigh-constantly, even as a disaster between the stars and the abyss grows ever emergent on the surface of the crystals."

Hell, I made an entire thread depicting how in the Chasm we had evidence of a conflict between the Abyss and the Heavens. Some notable mentions of this analysis;

Jinwu: By the way, (Traveler). You must have seen some raw Lumenstone ore on the way here, right?

They seem to have the power to restrain the encroachment of that black mud-like substance, almost as if they were born to be enemies. The principle of how that works escapes me, though.

Khedive: Not much of a student, were you? Well then, let me put this simply. We are currently akin to beans on a stone mill, on the brink of a clash between two great powers.

Albeit on a larger time scale, we are presently being crushed by these two forces — one from above and one from below — and we shall soon be turned into bean paste!

And a very interesting description in one item you get from the Chasm, Frostglaze Crystal.

Under the radiance of the blue crystal and the power of the Abyss, a strange spiral pattern has emerged within this stone, and it is cold, almost chilling to the touch. This once smooth crystal has been transformed into this shape by the great might that descended from the heavens and the miasma that arose from the earth's depths — and perhaps the form it has taken is itself a warning unto mortals. If the interaction of these forces alone could twist stone and metal thus, if that ordinary heroine was truly able to witness the end of the pitch-dark path, how would she have faced the discovery she would make?

Greater Lord Rukkhadevata also mentions this type of reaction where one thing rejects the other when answering Nahida about the Forbidden Knowledge;

It came from the very bottom of the Abyss. Even I could never understand it.

The world is constantly rejecting it, leading to all kinds of bad phenomena.

And to close this sequence of evidence, the description of the namecard you get once you reach Lvl 10 of the Adjuvant.

What flows within this nameless, voiceless azure crystal? The secrets of the heavens? Or the whispers of the abyss?

There is also a very interesting choice of words; “whispers of the abyss”.

So what can we conclude from this?

  1. The Abyss imposes a will on these under its control. It can create dark dreams, corrode the mind and corrupt mortals. We know, due to the existence of the Abyss Order, that it algo grants powers, in addition to the Forbidden Knowledge; both are an intoxicating temptation… passed on by whispers and promises, but with a heavy price to pay.
  2. The Abyss is not merely chilling and doing their thing in the depths of the world, it is actively in tension with the Heavens.
  3. There is a strong connection to the concept of things related to the Abyss being “not from this world”, either their knowledge, their creatures or their power.

And finally, after all this set up, we can start looking at the evidence that ties all of this up together. Now that we know the properties of the Abyss, of their Forbidden Knowledge and the chronology of events regarding The Primordial One and The Second Who Came, I can tell you what leads me to believe The Second Who Came is UNDOUBTEDLY the Abyss itself.

Once again in the artifact, we can see some things taking form:

"But, in time, invaders descended from beyond the firmament, bringing with them destruction, overturning rivers, spreading plagues..."

"And though the invaders brought war to my former kin, they also brought about illusions that could break through shackles to the land."

"But the master of the heavens, consumed by fear for the rising tide of delusion and breakthroughs, sent down the divine nails to mend the land, laying waste to the mortal realm..."

The invaders, which we are assuming to be The Second Who Came, brought war, as we know, but it also brought “illusions”. Phanes, the master of the heavens, was fearful of it and as a result sent the Nails we are so familiar with in order to deal with the issue. The Nails were sent specifically to deal with “the rising ride of delusion and breakthroughs” caused by the “illusions that could break through shackles to the land”. The same type of nail that we can find in the Chasm and that has properties to repel the Mud, which comes from the Abyss. It is not a coincidence; it is their proposit!

And this is not the only piece of evidence that associates the “invader” with malicious concepts such as illusions that had to be dealt with divine nails.

In the original world, the barriers were torn down, and the dark poison had penetrated the earth. To heal that fragile, sad, and imperfect world, the spikes descended and pierced through the earth's crust.

Staff of the Scarlet Sands.

This description is from King Deshret. See how he describes the same scenario; “the barriers were torn down” in reference to the invasion of The Second Who Came and the “dark poison had penetrated the earth” in reference to what their invasion brought. And, as a result, “the spikes descended” to “heal” the world from it.

And what is that poison that needed to be healed, you ask? Why, King Deshret mentions it again and you will instantly know;

Next, the beastly trail from the poison should be cut off, for taking poison is a sin running deeper than the sky. But how sweet the whispers can be, and how clear the wisdom of which they speak…

[...]

But I do not wish that the poison ingested by mistake should remain in this world.

The Gilded Dreams artifact doubles down on mentioning how King Deshret gazed upon “wisdom of the depths” and was lured by whispers.

Thus do those who look to the past with one eye, and to a world of dreams with the other become lost,

Thus did he turn his gaze upon the wisdom of the depths, and inclined his ear to honeyed whispers…

Gilded Dreams.

It is safe to assume that he is talking about the Forbidden Knowledge that he eventually brought upon his civilization, shown to us in the Archon Quest. He mentions sweet whispers, a form of temptation we are well aware of, and also promises of wisdom. “Wisdom from the depths”; Forbidden Knowledge. And honeyed whispers? This is exactly how the Abyss operates as well.

So again, to reinforce: an invader, which we can only assume to be The Second Who Came, brought “illusions” and “poison” into the world, and said poison is undoubtedly the Forbidden Knowledge, given the way King Deshret talks about it. Forbidden Knowledge is said to come from the Abyss and it also meets the general direction of how other creatures are affected by the Abyss influence. The original plan of the heavens in order to combat it was to send divine nails into the earth, which to this day has some effect on the Abyss as seen in the Chasm, but not nearly enough.

And if Forbidden Knowledge comes from the Abyss, and Forbidden Knowledge came from the invasion of The Second Who Came…

Yep. There it is our conclusion.

And in case you are still not convinced, I have a few supporting pieces of evidence. They are essentially more information about these facts, although they by itself do not point towards the conclusions of this theory, they can be used alongside it, hence “supporting evidence”.

First, let’s go back to the chronology. According to this theory, we believe that the world was at peace under The Primordial One reign, then The Second Who Came brought war and poison, and then the nails were used to repel it. Where else can we find similar conclusions?

Remember how the book Before Sun and Moon describes the war between the two?

The second throne of the heavens came, and war was rekindled, as it was in the world's creation. That day, the heavens collapsed and the earth was rent asunder. Our ancestors and their ancestral land fell into this place during that conflict.

This wording used at “heavens collapsed and the earth was rent asunder” is in fact very frequent when sources describe this war. For example, one NPC from Enkanomiya tells us this;

Eboshi: Before Byakuyakoku fell into the deep sea, the whole world had a single unified culture.

Later, a great war broke out, in which the heavens capsized and the earth was ripped asunder. This land was then plunged into the dark ocean depths.

And this same wording is used again at one Domain of Blessing, “The Lost Valley”, implying they are related to the same event.

The ancient ritual grounds were buried beneath the earth amidst a cataclysm that tore heaven and earth asunder before being uplifted by the descent of an alien object, and finally unveiled by a destructive battle that resulted from a betrayal. Nonetheless, those who once frequented this place are no more.

It is also not the only domain to mention “being buried” by the nails, at 3.0 the “Spire of Solitary Enlightenment” arrived with the following description;

In ancient times, this was a great and beautiful place, seemingly made to bless the children of humanity. But the arrow of heaven would descend, making mountains out of flat land and burying the ancient capitol beneath the hills.

The description of the Lost Valley mentions how the war between the thrones buried the valley (given the wording is the same as the one that describes the war) before being uplifted by a Nail. It also specifies the Nail as an “alien object”, another evidence that Phanes/Celestia are related and can be considered not from this world. This domain description serves as a strong reinforcement to the chronology, further cementing the sequence of events that the war caused by The Second Who Came caused the Nails to come afterwards.

And talking about the Nails… In the same way that the Nails, which come from the heavens, repel that which comes from the Abyss, other things that originate from Celestia do a similar role.

The Withering, which is a manifestation of Forbidden Knowledge on the land, is easier on the people with Visions.

Amir: The affected areas not only cause nearby vegetation to wither, but it's also lethal to wildlife and even people. If you don't carry a Vision, then you should think twice before approaching such places.

Tighnari: Yes, Amir is absolutely right. I wasn't kidding when I said that the rainforest is a dangerous place. As Amir said, only someone with a Vision — that is, the power to manipulate elements — will be able to resist The Withering's corrosive effects for a time.

Amir: That's right. If any of the Forest Rangers without a Vision come across a Withering Zone, we first make a record of the location and then have a ranger with the proper abilities deal with it, like Tighnari here.

Only someone with a Vision can venture within a Withering Zone and find a way to deal with it.

Archon Quests Chapter III: Act I - Through Mists of Smoke and Forests Dark: Chronic Illness.

And it is also the case with the mud from the Chasm.

Khedive: What we're facing is, in essence, very similar to the anomalies on Dragonspine, in the sense that their source is something alien to this world we know... and it involves the clash of two energies.

And that is why we had to get you on the team, (Traveler), since you are able to manipulate the elements without the use of a Vision.

For normal people like us who neither have Visions nor can manipulate the elements, these anomalies are malignant, even fatal.

Those who have close contact with the source of the anomalies may begin to lose touch with the world. Some will weaken swiftly and even...

— "Wherefore Did the Spiritstone Descend?" World Quest.

And as we know, Visions are a product from divinity.

They are a way to protect the people from Abyssal corruption. I usually don’t speculate, but maybe Visions are a method to avoid that those with great ambitions end up using their strong will for the enemy’s side, under the Abyss influence. That way, only the people with less consequential decisions are corrupted, which is easier to deal with.

The point is, Visions are another representation of the combat between the Heavens and the Abyss, a way to avoid more corruption in the world.

Even Eleazar, another manifestation of the Abyss, was controlled in Collei due to Dottore using “gods remains” in the webcomic. Even if it resulted in her suffering, it is another proof of both forces repelling one another.

Tighnari: Anyway, the person who eventually rescued Collei and brought her to me for care said that she had been given to a Harbinger known as "The Doctor."

I have no idea how this "Doctor" managed to do it, but her case of Eleazar was completely stable for all the years that Collei was with them.

Archon Quest Chapter III: Act I - Through Mists of Smoke and Forests Dark: Chronic Illness.

And this concludes my round of evidence.

The Second Who Came invaded Teyvat in its most peaceful moment and brought upon the civilizations their corrupted power and wisdom.

The war between The Primordial One and The Second Who Came never ended; it is still happening, one emerging from the depths and other descending from the skies. One with promises to divinity and the other with ultimate wisdom. Both alien forces use the land as their battlefield.

What does that make of Celestia? Well, Phanes was the one responsible for the divine nails, and we see the clear parallel between the nails and Celestia’s motif, so it is safe to assume that “The Primordial One”, “Celestia” and “The Heavenly Principles” abide for the same purposes and methods.

The “Abyss” could be an entity, a concept, or a place, in the same way that the “Heavenly Principles” is addressed by Nahida as an entity, even though we always suspected it to be a concept.

We could definitely benefit from more details, but for now, I believe this is what the lore is pushing us towards.

r/Genshin_Lore Jun 05 '24

Abyss At this point i just can't take the Abyss order seriously as an enemy faction compare to the Fatui.

284 Upvotes

People can hate me for this but i just can't. I think the Abyss just has NOTHING that makes the Fatui at least semi interesting and noteworthy and i just can no longer take the abyss order seriously. The abyss order is supposed to be a bigger end game threat than the Fatui and will come after them but they just do not feel enough. Fatui just has everything the Abyss order don't:

1: Actual faces to represent their organization and to create hype and estimation:

The Fatui harbingers are the either the second most popular right bellow archons or the MOST popular faction in this entire game. They are the faces of the Fatui which makes the important Fatui appearances more unique and interesting. In time you get to know different harbingers, learn their stories while continuing to wait for the other ones. People want to get to know Pierro, get to know Columbina, they want to play as Dottore..... Fatui harbingers are iconic and represent the Fatui. Meanwhile what does the Abyss have ? Aside from Sinner/Vedrfolnir who is technically not even fully confirmed to be an actual part of the Abyss order, they have our Sibling as their ONLY unique ''face''. The rest is just the same old NPCs, the only other named one of them that is still alive is Enjou and he is just a generic Abyss herald. They have no playable character, no one to truly look forward to.

2: Relevancy:

I know Abyss is supposedly gonna take the center stage in the Khaenri'ah chapter but for the love of god they are ONLY EVER relevant in the Dain's story. For anything else they might as well not exist. They were only relevant in Mondstadt archon quest (and that is only through controlling an already corrupted Dvalin) and then just no more. They do not even have other quest appearances, like of course you can have Abyss mages and Heralds or this and that as opponents in quests but since when a word quest or an event quest or a story quest actually involved an Abyss order plot ? In comparison Fatui is EVERYWHERE. They are the main antagonist in 3 out of 5 existing archon quest and still got the W in the other two anyway and they have TONS of appearances all around in every type of quest from events to story to world quests. And they have 4 FREAKIN WEEKLY BOSS from their harbingers. In comparison what does the Abyss have ? NOTHING. Dvalin is the closest thing they have to a weekly boss and once again Dvalin was just controlled because he was already corrupted. Fatui is omni present in every aspect of the game, they have lower ranked NPCs we got to know from world quests, they get lower ranked playable characters like Lyney and the others, they have playable Harbingers, they have threats like Dottore or enemies that got killed by us like Signora.... And this allows Fatui to feel like an actual organization and to build them up more. I know the Fatui can feel like Team rocket at times but i think the pros outweighs the cons, meanwhile the Abyss order is just NOT there. And i just don't buy that the Abyss order not being seen makes them more threatening because the regular Abyss grunts do not even feel threatening and once again they have no face or as i will mention later a ''powerhouse'' anyway so them not being seen doesn't make them more mysterious or dangerous, just more irrelevant since they have so little actual build up or threat as an organization.

3: Power houses:

With the new quest now we established that our Abyss Twin is WEAKER than Dain. Now i know Dain is VERY strong, it is very likely he is comparable if not stronger than Archons but we currently have no established reason to assume he is so much above the archons and our sibling is weaker than him which puts them at basically a single Archon level at BEST. GREAT HUH ? An archon level leader/sub leader. It is not like Fatui is led by a LITERAL Archon and has at least 3 if not 4 (if we count Pierro as archon level as well) more Archon level Harbinger plus the rest of the Harbingers at their disposal and the rest includes beings like Childe who fought the Narwhal for WEAKS and Arlecchino who beat Traveler with ease. And remember the Abyss order is gonna clash with CELESTIA. What even is this ? Now i know Vedrfolnir might be the leader of the Abyss order and Vedrfolnir is probably a lot stronger than Archons so that is something at least but it just doesn't feel enough. Abyss order just doesn't feel strong, they NEVER gave the same dread to the Traveler as Arlecchino casually did in that spar and Arlecchino is barely in the top 5 of the Fatui. Also i want to take this moment to remind people that things like the Riftwolves and such are NOT even a part of the Abyss order. Majority of the bigger threats the ''Abyss'' has is unrelated to the Abyss order itself.

4: Plans and the ways these plans get build up:

We don't know the full plan of the Fatui but we know what it needs. THE GNOSES and they are working towards goal consistently. At times it feels forced how they get the Gnosis but you know that is their plan and they slowly work towards that and that makes you think they have their plan laid out and ready. They had been building up this for so long and it will hopefully pay off in the Fatui country. In comparison the Abyss order now has completed to Loom of fate. Great i guess but that is it ? It just feels so anticlimactic. They first built up their plan as a mecha osial which went practically nowhere (they basically threw that aside as a test thing in a passing line) and the Abyss searching for Dain for the eye was never relevant again until now. We heard this loom of fate during Caribert quest but we did not know a SINGLE thing about it including it needing the eye of the first field tiller and now they just quickly said ''yeah it is completed and it creates ley lines so we are gonna something with it'' and that is it. The supposed master plan is just over like that in anticlimactic way and we don't even know if it is actually gonna do shit for +2 years. Abyss' plans always feel like they make things up as they go, they never feel like they actually know what they are doing like the Fatui (at least to me) and even in this quest the Abyss sibling goes ''ahh yeah i still don't know how to utilize its full potential'' this is their master plan to beat Celestia and they literally don't even know what exactly to do with it.

Also not in comparison to the Fatui since we also don't exactly know what made Tsaritsa want to destroy Celestia but now that we know who the sinners are, the abyss seems EVEN MORE stupid and unsympathetic than ever. I know a villain group doesn't always need to be sympathetic but since Fatui at least have some good intentions behind and we recently see some at least more decent sides of their organization, i just can't help but notice this just does not exist in the Abyss order. They are angry at Celestia and yet they are practically established by one of the 5 people who caused the event that made them like this in the first place AND not came to protect them during the crisis. What a hypocrisy. The Abyss sibling goes ''just look at Caribert'' as their justification, ahh yes i see Caribert all right, the person YOUR organization used and killed and made stuck in a limbo for centuries, so rich coming from you to act like his story is tragic. With each new quest it just feels like while Celestia did took it too far with turning people into Hillichurls, they were absolutely right with destroying Khaenri'ah because of all the world ending shit they were cooking and it makes the Abyss order just so much worse as a result and not in a good way.

And lastly, with the 5 sinners introduced Abyss order just feels less relevant than ever cause unless at least 3 of them are with the Abyss order it would just feel like the Sinners themselves are a better/bigger end game threat with Gold having created all those monsters and Surtalogi raising a freakin Narwhal as his pet.

I know i wrote too much and i know so many people will not agree with this but i just don't feel like the Abyss order is built up well as a supposed end game threat and i just can't take them seriously compare to the Fatui. They are jut not well presented enough

r/Genshin_Lore Oct 28 '25

Abyss The will of the abyss (reupload cause I forgot the spoiler tag)

152 Upvotes

It's apparent to most of us that the voice in Rerir's head, which he mistook for Vedrfolnir (which Vedfolnir himself admitted to hearing too), has something to do with the Abyss itself. It's safe to assume that the voice was playing into/taking advantage of the other five's weaknesses and eventually led them all into becoming the sinners.

I don't think it's far-fetched to say that exact voice is what drove king Irmin to mental instability and led him to take the actions that he did. The ones that eventually caused the cataclysm.

One thing that really bothers me is that the abyss isn't really known for planning, or even being conscious at all. The closest we've ever seen to the Void realm possessing some sort of intelligence was with Gosoythoth's attack on Natlan. Could it be some even higher being from within the abyss pulling the strings and leading every future Sinner to their fates or does the abyss itself possess intellect and a will, contrary to what we've seen so far? I'd love to hear your guys' thoughts on this

r/Genshin_Lore Oct 22 '25

Abyss The universe is dying

181 Upvotes

In 4.7 we've got book called as the little witch and undying fire, the one who attach my attention and still made thinking until now is, why octavia the mage who travels many worlds out there, in vol 6 mention if "The entire cosmos is going to die soon" "Many stars across the cosmos have gone out. I do not know how much time is left,"

But why and how? This we're we going. Before i am going to try answer it, we must know if in genshin universe (yeah not merely teyvat) there's 3 level of fates.

To simply put, the three level of fates, "music" Or "fortuna" (Depend on what nation call it) exist in the universe is Musica mundana, musica humana, and musica instrumentalis. Musica mundana represents universal fate, ruling the entire universe, it's describe as music origin that all come from and all shall return, the "rules" That govern all thing, and everything that operate in universe even the time itself is follow this rules. Musica humana is music that rules mortal world and gods, akin to phobos, regulating every single entity including human and gods fate. Musica instrumentalis is like a symphony created by Remus, where humans control their own destiny.

Mundana music is supreme and able to control the two destinies beneath it. However, the two lower forms of music cannot alter Musica mundana.

This "true" and "false" celestial sign (actual cn word was "constellation") are refer to the true sky outside of teyvat and false sky which what compose teyvat, and both of them are bound by this "musica mundana".

Other sources also like narwhal item drop boss Lightless Silk String also mention if these so called "music" Rule and govern over all phenomena (atleast from what original cn description said) .

AND!! The important thing is, Istaroth Lunar arcanum "the wheel fortune" basically stated if these so called "fortuna" Is what decide "thing to happen" And decide what "thing should be never happen" Through the entire 14 billions years.

So basically the entire universe fate is decide and already on script by this master of musica mundana aka the primordial one itself, as the Fragment of Harmonic Whimsy set artifact confirmed primordial one as master of fortuna musica mundana.

Which actually make sense if the primordial one identity was the creator of the universe or atleast the one who rulling it, as he have authority over "reason" Or "理之(Lhi Zhi)" Which basically The Underlying Cosmic Principle or ultimate, universal, and metaphysical principle if we take a look from what it's actually mean in Confucianism and Neo-Confucianism. With it's own "shades" alone represents four fundamental aspect of the universe which life, death, space and time.

Which again, make more sense if primordial one as godly deity who preserves the universe considering the byakuyoku collection and lunar arcanum description confirmed if age of istaroth is 14 billions years old, the same age of the universe itself (also hymn of far north).

From above, i believe we already can guess a glimpse of who and what is primordial one identity. But why primordial one comes to teyvat and seal it away with fake sky?

There's only one thing in my mind why Primordial one as the ruler of the universe come to teyvat after he sense if teyvat was a place where the unlimited amount of abyss exist (which later split up to all sinner) as we know from the xbox windglider story, it's lead away directly to the abyss. It's not a merely a planetary level threat, as 1/6 that infinite abyss power alone already able to become "universe greatest disaster" Like what happen to surtalogi in skirk profile story, imagine what full power of infinite abyssal alone can be. Which actually make sense to considering dragonspine spear once mention if "the abyss" Was dark universe.

At the time of cataclysm 500 years ago, something great we don't know what it is happen to primordial one, it's so great that it was turn the universe "upside down", resulting primordial one to enter dormant state.

So after realizing how dangerous the abyss is before, that's why primordial one use it's own eggshell to "seperated the microcosm from the rest of the universe" At first place, to prevent it to cause disaster upon the universe, which we know ultimately failed.

So back in the question, why the cosmos going to die?

The answer from me is, because primordial one, the one who set the fates and operate essentially the all thing in the universe by his authority musica mundana is currently in dying state.

Primordial one dying state causing his absolute authority once again tear apart, causing all thing that tied to musica mundana begin to lose controls and falling apart, resulting the cosmos in dying state due not having the one who controls it.

This consequences perhaps what's drive asmoday to search for the new master, which in my opinion is probably traveler itself. Why? Because if you play the whole narzizenkruz world quest, you would be know if traveler not only a descender, but also have power over "reason", the same authority like primordial one itself.

As traveler might be the best candidate to replace primordial one, as not only a descender a being that transcend all fate but also shape the fate itself, lunar arcanum "the fool" Also mention if traveler was the "i am the newborn spark when all thing ends".

So that it's my theory, it's my first thread so sorry if it's bit messy and kinda wild.

r/Genshin_Lore Jan 03 '25

Abyss with Natlan, Mihoyo is 100% setting up the Abyss Order as a Morally-Grey, and NOT the "greater evil"

277 Upvotes

one thing that struck me in Natlan is the sheer amount of effort Mihoyo has put in narratively to distinguish the Abyss Order from the Abyss on every Level, distancing it from the evils of the Abyss that ended Kaenri'ah and is attacking Natlan.

all of this to me is leading to the fact

2 main points:

---------------- it's distanced it from the "Bad parts" of the Abyss ----------------

especially since that prior to Natlan, the Abyss and Abyss Order were synonymous, Hoyo could have easily continued that trend, but rather undertook a narrative project to split them.

The Abyss Order has zero involvement with the Abyss Threat against Natlan, no connection with Gosoythoth and the Abyss Attacks on Natlan, no appearances, no deals.

and this goes down even to the Enemy Selection. The Abyss Forces are all "beasts", Hilichurls, Rifthounds, and Mimiflora, notably EXLCUDING almost all Sapient Abyss Creatures that are usually associated with the Abyss Order.

and enemies associated with the Abyss Order, Namely Hydro, Pyro, and Electro Abyss Heralds and Lectors are noticably absent, as they all have voice lines preaching/praising the Abyss. While they appear in other abyss-order strongholds like Enkanomyia, they don't appear in Ochkanatlan or any of the enemies.

and the only one that does appear, its explicit purpose of showing that the Abyss Order is NOT involved the only not-enjou voiced Pyro Lector that appears in the 1st Act of the Quest's entire purpose is to tell us that he's only SPECTATING the events,

and Cryo Heralds typically more associated with non-abyss-order anyways, with the Caribert Quest introducing them has them "not be from the Abyss Order", so the one that Mavuika fights doesn't mean much.

so mihoyo has distanced, separated the Abyss Order from the "evil perpetrated by the Abyss Itself that hurt Natlan and Khaenr'iah

mihoyo could have easily put abyss Lectors into the armies of the abyss, but chose not to. instead making the Abyss Primordial and Bestial, purposely Excluding the Sapient Abyss Order.

------------and an honestly non-stop chain of relatively positive portrayals. -------------------

Enjou. While he's repeatedly declared to be just a small member of the Abyss Order, he's also the ONLY representation that the Order has been given, and it has been quite positive. You have to think about it in terms of author intent.

It's like Childe where that while he may not represent the Fatui, Mihoyo portraying Childe as being "good" in his story quest is 100% them also saying that the Fatui are not "all that bad".

and Ever since the Chasm, we've just been having non-stop...non-villianous portrayals of the Abyss Order

the Chasm was more morally grey.

Caribert is just Tragic

Bedtime Story seems to be overall positive for the Order

while you may say that these are still villianous, when you compare it to when Mihoyo wants to make a proper 1D-pure-evil villian, the Abyss Order is definitely being set up for something

r/Genshin_Lore Oct 17 '24

Abyss Abyss' true form (Heart of the Abyss) and Lovecraft connections Spoiler

Thumbnail gallery
410 Upvotes

r/Genshin_Lore Nov 14 '22

Abyss I can't take the Abyss seriously as a threat anymore. They just do nothing at all unlike Fatui.

422 Upvotes

After playing this game and loving its lore for 2 years I came to a point that I can no longer take Abyss seriously as a threat. Compare to the Fatui at least. In certain times It feels like the game wants you to take the Abyss seriously or see it as the bigger threat between them and the Fatui but they are literally just a punching bag of an evil group with no certain goals, no victories, very little presence and almost no character to serve as their faces unlike the Fatui. Like In comparison Abyss just falls so short that It is not even funny

Lets compare what Fatui have but Abyss doesn't (I am gonna use Aether as the abyss twin so mind that)

Firstly a definite solid plan: Fatui and Abyss both want to overthrow Celestia but Fatui has a certain plan to accomplish their goal which is the collection of all Gnosis meanwhile the only actual plan we saw from the Abyss that was stated that It could work against Celestia was the Mecha Osial plan which we already make it failed. Fatui knows what their plan is and they are successfully working for it but We have no such thing for the Abyss.

Secondly WINS: Abyss ALWAYS loses. Fatui also have tons of minor plans and such that we have it failed all the time and I can't take the Fatui seriously as well If a Harbinger is not present but unlike Abyss who always loses Fatui actually WINS in their main plan which is getting the Gnoses. It doesn't matter to them If we stop their minor plans that they did not even bothered to have a single Harbinger present for it. Their main plan is working so perfectly that they already have 5 out of the 7 Gnosis, the amount of Gnosis they have is literally more than double of what is left. Meanwhile Abyss never got a single win.

Thirdly War force: I do think that Abyss has a better army in terms of foot soldiers If we count Abyss lectors, Heralds and Knights as enemies that they have enough of BUT Fatui is leaded by an Archon and still has 9 (Signora and Scaramouche out) Harbinger left which top 3 of them are confirmed to be god level themselves. In comparison what does the Abyss have ? Their stronger force we had to face was DVALIN which is not even an actual member of them he was just kinda brainwashed and brainwashing him was only possible because of his battle against Durin. I don't think Abyss lectors or the knights can stand up to Harbingers so Aether (Abyss twin) is pretty much the only one they have in terms of actual incredibly strong war power and while I think that He is at least Archon level I don't think even He can win If Tsaritsa and Pierro fight him together or If even that is not enough just add Columbina to the mix and I think that has to be enough at that point which still leaves 7 Harbinger left to take on the Abyss which includes Dottore who is god level, Childe and Capitano (stronger than Childe)

Fourthly FACES to make the faction interesting: As I mentioned in the previous point a bit Abyss only have Aether and pretty much nothing else (Perhaps Enjo as well) to serve as their face of the organization. Which just makes them so generic and bland. I already mentioned that I am also not able to take the Fatui seriously If there is no Harbinger present since It would just be the same old generic enemies but at least they have them to make things interesting and serious. Meanwhile Abyss have nothing. Aether is not personally facing us in the first place so It is just NPCs and normal enemies. Enjou is the best we have from the Abyss and he is only a single person and not even a combatant

Fifthly Involvement: Fatui is EVERYWHERE. Even in terms of minor plans they have at least triple more plans they tried to execute at this point and they had been active in all 4 nations. Yes their Mondstadt involvement was low meanwhile Abyss was more active there during the archon quest but even in that one Fatui were the only ones who won meanwhile Abyss got the L and after that Abyss almost does not exist other than Dain quests meanwhile Fatui is responsible for anything and everything. At this point I am about to start to believe Fatui manipulated the Abyss too since they are literally behind everything bad that has happened in the game. Their Harbingers are 3 OF THE 7 WEEEKLY BOSS for gods sake meanwhile the only Abyss boss was Dvalin which again was not an actual part of them.

Like I just can't take the Abyss seriously when they have little presence, no faces to make them interesting, no solid plans we know of and no wins at all meanwhile Fatui has them all. Nahida's quote about some being potentially changing the fate of Aether and making him a part of Irminsul was the absolute most threatening and interesting thing we heard about them in this ENTIRE game story. I hope they can make them more interesting and threatening soon because I really have a hard time taking the Abyss as a serious threat rather than some minor enemies.

r/Genshin_Lore Mar 09 '26

Abyss THE TRUTH BEHIND GENSHIN [CHAPTER 2/2]: The reunion of the Twins. Hroptatyr's true identity + the main villain. THE NATURE OF OUR TRAVEL AND THE ORIGINAL SIN

156 Upvotes
To understand the world one must be put upside down.

This post is the continuation of:

THE TRUTH BEHIND GENSHIN [CHAPTER 1/2]: The role of the villain + THE STRUCTURE OF THE UNIVERSE

If I was to ask you who's the main villain of Genshin, what would you say?

The Abyss? The Sibling? The Sinners? maybe the Abyss Order or the Fatui? maybe Hroptatyr who we have talked about in the last post?

We will try to find the solution in this post.

Now I will reveal the 2 lies that I left hanging in the previous post, check them now or after you finish the read.

  • LIE 1: The artificial god that ¨Hroptatyr¨ is building, is the future Traveler.
  • LIE 2: There never existed someone called Hroptatyr.

Now then that the cards are on the table, let's begin remembering a fan favourite Archon Quest:

MASQUERADE OF THE GUILTY: DIVINITY AND HUMANITY

The nation of Hydro, Fontaine, has been prophetized to be destroyed.

“The people of Fontaine will be dissolved into the waters.

And only the Hydro Archon will remain, weeping on her throne”

-Fontaine's Prophecy

We arrive at Fontaine and we meet Furina, proclaimed Hydro Archon, who welcomes us to the nation.

We didn't know by that time, but she was but an actress playing to fool the gaze of the gods, so that the order imposed from above would remain untouched.

Does this sound like someone we have already talked about?

Someone who plays the role of a character so that the order which sustains the world isn't broken?

  • Hroptatyr, The Wise, is the equivalent of Furina for Genshin Impact, or better I'd say, the human who found the truth of the universe, not Hroptatyr.

Egeria had created the oceanids and these desired to become humans, so she made them human forms. However, upon the contact with the water of the Primordial Sea, they would disolve into oceanids again and lose their individuality and consciousness.

  • The Primordial Sea is the purple abyss: conflict. The start and the end of every universe.
  • Like oceanids who wanted to become human, the original sin of humanity is wanting to grow without understanding conflict (explained in [CH.1/2]). Upon the contact with conflict, the purple abyss, humanity gets corrupted/¨disolved¨.

Focalors was the next Hydro Archon who was tasked with preventing the prophecy.

  • The prophecy is the equivalent of the dying universeone day, everything shall be destroyed and every being consumed by the Abyss.

The opulent light sinks into the dark depths beneath the earth,

Seeking to redeem the radiance that is fated to be extinguished.

-The Hanged Man XII

However the prophecy was fulfilled and everything was flooded but then... the water level ended up going down again.

  • THE ROLE OF THE TRAVELERnot to avoid the death of the universe, but to write a universe anew. Creation after destruction.
  • THE ROLE OF THE VILLAINnot to avoid the death of the universe, but to buy time before the end. Destruction before creation.
  • In CHAPTER 1/2, we made a point that no matter if we win or lose at the end, the universe will end. For the conflict between ¨hero¨ and ¨villain¨ would cease and the story would lose its ¨fuel¨. The equation would destabilize and the universe, collapse.

However Fontaine's humans were ultimately forgiven by Neuvillette.

  • THE REDEMPTION: Furina's role was to buy time while Focalors gathered energy in the Oratrice for the destruction of the Hydro Archon Throne.
  • THE GOD: Then if the villain is Furina, who is Focalors? If the villain is the human, who is the god?

THE CREATOR

In the previous chapter, we taked about ¨The Creators¨, as someone who would've created the twins and set a puzzle so that the human who would find the solution would be ¨cursed to become the villain¨.

The World XXI and The Fool XXII

However if the role of the Traveler is to create a universe anew at the end of time, using our memories of the current one, wouldn't that also mean, that if the twins existed in that new universe... The Creator for them would be the future Traveler?

  • CONFLICT: In the new universe that the Traveler will create, the twins MUST exist, because without them, the new story wouldn't have conflict. It would be a blank book.

Then if the future Traveler will create the twins again... the one who created the twins in the current story... was the past Traveler.

  • THE CICLIC NATURE OF THE UNIVERSE: The universe of Genshin is a loop.
    • In previous posts, we mentioned how upon the intervention of abyss + descenders, new ¨cycles¨ appear inside the ¨microcosm¨ of Teyvat. In the universe of Genshin, this happens at a larger scale: the Abyss destroys the universe (turns it into a blank book), then the Traveler creates it again (writes a new story).

The god who creates and maintains,

The abyss that consumes and destroys.

-The Devil XV

  • Destruction + creation = rewritting: a new cycle

The Creator is the Traveler from the past, who realized how to write a story and created themselves and their twin again.

The twin's home planet which got destroyed, was but the Teyvat of the last iteration, destroyed upon the end of the last universe. That's why the Inteyvat flowers existed in the current Teyvat.

  • READER AND WRITER: We have been travelling through the different iterations of Teyvat all along, creating new versions of Teyvat at the end of every universe.

The Creator is the past Traveler, who ¨wrote a story/plan¨, like Focalors did, and created themselves again as a reader, so their journey to become a writer would sustain the universe and ultimately ¨redeem¨ humanity by writting a story for them.

Does that mean that Hroptatyr would be our human half? No.

The main villain of the story is, not Hroptatyr.

One could already guess where this is going, however, we will unveil the true identity of both Hroptatyr and that ¨main villain¨ now:

THE POWER TO DESTROY

But first, let's go back to The God's Limits trailer:

¨Unsurprisingly, all life here has been rendered unstable, tainted by the Ruler of Space¨

-Rhinedottir

If we use the theories that explain that the HP is an AI, then this means Asmoday's code has been corrupted.

¨She just switched sides? You make it sound like such a trivial affair, we are Shades, shadows of the Heavenly Principles, it's unthinkable...¨

-Ronova

Then as a direct part and shadow of the HP, there should be an imposition within her to obey it and not to side with enemies. The conclusion is clear:

  • ASMODAY: The corruption in her code is an arbitrated manipulation.
  • A NEW MASTER: For Asmoday to defy her own nature of obeying the HP, such impostition should be ¨deleted¨. Or better I'd say, ¨destroyed¨.
    • Her new master, has the power to destroy/erase reality.

The space where the shades meet becomes red.

Time, life and death were stable, space wasn't, therefore the ¨story¨ that the shades created for those humans didn't have a space to happen in and became erratic. An error in the system.

  • THE RED CUBES: The cubes are errors in the system, corrupted files, files with erased/destroyed code. In this case, the erased code was the part that defined space.
  • ¨PUTTING THE SPACE OUT OF ITS MISERY¨: What Ronova did was just deleting malfunctioning code, maintenance of the system.

We see then one of these red cubes being dissolved, and lots of other ones in outer space.

¨Abyssal energies is all that lie beyond Teyvat's borders¨

-Alice

Then if the shades define an ¨enemy¨, knowing that Asmoday is supposedly helping them and that the red cubes are results of the power of destruction, then we can affirm they are talking about the Abyss itself.

Asmoday's own power (yellow) turns red and erratic + We've seen these cubes in the domain of the Irminsul were Asmoday was not mentioned/present (central image)
  • VERY IMPORTANT: the red cubes are not Asmoday's power, but a subproduct of the power of the Abyss: destruction.
  • ¨THE WILL OF THE ABYSS¨: By definining a ¨side¨, they are aware that the Abyss has some level of consciousness.
    • Her new master has the power to destroy reality and therefore, is in control of the pure power of the Abyss.

Now who is that ¨new master¨?

HROPTATYR'S REAL IDENTITY

The sinner of reason and first of the five.

¨There were five of them: The Wise, Hroptatyr; The Visionary, Vedrfolnir; Gold, Rhinedottir; The Foul, Surtalogi; Racher of Solnari, Rerir¨

-Dainsleif

The only sinner we have't yet interacted with ingame. Unless...

He was the first of the five we ¨met¨.

A part of the lie I told was saying that he was the main villain that hoyoverse was hiding from the start:

  • Because they never hid him.
  • Because he was always right in front of us.

Let's unveil him.

  • THE BLASPHEMY AGAINST REASON: I've said that the ¨blasphemy against reason¨ is the easiest of the 5 to define.
    • If we know that reason is the power to create, then the blasphemy could be destruction.
  • Now what is the ¨blasphemy against death¨ or ¨blasphemy against life¨? or against time/space? What is the opposite of life? Death. Then Naberius would be the ¨blasphemy against death¨? Wrong*.*

What is the opposing power of space? the opposing power of time? the opposing power and death is life and viceversa right?

  • VERY IMPORTANT: the other sinners received the powers of the shades, imitations of their authorities, not opposing powers. Which in reality makes a lot of sense. Let's remember analogies:
  • KEY POINT: The purple abyss is the blank book: the reality without rules. Because it is blank, it ¨yearns¨ to be created but lacks the power to create. That is why the purple abyss imitates the craft of reason:
For the blank book to exist, it needs to imitate reason
  • THE PROBLEM: as the purple abyss is created upon the partial fusion/conflict between reason and pure red abyss, then:
    • The sinners ¨were blue¨, creations of reason, humans.
    • Upon receiving the ¨red¨ power of the Abyss, destruction, they ¨turned purple¨, became blank, and therefore their power imitated that of their paralels, the shades. They received ¨mimetic¨ powers to those of the heavens.
  • THE EXCEPTIONRhinedottir however, ¨A Flower from Another World¨was never a creation of reason and not a human like the rest, so as ¨she wasn't blue¨, she went mad and her creations, corrupted causing them to spread through Teyvat in the Cataclysm causing calamities:
Creatures after and before fusing with Naberius: stable/destruction driven
  1. PRE-NABERIUS: creatures corrupted by the red abyss, she never was a human so her powers over life were ¨red¨ and her creatures, made with Khemia and not reason, unstable abominations (Durin, Bakunawa, Elynas...), like the rifthounds whose blood is said to ¨erode (destroy - red abyss) the limits of the world¨Albedo seemed to be the exception however, made out of ¨chalk¨ and not red abyss.
  2. POST-NABERIUS: like the other sinners, her power now imitated the power of life. After fusing with Naberius, she ¨turned purple¨Something like ¨compensating¨ she was not human by acquiring the power of life from the spectrum of reason and not only from the spectrum of destruction/Abyss.

¨Nabe... no, this looks more like Rhinedottir's doing¨

¨Please don't litter other people's spaces with your bizarre creations¨ (her power is now an imitation of Naberius's, not the original one. Ronova distinguishes them)

-Ronova

¨Since devouring Naberius, it would seem she has finally found a modicum of peace.¨ (she stopped the madness)

-Albedo

Then why would Hroptatyr's power be to destroy and not to create? If the rest received imitations, why would he receive the opposing power of the HP?

If Hroptatyr's power is not an imitation, it means that his power comes from the pure red abyss like Rhinedottir's powers used to do.

Hroptatyr's gem in his chess piece being red is not a coincidence.

  • KEY POINT: if Hroptatyr was a human, his power would imitate reason, not oppose it.
  • THE PROBLEM: without someone to hold such power, a shade like Asmoday would've never switched sides. For her to do so it'd be needed to ¨destroy¨ the impostition of obeying the HP.

And why did he never went mad like Rhinedottir did? Maybe because he had always been ¨red¨.

  • HROPTATYR'S TRUE IDENTITY: Hroptatyr is The Abyss.

There never existed a human who gained the king's favour and became the Chief Royal Mage and the President of the Universitas Magistrorum.

It was The Abyss (red) taking the form of a human to lure the king and the sinners.

We have theorized before that one implication of The Devil XV card is that Hroptatyr is something like the ¨Devil¨ of Genshin:

The "Devil" is merely a mask,

Through which the power of darkness is revealed.

-The Devil XV

  • THE ABYSS IS THE ALL-KNOWING SAGEHroptatyr is the ¨encarnation¨ of the Abyssthe physical form of a force of nature.

Let's first give proof then:

PROOF 1: THRILLING TALES OF THE DRAGON SLAYERS

A lotus proceeds from my mouth and flowers bloom on the page.

My words are wise and clear and my thoughts are sharp like lightning.

I joined this party because I couldn't find a job, and anybody can be a copywriter.

But I'm no writer, just a regular fellow in his mid twenties without an honest job.

-TTDS

A story of 5 heroes who go to fight an evil dragon (Irmin), and whose stories align perfectly with Dainsleif and the other 4 sinners, then who is Hroptatyr?

  • The writer of the story, which means:
    • He's the one who decided that the king Irmin would be the evil dragon.
    • He's the one who started the story of the sinners (gave them power), by dividing himself and giving parts to each.
    • He's the one who will end the story of each sinner (retrieve his own power), by absorbing them in the future.
  • Hroptatyr is the writer of the sinners: The Abyss itself.

PROOF 2: THE BOAR PRINCESS AND WOOBAKWA

Hroptatyr's sword and Woobakwa

But one day, when he was hunting in the forest, he ran into the evil squirrel sorcerer Woobakwa!

Woobakwa despised everything nice, and swore to transform beauty into ugliness and turn light into dark.

-The Boar Princess

An evil red squirrel sorcerer who corrupts the blue pup after cursing him.

  • The blue (reason) pup is Nibelung, and the red squirrel Woobakwa is Hroptatyr, The Abyss.
  • In the original story, the pup accidentally eats Woobakwa.

But the rash pup gobbled him up, just like that, without the slightest warning.

Woobakwa was so furious that he cursed the pup using the most foul and insulting words ever uttered by a squirrel.

-The Boar Princess

Did Nibelung eat Hroptatyr? No. He ¨ate¨ The Abyss, which currently manifests as Hroptatyr.

The pup turned purple.

And as we know from [CH.1/2], turning purple, being consumed by The Abyss (blue + red) means finding the truth of the world, and for Nibelung, it meant realizing his role was to be the evil dragon.

Where there are heroes, there must be wicked mages...

....and where there are knights, there must be evil dragons.

-The Wicked's Mage Plumage

We have already explained the 5 central characters of the story:

  1. THE HERO: Traveler, who's role is to fight the wicked mage.
  2. THE KNIGHT: HP, who fights the evil dragon, wins and also gets ¨trapped¨. Like Nahida and Columbina.
  3. THE EVIL DRAGON: Nibelung, who used by the wicked mage, fights the knight and loses. Like Scaramouche and Rerir.
  4. THE PRINCESS: The Sibling, who is usually captured/used by the mage. Like Nilou with the Samsara and Sandrone with her formula.
  5. THE WICKED MAGE: The Abyss. Hroptatyr is Woobakwa. Woobakwa is the Abyss.

PROOF 3: FATE OF THE ABYSS

Fates written by the Abyss

We have already mentioned Dottore in [CH.1/2], but we have considered him a ¨segment¨ of Hroptatyr.

In reality, Dottore is more similar to Durin than to a segment, not to the new Durin, but the evil dragon who ravaged Teyvat once.

  • THE FATE OF THE ABYSS: Durin's quest talks about him overcoming the tragic fate that the first Durin had. But remember, old Durin was not a creation of reason but of Khemia which directly operates from the purple abyss.
    • If the first Durin had an already written fate, it means that the Abyss can write fates too.
  • RHINEDOTTIR'S CREATIONS: as we mentioned Rhinedottir was not a human, so their creations (and her) were driven mad by the Abyss. Each of them, a calamity with one only thought in their minds: destroy everything.

¨¨Master griped a lot about ¨The Wise¨, Hroptatyr¨ (the reason Rhinedottir hates him)

-Albedo

INTERESTING NOTE: However, since Rhinedottir accepted his power and already hated him in Kaenriah, while she's said to be ¨an alien¨, could mean that she already knew Hroptatyr was The Abyss, but willingly decided to play along to obtain power.

  • ZANDIK: For Dottore, his situation is a bit different. Zandik was most probably a human cursed with the fate of the Abyss. Something like old Durin but as he was a human and not a creation of Khemia, he was just rejected by the world but never went completely mad. A human cursed to bear a fragment of Hroptatyr inside him. This explains why:
    • People hated him since birth and named him ¨heretic¨ (Zandik).
    • He's obsessed with destroying the rules of reason and guiding humanity to enlightment.
    • He's represented upside down: inverted fool (Fatui) = The Wise*.*
    • His design represents a masked raven. Ravens were the messengers of Odin, Hroptatyr. And also he is shown with one singular red eye with the form of a red star. Red is the colour of Hroptatyr/the Abyss, and Odin had sacrificed one of his eyes.
  • ASMODAY: Interestingly, it seems like she always had the same design motifs.
    • Maybe she was always meant to be corrupted?
Red singular eye, red stars, raven motifs: Ravens of Hroptatyr

Like Rhinedottir's creations, they had fates written by the Abyss/Hroptatyr, who is also the writer of the sinners.

PROOF 4: WINTER NIGHT'S LAZZO

¨The sages think themselves to be all-knowing...¨

-Pierro

Key word here is sages in plural.

  • KEY POINTHroptatyr's name is from Odin, called the ¨Hanged God¨, and since The Hanged Man XII talks about those who realize that divine knowledge is the inverted truth, then their god is the inverted god of creation: destruction, the Abyss.

Hroptatyr might've shown himself corrupting more ¨sages/hanged men¨.

  • RAUTHVANGI: same situation as Dottore: scholar who gets expelled after becoming obsessed with destruction and, in his case, the ¨pitch-dark void¨.
    • Rauthvangi also encouraged the Belyi Tsar to ¨look for the stars beyond the skies¨ (only The Abyss exists outside Teyvat), indirectly contributing to the death of the 3rd descender.
    • VERY IMPORTANT: The importance of Rauthvangi in Hroptatyr's plans was to give the Tsaritsa a motivation to create the Fatui with Pierro.
Rauthvangi had ¨Hroptatyr's protection¨ and René got obsessed with the Abyss
  • RENÉ: a genuis who got obsessed with the Abyss and the creation of a collective hivemind for fontanians, who used Elynas remains (red abyss) to heal Jakob and who believed this power to be salvation.
    • VERY IMPORTANT: The importance of René in Hroptatyr's plans was to create the World's Formula so Sandrone would use it against Dottore and he would trap us in a simulation to complete his god.

¨My guess is that you are trying to bring Columbina back. But then, where is Sandrone

(Sandrone comes to the battle)

¨I was planning on disposing your little formula after wrapping up more urgent business here.¨

-Dottore

Dottore made a mistake.

Nobody mentions the formula... then why did he start trying to seem ¨uncertain¨ about what Sandrone was doing when he knew about it?

He could've known that she was planning something, but how did he know it was the formula specifically?

His plan had always been using the formula against us.

¨Behold the false moon's fall¨

-Heretic of the False Moon

He wanted Columbina to be seen as a true god to gather our beliefs in her.

PROOF 5: NICOLE'S WARNING

¨Beyond the moonlight's reach, an ancient shadow brandishes its claws, taking aim at the stars¨

-Nicole

Nicole is known for warning humans of hidden threats.

The current problem going on in Teyvat is Dottore and his experiments with artificial gods.

  • ¨Beyond the moonlight's reach¨ - Something outside Teyvat
  • ¨An ancient shadow brandishes its hunting claws¨ - An ancient being:

¨Of all the beings in the ancient world, none were more evil than Woobakwa — not even demons and dragons.¨

-The Boar Princess

  • ¨Taking aim at the stars¨ - someone whose goal is to destroy order/reason

In previous posts, I said that it could refer to Hroptatyr..

But if he was a kaenriahn human, he wouldn't be an ¨ancient being¨.

  • Hroptatyr was always outside Teyvat. ¨Beyond the moonlight's reach¨
  • Hroptatyr always existed. Fits better for Nicole, an angel, to consider him an ¨ancient being¨.
  • She was talking about the Abyss itself. This message is proof that the crisis in the frontiers was a deliberate action of the ¨Will of the Abyss¨.
Variables are blank spaces in the story: all that could be but never was.

The Hexenzirkel leaves it clear that it was an unexpected situation and not the typical abyssal intrusion, and Alice says that Dottore was able to introduce ¨variables¨, the result of the power of destruction.

NOTE: stacking them can ¨change things¨. That is how the Abyss writes fates.

Dottore using the power to erase? An spontaneous mass scale abyssal intrusion? Nicole's message was a warning:

¨The Will of the Abyss is moving again¨

PROOF 6: HROPTATYR'S GOAL TO ENTER THE ABYSS

  • VERY IMPORTANT: In Rerir's flashback, the motivations of the sinners to enter the Abyss are stated.
¨... we all have our reasons¨

Let's relate them to each sinner using the characters of TTDS:

  1. HATRED ¨For vengeance, the deadeye marksman¨Surtalogi's weapon of choice is the bow. Haden, his master, was said to be abusive and corrupt. Son of prisoners and sentenced to death.
  2. GRIEFRerir had just lost Tholindis and believed he needed power to save her.
  3. DESPAIRVedrfolnir always knew about the ¨end of time¨.
  4. DESIRE ¨for research, the knowledgeable sorceress¨RhinedottirWe supposed earlier that she knew who Hroptatyr was but decided to play along to obtain the power of the Abyss. She one day would become the Shade of Life too.

Four motivations to enter the Abyss.

We can form an incredibly strong implication then:

  • One of the five never entered the Abyss. He WAS the Abyss.
  • NOTE: The definitive proof that Hroptatyr is the Abyss will be shown later.

However, if Hroptatyr is the Abyss, and the Abyss is just a force of nature, it would mean that such force is lead by a ¨consciousness¨ who decided to create the ¨mask¨ of Hroptatyr.

  • IMPORTANT*: Hroptatyr/the Abyss is the virus that the ship brought*

Then who is the human who solved the equation?

Who is the ¨Will of the Abyss¨?

WHO SOLVED THE EQUATION?

Would you believe me if I told you that they were the first human to appear in the story?

A cursed human to bear inside them the power of destruction

  • Like Furina, that human is the first character we meet at the introduction.

At the end of my journey, I arrived at a place known as "The Sea of Flowers at the End."
You told me... You wanted to find a place in the universe where that one flower was in full bloom.
To have a place like that suddenly appear before me…
Well, would you think of that as a coincidence?

-Sibling

  • THE FURINA OF GENSHIN: the human who realized they had to become the villain, fulfill the right side of destruction, was our Sibling.
  • ¨THE SEA OF FLOWERS AT THE END¨: When our sibling found the Inteyvat flowers, they realized that us, the Traveler, created that place for them (¨A Space and Time For You¨).

The first human to discover this truth, this equation, and how to stabilize it, was not a kaenriahn named Hroptatyr, but the human half of a Traveler god.

Our sibling.

"One star rises in the heavens, one star falls in the valley, the two have always been the same."

-The Fool XXII Lunar Arcanum

¨All along...it's only ever been about us¨: humanity and divinity

¨But in my eyes, Furina's humanity is what made her perfect, the human I always wanted to be¨

¨Anyways, so then I cursed her¨

-Focalors

  • VERY IMPORTANT: The Creator, the past Traveler, ¨cursed¨ our sibling, our human half, to bear the Abyss within them and ¨wrote¨ them to be the villain.

Let's contrast this with norse mythology:

  • Starkaðr (from Starkuthr, Hroptatyr's weapon) was a mortal hero who was blessed and cursed at the same time, our Sibling:
    • Odin blessed Starkaðr to live an abnormally long lifespan and to gain the favour of nobles and kings.
      • Odin is the Abyss, which took the form of Hroptatyr to encourage the king to use the abyssal energy, and which was the reason why the Sibling was named the succesor of Irmin.
    • Thor cursed Starkaðr to commit atrocities in his long lifespan.
      • Thor, the one who cursed the Sibling, was the past Traveler, who understood that for a story to happen there should be villains and heroes, so we did the same Focalors did for Furina, but with our Sibling.
  • Hroptatyr is Odin. Odin ¨created¨ Thor. So then if Thor is the past Traveler, this means that for us to become The Creator in the future, we have to accept the Abyss, which perfectly aligns with the notion that Odin showed humans how to write, as we said in [CH.1/2].

Remember this quote?

The "Devil" is merely a mask,
Through which the power of darkness is revealed

-The Devil XV

  • VERY IMPORTANT: Now its meaning is complete.
    1. The Devil is Hroptatyr, a mask of the Abyss
    2. The Devil is the Abyss, a mask of our Sibling, the Will of the Abyss
    3. The Devil is our Sibling, a mask that reveals us the ¨power of darkness¨ to write a new story

WHAT HAPPENED IN KAENRIAH?

The first time that the ship flew over Teyvat, it left the HP for it to terraform and prepare the world for us, and also our sibling, so one day they would awaken in an ¨upside down¨ kingdom.

Our sibling found the equation that sustained the world: conflict.

Genshin has already showed us such equation, just... in a bit of a twisted way.

Destruction (serpent) and creation (pearl) two sides of an equation. The pearl being corrupted represents the dying universe.

The red stars are symbolism of the Abyss' gaze.

Odin sacrificed his right eye, specifically.

  • With his right eye he would see the ¨truth of the universe¨, the book without a written story in it: purple
  • And his left eye would stay the same: red

Like the eyes of the serpent.

DEFINITIVE PROOF: The serpent is Hroptatyr/ODIN, The Abyss.

¨The first crowned heir started her journey to find the genesis pearl... but she was deceived, and the origin of her noble origins faded away¨

-BP Cinematic

A lie.

Our sibling never found a serpent, nor a wicked mage. They accepted their role in the story.

The opulent light(our sibling) sinks into the dark depths beneath the earth,
Seeking to redeem the radiance that is fated to be extinguished.

-The Hanged Man XII

Just like Furina was acting, the act the Sibling is performing is convincing everyone that there is a wicked mage behind everything.

The First Crowned Heir, the Abyss, and the Sinner of Reason, had always been the same

The serpent who arbitrated the original sin, Hroptatyr, The Abyss... had always been there.

When the Sibling finished their journey, they realized their role and created a ¨mask¨ like Furina did.

  • ¨WHERE THERE ARE HEROES, THERE MUST BE WICKED MAGES¨: The character of the princess does not exist in the formula. If the Traveler is the hero, then our sibling should be... the wicked mage.
    • The Abyss taking the form of Hroptatyr, a wicked mage, and acting as a main antagonist is the perfect ¨mask¨ to hide the princess and start conflict in the story.

Hroptatyr is the illusion, the mask, that there is a mage behind everything, controlling our sibling and using them for his goals.

The wicked mage is but a ¨humble servant¨ of the princess. The Abyss/Hroptatyr serves the Sibling

The Abyss is not a wicked mage but the power of the princess.

  • THE SEPARATION: Hroptatyr, as the head of the Universitas, lead the investigation of abyssal energy, corrupted Irmin and conviced him that he had ¨summoned¨ our Sibling in Kaenriah, when they were always there.
    • Asmoday and our sibling were ¨acting¨. Our separation would start the story.
  • THE POWER OF OUR SIBLING: Kaenriahns never made our Sibling store abyssal energy, it was always inside them.
  • ¨THE POWER TO CREATE TRASCENDANT SINNERS¨Hroptatyr just divided himself, the full power of The Abyss, and gave it to the sinners:
    • The combined power of the 5, the original power that our Sibling held, is the full power of The Abyss and the power to destroy everything.

¨... divided among themselves a power that could destroy the world¨

-Dainsleif

INTERESTING NOTE: Dainsleif implies that he knows our sibling to be doing their part in the plan of the past Traveler, and yet he decides to feed into the illusion:

¨Do you believe your sibling t**o have betrayed you?**¨

-Dainsleif

¨Defeat me, command me to step aside, show me you are worthier than I to rescue her¨

Dainsleif is the knight inside the story of Kaenriah, Irmin, the evil dragon.

Then if we, the hero, are worthier than him to rescue our sibling, he could be implying that the one who captured them is the wicked mage, Hroptatyr.

But our sibling had never been captured.

We will defy this world with a power from beyond

-Dainsleif

It's possible that Dainsleif understood the role of our sibling after the Cataclysm.

THE AGE OF ENLIGHTMENT

To reach the ¨Age of Enlightment¨, three steps must be walked.

THE FIRST STEP

  • THE FIRST FOOL: Our sibling ends their journey and realizes the truth. The Fool XXII is both the card of the Traveler and the Sibling. To understand the truth, one must be inverted.
    • Our Sibling was the first inverted fool, The Wise.

THE SECOND STEP

  • REWRITE THE WORLD: we have been building up this step for years now:
    • TO DESTROY, The Fatui: their relevance in the plans of our sibling is the* burning of the Irminsul.
    • TO CREATE, The Abyss Order*: they are the ones tasked with, using the Loom of Fate,* rewrite a new Teyvat after the Irminsul burns, one were the current inverted world is upside down. Were New Kaenriah is Teyvat.
Destroy the Old World and create the New World = A NEW NOT-INVERTED TEYVAT: KAENRIAH

THE THIRD STEP

THE WRITER: let's now translate the ingredients to create ¨Hroptatyr's¨ god:

  • ABYSSretrieving the full power of the Sibling:
    • Rerir: in norse mythology, Rerir dies of an illness after praying to Odin (Hroptatyr absorbing him).
    • Surtalogi: ¨Gusisnautar¨, name of his weapon, references the story of a hero fated to be killed by his own horse. He kills his horse, but he trips on its skull and dies by a serpent (Hroptatyr absorbing him after our battle against him).
    • Rhinedottirher case is different, the ¨rhinemaidens¨ survive the Ragnarok.
      • SPECULATION: the perfect lifeform she's trying to create is herself for the next cycle, therefore she would be an ¨alien¨ who comes from the Teyvat of the last iteration. Maybe that is why ¨A Flower from Another World¨ is her title, and why Khemia is ¨external¨ to reason when in theory, the whole universe should've been created by reason.
      • Maybe she understands the cycles of the universe and willingly gives away her own power after creating herself again.
    • Vedrfolnir/Hroptatyr: at disposition.
  • BODYnot a forced fusion between Hroptatyr and the Sibling, but the Sibling getting back the full power of The Abyss.
  • FAITH: the faith on the New Kaenriahns on the purple abyss.
  • REASON: we have previously talked about fusing with the HP, but they only have the power to write inside the ¨microcosm¨, not the ¨universe¨. The last step will be our sibling giving us the power of the Abyss so we can ascend, not them.

But for us to ascend we will have to see the truth, see through the masks so we will accept the power of the Abyss.

  • DEATH OF THE MASK*: Hroptatyr/Odin dies in Ragnarok killed by Fenrir.*

Vedrfolnir's weapon name is Gleipnir, the name of the chains which held Fenrir. So then Vedrfolnir could be the responsible of ¨indirectly¨ killing Hroptatyr. And how do you kill a mask?

By showing us the truth.

In the final battle, Ragnarok, the Traveler will start fighting who we will believe to be ascended Hroptatyr, and during the battle, we will realize that our sibling was the one in control.

Vedrfolnir has already shown us the truth.

  • VEDRFOLNIR'S MESSAGE: was never future Vedrfolnir talking to his past self, neither him talking to Clothar/humans.* It will be what our sibling will say to us at the end of time:

¨Oh, dear creature, why do you bow down? For fear of the unknown? Or for a power that you covet?

  • Oh, dear sibling, why do you bown down? For fear of the Abyss? Or for a power that you covet?

Oh, dear creature, why do you bow down? For I am no god... I am but a sinner

  • Oh dear sibling, why do you bow down? For I am no god, I am but a human.

You are like a flower born in sin yet pure, spotless... I know your fate well

  • You are like a human yet pure, spotless (a god)... I know your role in fate well.

You need no longer hold back your resentment, nor accept the countless lies.

  • You need no longer to hold back your resentment (in our sibling)nor accept the countless lies (see through the mask of Hroptatyr/The Abyss)

Go forth, become a trascendent one, rise beyond the fate bestowed upon you...

  • Trascend your fate as the ¨hero¨ and become the ¨writer¨.

And I shall shed a tear, at the end of time... as I gaze back upon your life

  • And I shall shed a tear, at the end of the universe... as I gaze back upon your memories.

For us to create the new universe we will have to ¨gaze back upon our life¨**. (¨Memory is Design¨)**

  • THE LAST FOOL*: the Traveler will become The Wise.*

Our sibling will most likely sacrifice/get erased too as they're a human, for them to give us back the power to destroy and to ultimately judge humanity.

JUDGEMENT: THE PRIMORDIAL GOD

Judgment XX
  • The ¨eternal calamity¨ remains unchanged: the Abyss exists again.
  • Only our names remain: names have meaning and carry fates because there already existed characters who carried such names in the past iterations.
  • ¨Humanity comes back from the ¨nether realm¨, to see what form this new illusory world displays.¨Humanity is carried on to the next universe
THE START: the twins are born inside the ¨nether realm¨, carrying with them the characters of the past universe
  • ¨A FLOWER BORN IN SIN¨: the sea of Inteyvat flowers are humanity/characters. Each flower, a character. For humanity, the ¨nether realm¨, the ¨Sea of Flowers at the End¨, would be perceived as the ¨pitch-dark void¨, as only the writer can perceive what happens when the story ends.
    • The pitch-dark void is perceived as ¨paradise¨ for it is the instance when conflict stops

A lotus proceeds from my mouth and flowers bloom on the page.

-TTDS: Hroptatyr's part

"See, my child. All that lies under the throne of heaven shall be destroyed by upheaval. The eternal peace of the pitch-dark void shall embrace us all."

-Deathly Statuette (dropped by black serpent knights)

  • ¨THE DEATH OF THE AUTHOR¨: And when the story ends and the Traveler becomes the new writer, the old writer, the past Traveler, will die. Like Focalors did.

Upon the power of interpretation, the old writer ¨dies¨ and becomes a reader of the new story.

  • The past Traveler is Focalors, who will die once we become the new writer.
  • The future Traveler is Neuvillette, who will redeem the arrogation of humanity by ending the story and creating a new one.

For the next cycle, the future Traveler of this current iteration will be the past Traveler, and we will die once the new story is finished.

Something like Neuvillette turning into the Focalors of the next universe.

Like Focalors giving Neuvillette back the Hydro Authority: us becoming the writer.

¨You will see much in the human world, from the delightful to the depressing, and one day, when you have dwelt among humanity long enough, you will be placed to bring judgement over all, as the spokesperson for Fontaine's past ¨

-Focalors to Neuvillette

THE END: People of Fontaine (humanity), your sins are forgiven.

The story ends:

¨And humanity didn't disolve upon the flood of the Abyss.¨

But mortal arrogation never stops (humans always keep on growing)

-Dainsleif

A new story starts. A new redemption.

The reunion of the twins marks the end and the start of a new iteration.

Creation and destruction, god and human.

Human creates god and god creates human.

The story of two twins playing to be the hero and the villain.

Their reunion is The Writer.

The Writer is the Primordial God of any story.

Primordial God is Genshin.

Therefore:

Genshin Impact.

r/Genshin_Lore 6d ago

Abyss Mc's ability to absorb the abyss explaination theory

26 Upvotes

I think that i might discover why/ how the Mc can absorb/Purify the abyss.

So frist of all we know by Alice that the abyss is created by all the fate that will not pass to happen and i think it means that when a fate is not choose or know they're nott gonna be chosen they turn into hatred who turned into abyss. And we also know that Hp's have build a predetermined fate to Teyvat and there's go my theory.

The Traveler being a descender means that he's not contrain by the rules of Teyat, neither to their fate. So they're able to change the world fate and by that making a fate that will not pass to happen... Happen. So i think that when they purify the abyss they created the possiblility of those fate who became abyss may happen.

Because all the fates that are not the predetermined one are supposed to never happen. But the only existence of Traveler give a hope to those fate who were thinking that they weren't gonna be chosen and so their hope erased their hatred thus transfom the abyss to another form.

Don't know if it clear written there but this is clear in my head. But i may be wrong so correct le if you disagree and ot will be helpful to get your argument.

Anyway have a Great day!

r/Genshin_Lore Apr 07 '26

Abyss A singular line from The World XXI spoils THE WHOLE STORY [CHAPTER 1/3 + TL;DR]: Abyss, memory and universe. The cycles of the cosmos and the role of the Traveler.

76 Upvotes
¨The Heavenly Principles¨

¨Following all that is remembered¨

-The World XXI

If I told you that the Heavenly Principles is not the Primordial One, but the Primordial One is the Heavenly Principles... would you believe me?

If I told you that the HP in reality is the God of the Abyss... would you believe me?

If I told you that we can accurately predict the narrative of the game and explain the nature of the universe... would you believe me?

If I said...

Abyss is divine! Only destruction will lead us to paradise!

You'd probably believe of me to be a madman. However, after finishing reading these posts, one will understand the logic behind these claims.

Here are the post themselves (to be linked soon):

NOTE: there was a mistake in the tittle, there are 4 posts in these theories :P

NOTE: the combined lenght of the 4 chapters should be above 120k characters, so I recommend reading the TL;DR first*. CH.2 and 3 are specially longer than the others, and personally, I could go on for maybe 3 more chapters just giving proof, but that would be excessive.*

¨Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence¨

I'll do my best to make it an ¨entertaining and easy to understand¨ read.

TL;DR (CHAPTER BY CHAPTER)

NOTE: chapters 1 and 2 are similar to theories I already posted but reformulated as a ¨finalized theory¨. Chapters 3 and 4, specially 3, are the ones who set the greatest conclusions of the theory.

Understand the 4, and you will understand Genshin.

CH.1

  • The Abyss exists in two forms:
    • RED Abyss: force of destruction. FORCE
    • PURPLE Abyss: undefined dimension. RESULT of the red Abyss ¨destroying¨ creation of reason (BLUE)
  • The red Abyss mostly acts naturally as a force of decay of the universe. If we see the universe as a book, it would be the ¨force that moves pages forward¨.
    • THE FORCE THAT MOVES TIME FORWARD
    • THE FORCE THAT TURNS PRESENT INTO PAST: The ¨past¨ manifesting in the present is the ¨purple Abyss¨, the undefined dimension of the past manifesting through unorganized memories.
  • Once the whole book is ¨passed by¨/the story(universe) ends, the Traveler will rebuild it using their memories (as a ¨reader¨), creating a cosmic loop of creation and destruction.
    • Red Abyss ends each universe/story, then the Traveler builds a new universe/writes a new story.
  • Teyvat was modeled by the Primordial One following the memories of the past Traveler/creator of the current universe.
    • ¨Following all that is remembered¨
  • WE CAN USE ARCHON QUESTS TO PREDICT THE FUTURE, since they are built upon memories of the last universe.

CH.2

  • Without destruction, the force that moves time forward, causality wouldn't exist, then fate wouldn't exist, and then the universe wouldn't exist.
    • By ¨moving the universe to its end¨, red Abyss ironically sustains it.
  • Hroptatyr, Sinner of Reason, is not a human, but the physical manifestation of the red Abyss
  • FONTAINE'S AQ: the Sibling is the human-half of the past Traveler, who was left in Teyvat with the PO the first time the ship passed by. They awakened in Kaenriah and assumed their role to ¨act¨, as a villain.
    • They had always had the full power of the red Abyss within them.
    • They created Hroptatyr so the universe would think that destruction is a villain who hates creation. Imagine them as Fischl and Oz. Hroptatyr is the Abyss, the Sibling is the Will of the Abyss.
    • GOALS OF EACH:
      • HROPTATYR: destroy the universe to unleash unlimited knowledge
      • SIBLING: end the story to show us the truth
      • Same goal, phrased differently.
  • SUMERU'S AQ: Their plan is to make the Traveler ascend to the new Creator God to replace the old Traveler. Shouko no Kami set the ingredients for such coronation.
    • FAITH: rewrite Kaenriah for their faith in the Abyss (Irminsul burn/Fatui + New tree/Abyss order)
    • BODY: fusion of the twins
    • REASON: Traveler
    • ABYSS/DESTRUCTION: Sibling's full power = combined power of the sinners, gathered by Hroptatyr in the future.
  • We will believe that Hroptatyr is trying to ascend himself and manipulating the Sibling to destroy the universe, just to realize the Sibling was in control.
  • Vedrfolnir's message is what they will tell us when we realize.

CH.3 (THE MOST IMPORTANT)

  • INAZUMA'S AQ: The Primordial One let a heartless version of them to rule Teyvat while their heart is separated in the form of Paimon.
  • Following's Wagners Opera, ¨Der ring des nibelungen¨, one has either dominion or heart.
    • ¨The contract to end all contracts¨ is the plan of Zhongli to help burn the Irminsul so then the PO wouldn't be the ¨ruler¨ anymore and lose dominion, and Paimon/their heart, would return to them, making the PO our ally.
    • A contract is an imposition, ending them, means liberating Teyvat from having a writer: giving freedom to the world.
  • IN THE FINAL BATTLE: ascended Hroptatyr will pierce the PO's heart, we will eat it (Paimon), as ¨emergency food¨, to fuse with the PO (like Rhine and Naberius), and defeat him, just to realize the Sibling was ¨hiding¨ inside him.
  • THE DELIVERER: fusing with the PO will connect the Traveler to the ¨Irminsul of the Universe¨, and awaken in them the memories of the past Travelers.
    • The Traveler will accept the Sibling and the god will be created.
  • THE HEAVENLY PRINCIPLES is the Holy Trinity, union of the twins and the PO.
    • One to create*: the past Traveler/Father, who created the universe and sent the Son and the Holy Spirit to fulfill their plan.*
    • One to destroy*: the Sibling/Son, who's role is to guide the current Traveler to the end of the story so they can build a new universe/PARADISE*
    • One to remember*: the Holy Spirit/PO, who creates Teyvat for the Traveler to explore as a ¨narration¨ of the universe*
    • THE HP IS THE GOD OF THE ¨PURPLE¨ ABYSS
  • Why Jesus is the one who destroys? because ¨destruction¨ is a wrong term, it should be ¨evolution¨:
  • THE FORCE THAT MOVES TIME FORWARD
    • Imagine the universe as a human, this force will eventually kill the human, but such force never decided that the human should die*.*
    • The lie is thinking the red Abyss/destruction wants to ¨assassinate¨ the universe, when in reality, it's just trying to make the Traveler understand their role, before the universe ¨dies of natural causes¨, but the Traveler must only find the truth at the end of the story.
    • NOTE: Odin (Hroptatyr is one of his names, and he's the red Abyss), had the role of preparing himself and humans for the Ragnarok. He was never the one who decided the Ragnarok would happen. And Hroptatyr and the Sibling are two halfs of the same being.
    • But life bound to end doesn't mean it isn't worth living. Moving time forward is what allows humans to grow.
    • Destruction loves creation.
  • THE FATE PARADOX: The Traveler reaches the end of the story, connects with the universe after fusing with the PO in the last battle, and creates a fate that the universe ¨desired¨, by ¨hearing the hopes¨ of creation. By doing so, the next universe will be the paradise of the current one, but the next universe itself will live under an imposed fate.
    • THE FATE OF EACH UNIVERSE IS BOTH THEIR PRISON AND THE PARADISE OF THE LAST UNIVERSE
    • Destruction is meant to ¨make the story advance¨ towards its end, so when the end inevitably comes, the Traveler will dream a paradise.
    • And the cycle repeats.
  • NATLAN/LIYUE'S AQ: the old HP (usually represented as an evil water beast/dragon: Gosoythoth/Osial) is defeated and the new HP (Capitano/Zhongli) abandons their former self and merges with their creation (Zhongli living as a mortal) or with the system that flows through creation (Capitano/Leylines)
    • Analogy of the Traveler merging with the Irminsul of the Universe after creating a new cycle.
  • SNEZNHAYA: and the old world burns away to lead way for paradise (the end of this AQ will lead to New Kaenriah/new Irminsul)

CH.4

  • Fischl and Oz represent the Sibling and Hroptatyr, he is the Sibling's ¨abyssal construct¨.
  • Rhinedottir represents ¨imagination¨ and the ultimate lifeform that she's creating is the Traveler.
    • For each cycle, the Traveler ascends to the HP, then their divinity (Father) merges with the universe, their human-half (Sibling/Son) bears the red Abyss and guides humanity to the next universe, and their heart (Holy Spirit/PO) models Teyvat to ¨narrate¨ the last universe to the new Traveler.
  • The new Traveler meant to replace them, is the magnum opus of the Rhinedottir of the previous universe.
  • The current Traveler was created by the last Rhinedottir.
    • A being that grows large enought to transmutate the universe itself: the reader.
    • IMAGINATION (Rhine) creates READER (Traveler)
    • The Traveler is a serpent (Demiurge/Jormungandr) who after walking the 7 steps of Teyvat, becomes a dragon that gives birth to the universe and becomes the ¨anima mundi¨
    • She's the mother of the twins
  • Every universe is created upon memory of the last, but the first one, was created by Alice and the Hexenzirkel who now live inside the simulated universe they created exploring their ¨Wonderland¨, of a ¨book that writes itself/Genshin's universe¨.
  • EXTRA THOUGHTS (with proof at the end of the theories):
    • With the new Irminsul for New Kaenriah, Nibelung will possibly be reincarnated
    • The Fatui Wheel represents Jesus (12 o'clock symbol is Hroptatyr's crown: him and the Sibling represent the Son/Jesus) and 11/12 apostles in The Last Supper.
      • The Traveler is the 12th.
      • Dottore is St. John the Apostle, the closest apostle to Jesus, and the only one who truly understood him.
    • Asmoday was never corrupted, her role was just different that the other shades.
    • Asmoday and Hroptatyr will be present during Surtalogi's invasion of Teyvat, the fight will be a 3 way clash between Hroptatyr/Asmoday, Surtalogi and Traveler/Skirk/Primordial One + more.

Now into the post itself.

ABYSS, UNIVERSE AND ¨MEMORY¨

We have to understand first how the universe of Genshin works, so let's analyze two lunar arcanums:

The Hanged Man XII and The Devil XV
  • THE HANGED MAN XII: talks about those who understand the truth of the universe by ¨inverting¨ their view.
    • NOTE: Of course, these theories as a whole have the final purpose of making the reader a ¨hanged man¨, inverting their view.
  • THE DEVIL XV: is already written under such perspective, since the god of creation is considered the Devil who hides the truth of the world.

Then as they understand how the universe works, it would be logic to assume they are right when they say that the Abyss is the destructive force against creation.

  • KEY WORD: here is ¨force¨

In next chapters we will come back to these cards, but for now, we only need that conclusion.

We will use a CRUCIAL series of analogies to explain Genshin's universe now:

¨Colours out of Space¨

There are two forces of nature in constant clash:

  • Reason (blue): the force that creates, the ¨the writting pen¨.
  • Abyss (red): the force that destroys, be ¨the eraser¨.

But there is something more. Reason needs a canvas to create. A book for a story to be written in.

  • The craft of the writting pen is the written story. Therefore it's implicit to reason that a blank book ever existed.
  • The craft of the eraser is the blank book. Therefore it's implicit to Abyss that there is a story to erase.

When the eraser meets the written story, it unveils the blank book by destroying what was written.

The ¨physical perception¨of the blank book is what we will call the ¨purple Abyss¨, the ¨undefined dimension where reality blurs¨ that Genshin usually just calls, the Abyss:

IMPORTANT NOTE: there is an ¨intermediate¨ step between the ¨fusion¨ of red abyss and reason, before ¨creating¨ purple abyss, which involves memory. We will explain this soon in this chapter.

  • PURPLE ABYSS: is not destruction nor creation but the ¨true¨ world. The fusion of pure red abyss and reason.
    • Everything that could've been but never was. The unlimited and undefined world of never-chosen posibilities.
  • VERY IMPORTANTAbyss needs to destroy reason to reveal purple abyss, and reason needs purple abyss to create.

This is why the PO (Primordial One) never tried to purify/absorb Gosoythoth nor the purple abyss beneath Teyvat, because they needed it like ¨fuel¨ to write Teyvat.

Reason writes from purple abyss, red abyss destroys reason and unveils the ¨blank book¨

The red (pure) abyss is destruction.

The purple (mixture) abyss is the ¨physical perception¨ of nothingness.

How is nothingness perceived?

  • THE MIMETIC NATURE OF THE PURPLE ABYSS: purple abyss lacks the power to create. For it to exist and be perceived inside our reality, it needs to imitate creation.
For ¨nothingness¨ to be ¨something¨ imitation is recquired.

¨His hair was brown, and hers was black¨ - Is a written story

Let's ¨erase¨ it partially, using red abyss.

¨His hair was brown, and hers was black¨

A blank space appears.

¨His hair was (black), and hers was black¨

For that blank space to ¨exist¨, it imitates the written story.

IMPORTANT NOTE: Memory plays a vital role here, explained soon.

The purple abyss, as it doesn't exist, ¨yearns¨ to be created, and acts as a force that ¨envies¨ creation.

  • PURPLE ABYSS CREATURES: Its monsters desire to exist, not to destroy. They attack creation out of instinct to replace, but not because it is within their nature to destroy.
When purple abyss monsters are left alone, they don't seek to destroy, but to replace

THE PURE ABYSS: DESTRUCTION

Not the purple dimension, but the destructive force against reality. The red abyss, represents the ¨eraser¨.

¨Abyssal energies are all that lie beyond Teyvat's border¨

-Alice

  • COLOURS ¨OUT OF SPACE¨The pure red abyss exists outside the frontiers. ¨The Abyss¨, doesn't come from beneath Teyvat, but from outer space.
    • The Abyss beneath Teyvat is generally implied to exist thanks to Nibelung bringing it (from outer space) in his return to Teyvat.

Inside Teyvat, the Abyss manifests as purple as it has already ¨fused¨ with (blue) reason.

Outside Teyvat, it stays in its primitive form, red.

The pure red abyss lies in outer space
  • RHINEDOTTIR'S CREATURES: were made using Khemia, not reason, so as they were ¨never blue¨, they ¨turned red, not purple¨ and went corrupted.

In fact, it's mostly thanks to her monsters that we can see the red abyss inside Teyvat, without it turning purple.

  • ALIEN BLOOD MUTATIONS: her creatures are considered to have mutated and to carry alien blood, for they were vessels of red abyss that hadn't fused with reason, and such force should only exist in outer space.
    • The red abyss is an ¨alien power¨, from ¨beyond this world¨.
Chunk of Aerosiderite

Khemia directly operates from the purple abyss.

  • RED ABYSS CREATURES: unlike the purple abyss monsters who are peaceful if left alone and just try to exist as an act of replacement, the red abyss monsters directly try to destroy everything they can.
Destruction driven calamities

Her creatures inherited a part of the pure red abyss powers:

  • RIFTHOUNDS: said to be capable of ¨eroding the world's limits¨ (ingame corrosion effect): power of destruction.
  • DURINwhat the new Durin did while trying to help the hyperborean in the Luna III quest, was, using his power over destruction inherited from the old Durin, destroying possible scenarios for him.
    • The death of the hyperborean was already written down, so as Durin didn't have the power to write a new fate for him, his death was unmovable.

And since we have mentioned a conscient abyssal power user, let's make a CRUCIAL distinction here:

  • THE POWER OF THE ABYSS: that characters like Skirk, Surtalogi, or Dainsleif use takes different colours depending on the user, but esentially, they are using the ¨red¨ power of destruction.
    • It manifests inside the spectrum of red, and usually takes light purple/violet colorations, as the ¨red¨ Abyss fuses with the ¨blue¨ users, who were created by reason.
    • THE PURPLE ABYSS IS A RESULT, NOT A FORCE
    • RED ABYSS/DESTRUCTION IS THE FORCE
¨A power from beyond¨: different concentrations of red

These powers are called ¨power from beyond¨ because, indeed, the red Abyss comes from beyond the world.

  • VERY IMPORTANT: However, this force, while it can be used by conscient individuals, mostly acts naturally against the universe as a force of decay.

Let's talk about the ¨natural¨ effect of the Abyss.

THE UNIVERSE'S DEATH

The Abyss that consumes and destroys...

¨The entire cosmos is going to die soon. Things peaked but not long ago, and are about to go south very fast.¨

-Octavia; The Little Witch and the Undying Flame

¨And I shall shed a tear at the end of time... as I gaze back upon your life¨

-Vedrfolnir, The Visionary

  • GENSHIN'S UNIVERSE: can be seen as a story, the universe dying would be the story coming to its end.
  • SKIRK'S RACE: was exterminated by an unnamed army as a meassure of containment.

They were able to adapt to the destruction of the Abyss, so they ¨became purple¨ and could potentially use (though they didn't) that ¨power from beyond¨.

That would imply using the power of destruction, and therefore speeding up the death of the universe. Their extermination was a desperate countermeassure to delay the end of the story.

Teyvat also originates as a ¨countermeassure¨.

TEYVAT, THE MICROCOSM

Teyvat orbits a black hole

The first customer was a deity who had been drifting around since her home planet was destroyed.
[...]
This deity was actually an artificial intelligence, created by the intelligent species of the planet to optimize resource allocation on a planetary level.

-Wings of Delicacies

The AI of the twin's ship (Primordial One) wondered through the cosmos until it found an ideal planet, one that was located in the orbit of a black hole, so it could start terraforming it and weaving the fate of the planet that once belonged to dragons.

  • ORBITSPlanets can orbit one as long as they don't go into the horizon of no return.

Upon a the mass of a singularity, time gets deformed and relativity starts to alter the perception of causality and the passing of events.

  • KEY POINT: For a close observer to the black hole, everything passes incredibly fast outside.
  • SUPER IMPORTANT: while the rest of the universe will perceive its birth and its death in thousands of millions of years**, Teyvat will experiment the whole universe be born and die in way less time.**

Teyvat acts like an extremely temporally compact ¨microcosmos¨. In the present, the end of the universe is close. Why would the PO choose a planet that would ¨live¨ less than the rest of the universe? This question will be answered later on in this chapter.

And upon the deformation of time, what rules the sctructure of creation is not moments nor time as they are perceived differently for observers the closer they are to a black hole.

  • It's information.

Let's talk about the relation of time and information now, with a character that is aware of the end of the universe.

TIME AND INFORMATION

The Visionary

Vedrfolnir knows that time itself will cease to exist.

¨And I shall shed a tear at the end of time...¨

-Vedrfolnir

Let's expand analogies:

  • Reason: ¨writting pen¨
  • Red Abyss: ¨eraser¨
  • Purple Abyss: physical perception of the ¨blank space¨.
  • THE IRMINSUL: is the written book (OF TEYVAT). It acts like a server that gathers information. Every page exists simultaneously, but they only make sense read in order. Each instant of time (page/moment) exists simultaneously, but they are perceived in order.
    • CAUSALITY: The next event to the current will be its consequences and the previous, its causes.
    • FATE: is the written story. Causality determines the order of the pages, and builds fate.

Vedrfolnir would be able to see the ¨last page of the book¨.

  • THE FATE OF THE UNIVERSE: However, the last page of the Irminsul would be the end of Teyvat, not of the universe. And Teyvat is not ¨dying¨ per se. If Vedrfolnir can see the ¨end of time¨, it is because there is a written book to read, but for the universe.
    • An Irminsul/fate, for the cosmos.
  • VERY IMPORTANT: Teyvat acts like a microcosm separated from the universe.

¨However, Phanes, the Primordial One, used the eggshell to separate the "universe" and the "microcosm¨ of the world.¨

-Before the Sun and Moon

¨Teyvat has its own laws¨ means that Teyvat acts like a mini system of fate and written story inside the greater fate of the universe.

  • TRASCENDENT ONES: the sinners, the Traveler, the PO, Nibelung and much more, are not tied to the fate of the microcosm but to the fate of the universe, they are ¨trascendental beings¨.
    • Characters of the ¨universe¨.

We have already defined the red abyss to be the force that is corroding the entire universe, and if Skirk manifests purple abyss powers, it means that when the red abyss ¨fused with her¨, she was ¨blue¨, a creation of reason.

The universe was built using reason.

The god who creates and maintains,
The abyss that consumes and destroys.

-The Devil XV

One could believe that this line refers to the PO, but the Abyss is a universal force, and the PO is god only inside the ¨microcosm¨.

Then who is this ¨universal¨ god that The Devil XV talks about?

THE CREATOR GOD: THE ULTIMATE COUNTERMEASSURE

There exists or existed, an entity which created the universe, using reason as their tool to write a silver tree for the whole cosmos.

This Creator God should've been more than aware that the universe would eventually collapse, that the story they wrote would eventually end.

  • THE GOLDEN-HAIRED TWINS: If they created the universe, they also ¨created¨ the twins.

And this Creator God had a very specific plan for them.

Let's analyze the lunar arcanum: The World XXI

THE WORLD XXI

The World XXI
  • THE FIRST PART: of the card talks about the creation of the ¨world¨. Inside the analogies, the PO acts as the writer/god of Teyvat.
  • THE SECOND PARTof the card talks about the creation of the ¨universe¨. The Creator God is the ¨writer¨ of the universe.

However with a single line we can deduce who this Creator God was:

¨MEMORY¨ IS ¨DESIGN¨

Server of memory, the pillar of creation

I warn the readers, this section of the theory is the hardest to ¨conceptually¨ understand inside any of its chapters, be sure to fully comprehend it. I'll try my best to make it easy to digest.

Let's start questioning what we know:

¨Scaramouche tried to ascend to godhood¨
¨Wanderer saved the Traveler in Nod Krai¨

-Before erasure

¨Scaramouche tried to ascend to godhood¨
¨Wanderer saved the Traveler in Nod Krai¨

-Post erasure

Scaramouche didn't have the power of the Abyss to destroy, then how did a blank space appear in the past? He didn't ¨destroy¨ reality, he just...

Erased the memory of himself.

The action was still there... but nobody knew who.

  • KEY POINT: if the destruction of the universe represents the end of the story and closing the last page of a written book, then that would also mean that every page that we have passed by has been destroyed and turned blank.

Which is not exactly true.

  • MEMORYThe past isn't blank because there is MEMORIES of it. If memory of the past didn't exist, that information would turn into a blank space and fall into oblivion/nothingness.
  • THE PAST IS GETTING DESTROYED: In reality, the past is indeed getting constantly ¨destroyed¨, but the blank space that it represents can only be perceived if the memory that sustains it dissappears.

Memory acts as a ¨support¨ of the past.

¨The Abyss is like the world's shadow, it's always there, and it will never perish

-Skirk

Such a fancy way of referring to ¨the past¨.

  • VERY IMPORTANT: The universe exists only on the present page. The future is yet to exist and the past exists no more.
  • ¨ABYSS¨ IS ¨PAST¨: The undefined reality where rules start to blur, the purple abyss or what Genshin just calls the Abyss, is merely:
    • THE PAST MANIFESTING IN THE PRESENT.

Let's explain this inside an example:

If I asked you, how was the weather a week ago...

  • You would probably be able to ¨imagine¨ and ¨picture¨ a visual image of that moment and describe it vaguely. Let's say you remember youself walking down the street in a sunny day.
  • If you ¨explored¨ that memory, it is very likely that you wouldn't be able to tell the colour of the cars passing down the road.
  • Maybe one car was red, but your mind can't remember it, so inside the memory you are exploring, the car appears as ¨yellow¨, as you have seen yellow cars more recently. A NEVER CHOSEN POSIBILITY.
    • In the universe of Genshin, that once red (now yellow) car would be a purple abyss monster or a ¨variable¨ (explained in CH.2).
    • Barbeloth says that the Abyss (purple one) is fueled by ¨the hatred carried by all the alternate possibilities of fate that never came to pass¨.

¨The car wasred¨ - No memory
¨The car was (yellow)¨ - The blank space ¨fuses¨ with the memory of another colour to exist, and creates a NEVER CHOSEN POSIBILITY: PURPLE ABYSS.

If I asked you about the weather a month ago, you would most probably had forgotten already. The deeper one goes into the past, the less definition it has.

  • THE PURPLE ABYSS IS THE ¨UNORGANIZED PAST¨: the past that is made of disordered memories.
    • NEVER CHOSEN POSIBILITY = UNORGANIZED MEMORY
  • KEY POINT: But in reality, the past is always ¨unorganized¨**, until someone defines it.**

Before me asking you how was the weather a week ago, that information was completely difuminated and lied without order inside all the possible memories that the past could've been.

NICOLE: ¨Only which you see is true. What is unseen is but an illusion¨
[...]
TRAVELER: (Believe my eyes... does she mean I should trust my memories?)

-Wanderer's SQ

You, the reader, used your power of reason.

  • THE POWER TO DEFINE: The power to give order to information, and form logical events/deductions. The power you have just used to remember and picture yourself in a logical scenario where you were in a sunny day, was the power of reason.
    • The information regarding the colour of the car was ¨purple¨ as it didn't have an imposed order.
    • The information regarding the weather was ¨blue¨ as it was correctly ordered.
The power of reason
  • REASON: Every character acts as a ¨mini creator/definer of reality¨.
    • The stronger this power is inside a human, the less probable it is they get corrupted by the Abyss.
    • Abyss users ¨reorganize¨ themselves and don't fall into corruption. Like a character creating themselves.

We can also affirm that:

  • DESTRUCION/RED ABYSS IS THE FORCE THAT MOVES PAGES FORWARD: The force that constantly destroys the universe, the decay of the story, and the force that slowly moves the world to its end.
    • THE FORCE THAT TURNS PRESENT (defined reality) INTO PAST (undefined)
    • Red abyss constantly destroys each moment, until one day the whole book will ¨become part of the past¨: the end of the universe.

The moment when destruction passes the last page.

What would happen if something or someone was deleted in the present?

The deleted reality would see the cease of its continuity on the future, which is the same as ¨becoming part of the past¨.

Destruction ¨moves time forward¨

Here comes a key point.

  • THE SERVER OF MEMORY: the Irminsul for Teyvat, and the hypothetic tree of the universe, collect the full information of what was, is, and will be. Each moment/page is formed by an infinite amount of information, but the amount of moments is finite.

¨Think of Ley Lines as the collection of memories concerning a given place¨

-Haden

  • THE END OF THE IRMINSUL: will mean nothing to memory, since all information of the planet will be registered in the tree of the universe.
  • THE END OF THE UNIVERSE: will come when the tree of the universe is destroyed therefore destroying all memories therefore destroying all reality.
    • Once this tree dissapears, the whole universe will turn into nothingness

His hair was brown and hers was black
His hair was brown and hers was black

The Pitch-dark Void

However, there is one observer that doesn't need the information of a silver tree/written book to remember the past. One that can gather memories that won't be destroyed upon the end of the universe.

  • THE READER: Inside the analogies, the Traveler plays the role of a reader. Even if the information was deleted, the Traveler knew still who ¨the Balladeer¨ was.
    • The information that the Traveler has gathered, their memories, are not erased, the Traveler exists as a ¨seed for the new universe's Irminsul¨.
    • This will be explored in next chapters
  • THE SPIRAL ABYSS: is but a metaphor of the reader descending to the end of the story. The further we go, the closer we get to the pit. The more the story advances, the less pages separate the past (purple Abyss/pit) from the end.

And once the story is finished, the past will ¨catch up¨ to the present, the red abyss will destroy every memory, and the book will be turn into nothingness.

¨None will escape the flames¨

-Dainsleif, Teyvat's trailer

  • TO CREATE A NEW WORLD: we need destruction to oppose creation, the ¨fusion¨ of creation and destruction leads to nothingness, and memory acts as a ¨blueprint¨ for creation to write upon nothingness.
    • As an ¨undefined variable waiting to be defined¨.
The memory of the reader
  • THE ROLE OF THE TRAVELER: is to, at the end of time, BUILD A UNIVERSE ANEW using their memories of the current one so it doesn't fall into nothingness.
    • In next chapters, we will explain how exactly.

That was the plan of the Creator God.

¨Memory¨ is ¨design¨
[...]
And the ¨silver tree¨ sprouts buds (the Irminsul of the universe)
You follow each tiny piece of your memory
The ¨universe¨ stands firm

-The World XXI

The universe WILL end and it will be created again, by the Traveler.

  • THE CYCLIC FORMULA OF THE UNIVERSE:
    • CREATION + DESTRUCTION/RED ABYSS = NOTHINGNESS
    • NOTHINGNESS + MEMORY = PURPLE ABYSS/UNORGANIZED MEMORY
    • PURPLE ABYSS + REASON = CREATION/ORGANIZED MEMORY
  • And the cycle repeats

THE CYCLES OF THE UNIVERSE

The reunion of the twins

Partings, encounters, and partings once more,
Birth, destruction, and birth yet again

-The Wheel of Fortune X

Once the new universe is created, the twins must exist again:

  • TRAVELER: If they didn't exist, the ¨next¨ universe would be doomed to fall into nothingness after its destruction.
  • SIBLING: In every universe, the Traveler explores the world with the purpose of finding their Sibling. If they didn't exist, the Traveler would have no reason to explore the world and unknowingly gather memories, which would also lead to nothingness.

It is implicit to the creation of a new universe, that the Traveler will have to ascend from reader to writer.

In reality, the Sibling has a greater role than just being a ¨motivation¨ for us to search them, but this will be explained in CH.2, alongside with their plan.

And if the next universe will be created upon the memories of the current Traveler... then...

  • THE CREATOR GOD IS THE PAST TRAVELER: the Traveler of the last universe, who understood the truth of their journey and built the current universe using the memories of their travel.

Let's remember a quote:

The golden lion bows its head,
And the silver tree sprouts buds.
Following all that is remembered,
The "world" stands firm.

-The World XXI

This part of The World XXI talks about the Primordial One creating Teyvat.

Here there is the line that makes it possible to accurately predict the future of Genshin.

¨FOLLOWING ALL THAT IS REMEMBERED¨

  • TEYVAT MAY HAVE BEEN CREATED: ¨following all that is remembered¨, that is, following the memories of the past Traveler.
  • THE UNIVERSE: if the Traveler has to replicate the whole universe upon their memories, and the end is close, it's impossible they can explore the whole cosmos to gather memories. Unless...
    • Teyvat was created as a ¨mini-universe¨ for the Traveler to replicate the whole cosmos.
    • AS A BLUEPRINT OF THE UNIVERSE
  • NOTE: the dilation of time we mentioned earlier due to Teyvat orbitting a black hole, is meant for the Traveler to end their journey exactly when the universe ends.
The Fool XXII

The first customer was a deity who had been drifting around since her home planet was destroyed. She spoke to the shopkeeper about the fickle nature of the cosmos.
[...]
¨**I remember every glorious moment of civilization's brilliance...**¨

-Wings of Delicacies

And if the universe of Genshin is a never ending-loop, then...

  • THE CONCLUSION WE NEED: We may be able to predict the future of this universe using the stories of the Archon Quests:
    • Using the fate that the PO wrote for Teyvat, we can have an idea of what the fate of the universe will be, since each AQ is a memory of the last universe.

¨The gods goad us with the promise of their seven treasures¨

-Dainsleif, Teyvat's trailer

END OF CHAPTER 1

CH.1 is meant to set structure of the universe, as well as defining the base of these theories.

CH.2, 3 and 4 will explain how the future will play out.

If you are interested in looking them up, here it is CH.2:

Until then...

Ad astra abyssosque!

r/Genshin_Lore Apr 03 '26

Abyss Durin was created to stop the spread of the abyss by becoming an Abyss Sovereign

169 Upvotes

There's no evidence, of course, but I recently thought about it. The Abyss order is a group that uses the power of the Abyss, but the Abyss itself is some kind of cursed element. Human Durin can only use the power of the abyss thanks to Albedo's alchemy, but he's extremely strong and just like the Hydro Sovereign has the maximum authority over hydro, Durin may one day get maximum authority over the abyss element.

Durin said that the abyss is some kind of strong power capable of strongly enchanting life and he managed to use it in a good way during the Nod-Krai Archon quest, slightly influencing some events of the past. Moreover, after his story quest, Durin has become an anomaly just like the traveler. He was already an anomaly to Teyvat because he was not meant to exist, but now he can also choose his own fate. This makes him independent from Teyvat's rules, opening an incredible amount of scenarios for him.

If Durin manages to become an Abyss Sovereign, he may be able stop the spread of the abyss or at least convert it to something less dangerous, just like Neuvillette transformed people from Fontaine into real humans.

If it is really possible, I suspect Kaenri'ah tried it already. Before King Irminsul fell into madness, they probably intended to create some kind of vessel to contain the abyss by taking advantage of our sibling's affinity to the abyss. Unfortunately they failed. According to the story, her ability to absorb the abyss was limited and at some point she exploded and the Abyssal power spread all over Kaenri'ah and the surface of Teyvat. What if they realized that human bodies have a limit? Just like a god wielding the authority is not as strong as a dragon sovereign wielding that authority.

TWO DURINS, ONE FATE.

Maybe Rhindettor created Dragonspine Durin exactly for that reason, but she failed because every creature born in Teyvat has a Fate already written in the stars and they can't go against it, but what about Mini Durin? He's a "copy". Dragonspine Durin's fate exists already and it is meant to end only after his death.

Albedo forced Dragonspine Durin to die earlier than what was established by his Fate and this confused Teyvat laws "Durin has to be alive, but he is not. He can't be dead. There are still events involving him. If the body is dead, someone has to take his place to reach the end of his fate!"

This person was Simulanka Durin. He shared the same name (and names are important in Teyvat), a similar story, his existence has been in a limbo state since his birth and he didn't have his own fate. He was the prefect candidate, but he was also a replacement and Teyvat had to shape his story and memories to force Simulanka Durin to inherit the Fate. Still, this is also the reason why Durin had a chance to escape fate, because it hasn't been his fate since the beginning.

What do you think?

r/Genshin_Lore Feb 15 '26

Abyss Is the Abyss a natural phenomenon?

36 Upvotes

Is the abyss a natural phenomenon or is it manmade?

As far as we know the abyss is the reason the universe is dying and that Teyvat maybe one of the last survivable planet around.

We have seen that the HP is trying to escape the abyss as they even conquer Teyvat and created a shield around it to prevent the abyss from coming. And when the abyss did get into teyvat they literally nuked it to the ground destroying the leylines that were made to counted the abyss.

Is it just natural and that the universe is fated to be corrupted by the abyss, like when the universe was created was the abyss created alongside it, we have the light realm and the void realm.

Or did some civilization create the abyss as a way to take over the universes, like did the civilization created it to counter the light realm specifically

We seen the abyss has been shown to copy many things like the shades, the sovereign, and Nibuleng could also just be another abyss mimic but we have also seen that it could trasend what it copies like the bukanawa has gain its immortality from the abyss but it's a more transcendental form of abyssal power that even the abyss order doesn't understand.

We know that Surtalogi is destroying worlds and civilization but could that be considered the abyss, since he is associated with it. Like any form of abyssal power being used would be considered as the abyss destroying the universe, there could be others that use the abyss as a power source and they would be considered the abyss even it the abyss is secured and they themselfs aren't actively destroying.

Is the abyss inevitable and that the universe would eventually be consumed by the abyss?

r/Genshin_Lore Apr 11 '26

Abyss “Abyss” is a metaphor for “oil”.

53 Upvotes
Does the Abyss smell like asphalt?

At his invitation, the little witch descended to the deepest level of the castle, where — beyond its fragile boundaries — stretched a sea of pure darkness.
Sustaining this boundary was a massive mechanism that spat out an endless stream of smoke. Countless pipes were continuously drawing thick seawater into its core.
"This is the perpetual motion machine, or you may call it the Holy Grail. By burning the seawater, it generates light and heat."
"Since all tangible things on this planet are merely shadows cast by light, so long as we can create a fire that never goes out..."
"But doing this will only make the planet burn out even faster..." the little witch sighed.
"Once the sea's been drained, this place will be finished. There's nothing 'holy' about this so-called grail..."
"Now I know why the planet's been feeling unwell."

Athame Artis

Abyss : An energy source generated from the remains of Nibelung lying dormant underground (this is my idea). Its use shortens the lifespan of the planet.

Oil : An energy source produced from the remains of plankton; its use shortens the lifespan of the planet. It is also a raw material for asphalt.

r/Genshin_Lore Jul 11 '25

Abyss Asmoday switched sides from the LIGHT to the VOID and her new master is the Prince(ss) of the Abyss Order - who will become equal to The Heavenly Principles in power

202 Upvotes

Contrary to popular theory:

  • Asmoday's new master is not Traveler, but the Sibling
  • Asmoday is not Paimon (she has the crown and represents the Circlet of Logos)

There are 3 realms: Light Realm, Human Realm, Void Realm

  • Human realm is generally under the rule of light, but some humans, like sinners, don't want to obey gods and may seek power from the Abyss
  • Shades serve in the realm of LIGHT
  • Betraying the ruler of the LIGHT realm and switching to the other side means going to the ABYSS
  • Switching sides sounds much more binary than just serving another master. It cannot be Traveler, who always sided with the LIGHT (not to confuse with being friends with everyone) and always fought against the ABYSS
  • In other words: traveler (so far) was always on the same "side" as the Heavenly Principles, Shades, Archons (servants with various levels of loyalty) and all the "virtuous" humans who worship them
  • Anyone can, of course, become a traitor, even a Shade (Asmoday) or an Archon (possibly Tsaritsa, but Focalors wasn't one - this is a common misconception). Do not misunderstand negative emotions (fear, disillusionment) or even disobedience and scheming as a betrayal or defection
The sibling glimpsed at Asmoday right after talking about the method to achieve an equal power to Heavenly Principles
  • We have already seen Asmoday siding (to an unknown extent) with the Sibling in 5.7 AQ "A Space and Time for You" - Istaroth's involvement seems more nuanced, but even the relationship with Asmoday may not yet be typical master-servant (the Sibling is not yet equal to HP - but will be)
  • Traveler will be the ruler of LIGHT and the Sibling will be the ruler of VOID - 2 equal forces on the opposite sides, 2 most important and, ultimately, most powerful characters in Genshin
  • the rebellion of Fatui and Tsaritsa may finalize the whole thing - if they usurp the throne of HP by siding with Traveler and making him the new HP. Genshin's writers like this kind of ironic outcomes where prevention is a part of the causation (Fontaine's flood prophecy, Direidyth's key)
  • Paimon is a fragment of HP's power and it won't awaken until the Traveler fuses with Paimon
  • You won't have to cry too long after eating her - the nagging will still continue (she will become part of you like Naberius)
  • The fact that it's the heavens who have demonic names and hypothetical HP's successor is "Lucifer" indicates that to see the truth of this world we may need to turn it all upside down - this will justify the sibling siding with the abyss. No one is truly "evil" in this story
2 main opponents in Genshin - ultimately equal in power

r/Genshin_Lore Apr 07 '26

Abyss A singular line from The World XXI spoils THE WHOLE STORY [CHAPTER 2/4]: The role of destruction. Hroptatyr's identity + plan of the Sibling

190 Upvotes
The Abyss that destroys....

¨Following all that is remembered¨

-The World XXI

Would you believe me if I said that the Abyss sustains reality by destroying it?

And that the main villain of the game yet to be presented is but a ¨false villain¨?

This is the second chapter of a 4-post series of theories (CH.1 says 1/3 but that was a mistake on the tittle :P)

NOTE: I highly recommend that one reads the TL;DR in CHAPTER 1 first. The main idea of the theories is that we can predict the future using Archon Quests since they were shaped by memories of the last cycle of the universe.

These theories combined should be above 120k characters, an excessive amount of course, but:

¨Extraordinary claims recquire extraordinary evidence¨

Let's start explaining how the Abyss sustains creation:

THE ROLE OF DESTRUCTION

Remember, in CH.1, we declared the Abyss to be separated in two forms:

  • RED ABYSS: destructive FORCE against reality
  • PURPLE ABYSS: undefined DIMENSION result of the red Abyss ¨destroying¨ the creation of reason (BLUE)

We made a point that, if the universe was a book, then destruction/red Abyss would be the force that moves pages forward to its end.

¨The force that moves time forward¨

Now what would happen if it didn't exist?

Either all pages exist at the same time, or no page exists at all.

  • DESTRUCTION CREATES CAUSALITY: without a force that decides that the universe is going to move towards its end, there would be no universe at all. Causality says that the previous moment to the current it's its causes and the next, its consequences.
    • It's implicit to causality that moments move forward.
    • Thanks to destruction, causality exists, and upon causality, fate is built.
  • A STORY NEEDS TO BE CONSUMED TO BE READ.
    • Time needs to move forward for reality to be perceived.
    • Reading a story is, in essence, consuming it, by passing by each page.

What would've happened if the Abyss didn't exist?

  • No need for the Traveler to exist, no War of the Funerary Flame, no repression from the PO, no Kaenriah, no Teyvat... No story at all.

The story exists only upon the conflict between destruction and creation. An equation of two sides.

¨The war has already began. (Conflict) It is just a continuation of past battles¨ (In every cycle of the universe)

-Dainsleif, Teyvat's trailer

  • CONFLICT/¨WAR¨: It's not about heroes or villains but their conflict what keeps the story ¨alive¨. Once one of them is defeated, the story ends. It's not about creation or destruction, but the conflict between the two that makes the universe live, even though it's destined to perish.
  • THE ROLE OF DESTRUCTION: allow a story to exist, before the universe inevitably ends.
    • Without destruction: no universe
    • With destruction: universe bound to end

GENSHIN HAS ALREADY SHOWN US THIS EQUATION OF CONFLICT:

Genesis Pearl and Snake

The snake of the Genesis Pearl is not a ¨parasite¨, it's a sustainer. Ironic.

Destruction manifests as villains and creation manifests as heroes.

Where there are heroes, there must be wicked mages
And where there are knights, there must be evil dragons

-The Wicked Mage's Plumage

Let's bring up the 1st Archon Quest: MONDSTADT/PROLOGUE.

The Prologue's value lies in setting the 4 central characters of Genshin's stories.

  • VERY IMPORTANT: The knight and the evil dragon are confronted first. The dragon was never truly evil, but manipulated by the mage.
  • The hero must stop the wicked mage.

Let's compare: Sumeru, Nod-Krai, Mondstadt and Genshin.

  • HERO: Traveler for all
  • KNIGHT: Nahida, Columbina, Venti, Primordial One
  • EVIL DRAGON: Scaramouche, Rerir, Dvalin, Nibelung
  • WICKED MAGE: Dottore, Dottore, abyss mage, and...

Who is the wicked mage who corrupted Nibelung? The final villain...

Nibelung got corrupted because of the Abyss. (Remember, the red Abyss is what corrupts beings, the purple Abyss is a result)

But... it's just a natural force, right? not a wicked mage.

THE ENCARNATION OF THE ABYSS

If this red Abyss is what moves pages forward, wouldn't you agree, that if we were to personify this force...

  • THE ¨MASK¨ OF THE ABYSS: a perfect way of depicting it would be an all-knowing sage (he would exist in every instant of the cosmos simultaneously) that tries to destroy the universe to unleash infinite knowledge?

Destruction also reveals the information to the readers by moving pages forward, and this character's goal should be ending the book, which implies destroying/erasing creation.

  • KEY POINT: a reader only understands the FULL knowledge/meaning of the book after it's finished.
  • GNOSTICISM: the more the universe is destroyed, the more pages the reader has read, and the more knowledge they have of the truth of the universe. The red Abyss/destruction is a force of enlightenment that destroys the universe for the Traveler to understand it.
    • ¨The force that reads the story¨

Then I ask you, does this description match any character we have already seen... or already heard?

Let's start by finding users of destruction:

THE SINNERS

We stated in CH.1 that the Abyss is red in essence, and the force of destruction that ¨purple¨ abyssal users have access to.

The colour of their powers is how the red Abyss manifests as a result of ¨mixing¨ with them.

  • VERY IMPORTANT: For a human, not being corrupted by the red Abyss means having reason strong enough to ¨reorganize¨ the destruction that they experiment.
The five blasphemies
  • Rerir, DESTRUCTION OF DEATH: undead/revival
  • Surtalogi, DESTRUCTION OF SPACE: void/portals (Skirk has this power too)
  • Vedrfolnir, DESTRUCTION OF TIME: time is the rule that bounds mortals to a singular ¨page/moment¨ of the universe (present).
    • Destroying it means existing in multiple pages at the same time, effectively seeing future and past.
  • Rhinedottir, IMITATION OF LIFE: the other sinners got ¨reason¨ from just being humans, so their powers ¨tilted towards destruction¨.
    • However, since Rhinedottir merged with Naberius, her powers ¨stabilized¨ and became ¨pure purple¨, so now they are ¨mimetic¨ to the original power of life.

¨Nabe... no, this looks more like Rhinedottir's doing¨ (an ¨imitation¨)

-Ronova

  • Hroptatyr, DESTRUCTION OF REASON?

HROPTATYR, THE WISE

The ¨Blasphemy against Reason¨: Destruction of Creation.

¨The sages think themselves **to be all-knowing...**¨

-Pierro

NOTE: the original translation of this quote from CN should be ¨The Wise One¨.

The foolish pygmy gently patted his scabies-ridden head and gulped the light-filled air rapaciously.
"Hehehe, I... I think we should kidnap the Prince and use... use him to make us smarter. That's the smart way!"

-The Pale Princess and the Six Pygmies

  • IMPORTANT: In this book, the sinners and the Sibling are portrayed upside-down. Vedrfolnir is the blind pygmy, Surtalogi is the timid pygmy... the Sibling, who is usually symbolized to be Lumine/Princess, is the Pale Prince, and Hroptatyr...

Is the foolish pygmy who wants to kidnap them for knowledge.

An all-knowing sage that wants to destroy creation and gain knowledge... Let's unveil who he truly is.

  • HROPTATYR IS THE ABYSS (red).
    • There was never a human named Hroptatyr. It was the Abyss taking the form of a human to lure the king and the sinners.

Let's back up this idea starting with two lunar arcanums we've already seen in CH.1:

¨Merely a mask¨
  • THE HANGED MEN: those who find the truth of the universe by inverting their perspectives, and consider the creator god, a ¨devil¨ that hides the truth.

Strong implications:

  • THE HANGED GOD: Hroptatyr is a name of Odin, norse god who was the ¨Hanged God¨ or ¨God of the Hanged Men¨. If the hanged men consider creation to be demonic, then their god must be the anti-creator: the red Abyss.
  • THE DEVIL: if for those who are inverted, the Devil is the creator, then for the rest, Hroptatyr is the Devil.

¨The Devil is merely a mask,
Through which the power of darkness is revealed¨ (Hroptatyr is the mask of the Abyss)

-The Devil XV

His chess piece is a mask for a reason.

Realizing he's the Abyss is crucial for the theories, so let's give more proof:

WOOBAKWA: THE WICKED MAGE

Hroptatyr's sword and Woobakwa

But one day, when he was hunting in the forest, he ran into the evil squirrel sorcerer Woobakwa!
Woobakwa despised everything nice, and swore to transform beauty into ugliness and turn light into dark.

-The Boar Princess

An evil red squirrel sorcerer who corrupts the blue pup.

The blue (reason) pup is Nibelung, and the red squirrel Woobakwa is Hroptatyr, The Abyss. In the original story, the pup accidentally eats Woobakwa.

But the rash pup gobbled him up...
Woobakwa was so furious that he cursed the pup...

-The Boar Princess

Nibelung ¨ate¨ The Abyss, which currently manifests as Hroptatyr.

Where there are heroes, there must be wicked mages...
....and where there are knights, there must be evil dragons.

-Wicked's Mage Plumage

We have already explained the central characters of the story:

  • HERO: Traveler
  • KNIGHT: PO
  • EVIL DRAGON: Nibelung
  • WICKED MAGE: The (red) Abyss. Hroptatyr is Woobakwa. Woobakwa is the Abyss.

THE GOALS OF THE SINNERS AND TTDS

¨... we all have our reasons¨

In Rerir's flashback, the reasons of the sinners to enter the Abyss appear. Let's relate them to each using the characters of TTDS:

Five Heroes embarked on a journey to slay the evil dragon.

-Thrilling Tales of Dragon Slayers

  • ¨For honor, the master swordsman¨: Dainsleif.
  • HATRED ¨For vengeance, the deadeye marksman¨: Surtalogi's weapon of choice is the bow. Haden, his master, was abusive and corrupt. Son of prisoners and sentenced to death.
  • GRIEF ¨For bounty, the swashbuckling mercenary¨: Rerir had just lost Tholindis and needed power to save her. She was his ¨bounty¨.
  • DESPAIR ¨For stories, the grand novelist¨: Vedrfolnir always knew about the tragic fates of everyone.
  • DESIRE ¨For research, the knowledgeable sorceress¨: Rhinedottir*. Only female one.*
    • INTERESTING NOTE: It's likely she already knew who Hroptatyr was in Kaenriah.
    • We will explain this in CH.4.

Four motivations to enter the Abyss.

  • One of the five never entered the Abyss. He WAS the Abyss.

EXTRA NOTE: In TTDS, there is one last character. The writer. In CH.3 we will explain who such writer is, because they are not Hroptatyr, but someone even beyond the red Abyss.

THE SERPENT OF GENESIS

¨The Abyss that consumes¨

Earlier we have already declared this particular snake to be the red Abyss itself, corroding the pearl that represents the universe.

The foolish pygmy gently patted his scabies-ridden head and gulped the light-filled air rapaciously.

As if the foolish pygmy (Hroptatyr) was trying to ¨eat¨ the light.

KEY POINT: Odin sacrificed his right eye, specifically.

  • With his right eye he would see the ¨truth of the universe¨, the universe without a ¨defined/false¨ order: purple.
  • And his left eye would stay the same: red.

Like the eyes of the serpent.

  • THE SERPENT OF GENESIS: is Odin/Hroptatyr, the Abyss
    • In the Gnostic BP, the snake is waiting at the last level. It's always there, but patentiently waits for us in the end.
    • The final enemy all stories must face: the end.

THE RAVENS OF HROPTATYR

Ravens + Hanged Men
  • KEY POINT: Odin used ravens as his messengers/spies.

The red star/eye are symbols of the Abyss'/Hroptatyr's gaze.

  • HANGED MEN: ¨followers¨ of Hroptatyr/red Abyss. Those who believe destruction to be divine and creation to be deceitful. Ex:
    • Rauthvangi, René, Deshret, Dottore, Vedrfolnir...
  • RAVENS: the most noticeable ones are Dottore and Asmoday.

About Dottore, in Luna III, Alice introduces the concept of ¨variables¨.

¨Unorganized¨ memories (PURPLE ABYSS). A result of destroying reality.

¨Hyperboreans believed in the Moons¨
¨Hyperboreans believed *(that one day Dottore would annouce the rise of a new Lunar God)*¨ - Idea that would otherwise have never crossed their minds

Being able to create them implies having the power to destroy reality: Hroptatyr's power.

  • ZANDIK: beared his consciousness from before birth, or a fragment at least. This explains why:
    • His name means ¨heretic¨.
    • He's obsessed with destroying the rules of reason and guiding humanity to enlightment, and showing the Traveler the ¨truth¨ of the world.
    • He's represented upside down + his mask is an inverted crown of logos: inverted of the fools (Fatui) = The Wise.
    • A RAVEN: His design represents a masked raven with one singular red eye in the form of a red star.
    • Dottore is the ¨Hroptatyr of Teyvat¨.
    • NOTE: this claim will be further enforced in CH.3 and 4

¨Beyond the moonlight's reach (an alien force/red Abyss), an ancient shadow brandishes its hunting claws, taking aim at the stars (destroy reason)¨

-Nicole, Nod Krai trailer

¨Of all the beings in the ancient world (ancient shadow), none were more evil than Woobakwa *(Hroptatyr)*¨

-The Boar Princess

The crisis in the frontiers was probably him ¨contacting¨ Hroptatyr/red Abyss outside Teyvat, which would explain Nicole warning us about it.

  • ASMODAY: Interestingly, it seems like she always had the same design motifs.
    • Maybe she was always meant to be ¨corrupted¨? Explained in CH.4.

Now that we have seen through his mask and uncovered who Hroptatyr truly is, let's relate him to...

The Sibling.

To do so, we will introduce the 2nd Archon Quest of these theories:

FONTAINE: DIVINITY AND HUMANITY

The oceanids wanted to be human, so Egeria made them human forms. However, upon contact with the Primordial Sea, they would disolve and lose their consciousness.

After this ¨sin¨, a prophecy was created:

“The people of Fontaine will be dissolved into the waters.
And only the Hydro Archon will remain, weeping on her throne”

-Fontaine's Prophecy

Focalors created then a plan to save her people.

Hide in the Oratrice, create a human half (Furina) to deceive the divine order so the Hydro Throne was destroyed thanks to Indemnitium in the Oratrice, to give the power back to the one who could ¨forgive the sin¨.

  • The Primordial Sea is the Abyss (purple): in CH.1 we explained how the universe was created from it, and how it will end ¨flooded¨ by destruction and turned into purple Abyss again.
  • The prophecy is the end of the universe
  • Focalors is the Creator God, who in CH.1 we explained to be the past Traveler.
  • The Oratrice is the Irminsul of the Universe we mentioned in CH.1, and Indemnitium is the memories we are gathering as the Traveler, meant to ¨kill¨/replace the old Creator God/past Traveler.
  • Who is Furina?

Furina was an actress playing to fool the gaze of the gods, so that the order imposed from above would remain untouched.

In Genshin, that order demmands conflict: destruction (VILLAIN) and creation (HERO) must exist in a constant clash. Thats the ¨truth¨ Celestia hid.

  • THE TRUTH WAS NEVER FORBIDDEN: it was ¨hidden¨, so only the right one would find it.
  • KEY POINT: the frontier of Teyvat was made milenia ago for the planet not to be detected.

Inside Teyvat, there have been multiple succesful Abyss users through history.

The army that destroyed Skirk's race and seeks to destroy abyssal users never arrived since the planet was hidden.

  • The plan of the PO when creating the frontiers was to hide the world for humans to use the Abyss ...ultimately creating Kaenriah.
  • If they wanted to exterminate Abyss users, why not let the frontier opened as an ¨invitation¨ for those who also wanted to end them?
    • As we said in CH.1, the PO might have created Teyvat from the memories of the past Traveler. The PO was following a ¨divine plan¨.
    • KAENRIAH WAS NEEDED TO CREATE THE VILLAIN

Every nation that questioned Celestia was an ¨experiment¨:

  • Kaenriah was ¨a situation that the Heavenly Principles could not afford to ignore¨.

A human there took their role as the villain. Who?

  • HROPTATYR AND THE WISE: we have already explained Hroptatyr to be the Abyss itself, so he's not kaenriahn at all.

If Hroptatyr's true goal was to just destroy the universe, why would he split himself and give parts to the sinners? Why not end everything when he had all his power?

If he was the Abyss...

  • THE POWER OF OUR SIBLING: he would be the manifestation of the power the Sibling was used to store, which created the sinners, but... didn't he exist before them coming to Teyvat?

A HUMAN WHO FOUND THE TRUTH?

In Fontaine's story, Furina welcomes us to the nation. She presents herself as the archon, but she was but a cursed human.

Would you believe me if I said that human was also the first character we met?

At the end of my journey, I arrived at a place known as "The Sea of Flowers at the End."
You told me... You wanted to find a place in the universe where that one flower was in full bloom.
To have a place like that suddenly appear before me…
Well, would you think of that as a coincidence?

-Sibling

  • THE FURINA OF GENSHIN: the human who realized they had to be the villain was the Sibling.
  • ¨THE SEA OF FLOWERS AT THE END¨: When they found the Inteyvat flowers, they understood the cyclic nature of the universe. Our home planet was the Teyvat of the last cycle, which was destroyed upon the last universe's death.
    • Those flowers have always been originally from Teyvat.

The first human to discover this, was the human half of a traveler god.

THE SIBLING

"One star rises in the heavens, one star falls in the valley, the two have always been the same."

-The Fool XXII Lunar Arcanum: Twin's card

ONE STAR IS ALWAYS SMALLER
  • DIVINITY AND HUMANITY: The twins. A human, a god.

¨But in my eyes, Furina's humanity is what made her perfect, the human I always wanted to be¨
¨Anyways, so then I cursed her¨

-Focalors

  • VERY IMPORTANT: The Creator, the past Traveler, ¨cursed¨ the Sibling to bear the Abyss within them.

NORSE MYTHOLOGY

Let's see if this idea fits with norse symbolism:

  • Starkaðr (from Starkuthr, Hroptatyr's weapon) was an eight-armed giant who was blessed and cursed, the Sibling:
    • Odin blessed Starkaðr to live a longer lifespan (like Furina) and gain the favour of nobles and kings.
      • Bearing the Abyss (Odin/Hroptatyr) made the Sibling live longer than a human, and Hroptatyr manipulated Irmin for him to see them as his successor.
    • Thor cursed Starkaðr to commit atrocities in his long lifespan.
      • Thor is the past Traveler/Creator God, they did the same Focalors did for Furina, but with the Sibling.
  • Hroptatyr is Odin. Odin is the father of Thor. If he is the Abyss and the Abyss is ¨the force that moves pages forward¨, then that force is responsible of making the past Traveler go from ¨reader of the past universe¨ to ¨writer of the current universe¨.
    • That force ¨created¨ the Creator God of the current universe in the last universe.
    • Odin showed humans how to write in mythology.

The "Devil" is merely a mask

-The Devil XV

HROPTATYR IS THE MASK OF THE SIBLING

The Will of the Abyss and The Abyss

NOTE: they are separate entities, Hroptatyr holds the power of the Sibling and serves them. Funnily similar to Fischl and Oz.

WHAT HAPPENED IN KAENRIAH?

¨She only came to this world because the heavens responded to the ¨summoning¨. The Jester told me this himself.¨

-Scaramouche

Pierro considers Hroptatyr to be a madman who ¨believes himself to be all-knowing¨, which means he is a fool to the real nature of The Wise and what really happened in Kaenriah

The first time that the ship flew over Teyvat, it left the PO and the Sibling (a human who belongs to Teyvat), so one day they would awaken in an ¨upside down¨ kingdom, only years before the Traveler's arrival.

¨The first crowned heir started her journey to find the genesis pearl... but she was deceived¨ THE SERPENT OF SIN

-BP Cinematic

NAHIDA: ¨All I know for sure is that somebody, for reasons only they can know, is deliberately obfuscating her fate¨
TRAVELER: ¨Could it be related to... ***the Abyss?***¨ HROPTATYR

-Sumeru's AQ

"Hehehe, I... I think we should kidnap the Prince..." THE FOOLISH PYGMY WANTS TO CAPTURE THE SIBLING

-The Pale Princess and the Six Pygmies

NOTE: the princess appears as a ¨fifth¨ character, also used by the mage. Ex: Nilou being the center of the Samsara.

¨Defeat me, command me to step aside, show me you are worthier than I to rescue her¨ THE WICKED MAGE CAPTURES THE PRINCESS

-Dainsleif

A lie.

The Sibling never found a serpent nor a wicked mage who deceived them. They accepted their role.

The Fool + The Hanged Man = Inverted Fool

THE INVERTED FOOL: ¨THE WISE¨, THE SIBLING

  • ¨WHERE THERE ARE HEROES, THERE MUST BE WICKED MAGES¨: The princess does not exist in the formula. If the Traveler is the hero, then the Sibling should be... the wicked mage.
    • The Abyss taking the form of Hroptatyr, a ¨wicked mage¨, and acting as the main villain is the perfect ¨mask¨ to hide the Sibling and start conflict in the story.
    • NOTE: Woobakwa represents Ratatosk, a squirrel of norse mythology that settled conflict between destruction and creation. While Hroptatyr exists, the conflict between hero and villain will exist too.

Hroptatyr is an illusion, a MASK, that there is a mage behind everything (the Abyss), controlling the Sibling and using them for his goals.

Let's now reformulate his goal:

  • HROPTATYR: Destroy the universe to unleash unlimited knowledge.
  • SIBLING: End the story to show us the truth of the universe.

¨We will meet at this journey's end... once the dust has settled. Then you will understand¨

-Sibling

ESSENTIALLY THE EXACT SAME GOAL

However, just by phrasing it differently, Hroptatyr is a lunatic and the Sibling tries to help.

  • THE MASK: destruction is a wicked mage that hates creation and believes it must be destroyed. HROPTATYR
  • THE TRUTH: destruction ¨reads the story for us¨ and shows us the knowledge of the universe/book. SIBLING
    • Both are the same: ¨the force that moves time forward¨.

¨Don't try to stop me. Don't try to stop the Abyss¨ (The Will of the Abyss)

-Sibling

¨Until the Abyss has engulfed the thrones (end of the universe, not of Teyvat), my war with destiny will see no end¨

-Sibling

Once they awakened in Kaenriah, the Sibling ¨created¨ Hroptatyr by separating themselves from their power.

He was tasked to act as the main villain of the story, and to ascend to power in Kaenriah to create the sinners.

  • THE SEPARATION: As head of the Universitas, he lead the investigation of abyssal energy, corrupted Irmin and conviced Kaenriah that he had ¨summoned¨ the Sibling, when they were always there.
    • Asmoday and the Sibling were ¨acting¨. Our separation would start the story...
  • AND GIVE THE TRAVELER A MOTIVATION TO EXPLORE THE WORLD/GAHTER MEMORIES.
Starkad (Sibling) was an eight-armed giant...
  • THE POWER OF THE SIBLING: kaenriahns never made the Sibling store abyssal energy, it was always inside them.
    • Another lie possibly originated from Hroptatyr.
  • ¨THE POWER TO CREATE TRASCENDANT SINNERS¨: Hroptatyr divided himself, and made it seem like he and the sinners had stolen the power of the Sibling.
    • The combined power of the 5 is the full power of The Abyss and the power to destroy everything.

¨... divided among themselves a power that could destroy the world¨

-Dainsleif

What is the current plan of the Sibling?

  • THE AGE OF ENLIGHTMENT: that The Devil XV talks about... is the moment when the Traveler closes the book (end of the universe) and realizes how to write a new story.
    • The coronation of the Traveler.

Do you believe your sibling to have betrayed you?

-Dainsleif

  • In CH.1 we said, that it's implicit to this process that the Traveler will need to ascend from ¨reader¨ to ¨writer¨.

Let's introduce the 3rd Archon Quest of these theories:

SUMERU: THE CREATION OF A GOD

Shouko no Kami already set the recipe.

FOUR ingredients:

  • DIVINE KNOWLEDGE/REASON: electro gnosis
  • FORBIDDEN KNOWLEDGE/ABYSS: ironically named ¨divine knowledge capsule¨.
    • NOTE: humans call forbidden knowledge to the result of interacting with destruction/red Abyss. It ¨disolves reason¨ from people's minds, which leads to not being able to organize information and madness.
  • BODY/VESSEL: Scaramouche + Shouko no Kami's mech.
  • FAITH: people's dreams collected via Akasha inside the Sabzeruz.

Shouko no Kami was a ¨substitute¨ for the decaying world order.

The Traveler, after ascending, will be a substitute of the old Creator God.

Let's start with the ingredients for Genshin's god:

FAITH

REWRITE TEYVAT: we have been building up this step for years now:

  • TO DESTROY, The Fatui: their relevance is the burning of the Irminsul. (By Dottore, raven of Hroptatyr)
  • TO CREATE, The Abyss Order: using the Loom of Fate, create a new tree after the Irminsul burns. New Kaenriah.
  • VERY IMPORTANT: Kaenriahns believed in the purple Abyss. Why these beliefs are needed will be explained in CH.3
Destroy the Old World and create the New World = A NEW NOT-INVERTED TEYVAT

ABYSS

Retrieving the full power of the Sibling/red Abyss:

  • Vedrfolnir/Hroptatyr: at disposition. 2/5

The blind pygmy opened his sightless eyes and enjoyed the sunlight greedily.
"**Why not keep the Prince with us forever?**¨ - Vedrfolnir follows the Sibling

-The Pale Princess and the Six Pygmies

  • Rerir: in norse mythology, Rerir dies of an illness after praying to Odin. (Hroptatyr) 3/5
    • NOTE: Following the recipe to create a god, it's very likely that Dottore uses his power as Abyss source for his final prototype. When he's finished, Rerir's powers will go back to Hroptatyr.
  • Surtalogi: ¨Gusisnautar¨, name of his weapon, references the story of Örvar-Oddr, a hero fated to be killed by his own horse, similar to Surtalogi and Skirk. He kills the horse, but he trips on its skull and dies bitten by a serpent (Hroptatyr). 4/5
  • Rhinedottir: her case is different. In CH.4 we will explain why she will willingly give her power away. 5/5

VERY IMPORTANT: the order Dainsleif used to name the sinners is not arbitrary, but the order in which their stories as sinners started and how they will end.

¨There were five of them: The Wise, Hroptatyr; The Visionary, Vedrfolnir; Gold, Rhinedottir; The Foul, Surtalogi; Racher of Solnari, Rerir¨

-Dainsleif

START:

  • 1.HROPTATYR: the Abyss.
  • 2.VEDRFOLNIR: he had the power to see the future (destruction of time) before the night of the Cataclysm.
  • 3.RHINEDOTTIR: exclusion principle.
  • 4.SURTALOGI: would you believe Dainsleif to stand still while the sinners entered the Abyss? He clearly lost a battle when Rerir arrives, and by that time, Surtalogi was the only who could rival him.
Dainsleif had just lost a duel
  • 5.RERIR: last to enter.

END:

  • 1.RERIR: his powers will be retrieved after Dottore's experiment.
  • 2.SURTALOGI: after his invasion.
  • 3.RHINEDOTTIR: exclusion principle.
  • 4.VEDRFOLNIR: ¨the destruction of time¨ means he exist in every moment of the universe, so he can only ¨lose his powers¨ at the end of time.
  • 5.HROPTATYR: final boss of the game.

BODY+REASON

Hroptatyr, who will have the full power of the Abyss, will fuse with the Sibling, effectively giving them their power back.

"Hehehe, I... I think we should kidnap the Prince..."

-Foolsih Pygmy

¨Defeat me, command me to step aside, show me you are worthier than I to rescue her¨

-Dainsleif

A lie.

  • THE FINAL BATTLE: we will believe that Hroptatyr has ¨deceived¨ the Sibling to fuse with him (become the perfect vessel) and ascend himself. A final battle to rescue the Sibling and save the universe.
    • The Sibling will be ¨hiding¨ inside Hroptatyr during this battle
    • VERY IMPORTANT: Paimon will play a VITAL role here regarding the ¨emergency food¨ status. Explained in CH.3

The last step will be the Sibling giving us the power of the Abyss so we can ascend. They will ¨fuse with us¨.

Explained in CH.3, with the true nature of the Heavenly Principles.

BELIEFS OF NEW KAENRIAHNS+TRAVELER'S REASON+SIBLING'S ABYSS+FUSION OF THE TWINS=NEW CREATOR GOD

  • KEY POINT: But for that, the Traveler will have to accept the Abyss.
  • DEATH OF THE MASK: Hroptatyr/Odin dies in Ragnarok killed by Fenrir.

Vedrfolnir's weapon's name is Gleipnir, the name of the chains that held Fenrir. He should ¨indirectly¨ kill Hroptatyr, but he has already done so.

How do you kill a mask?

By showing the truth.

  • VEDRFOLNIR'S MESSAGE: was never future Vedrfolnir talking to his past self, neither him talking to Clothar.
    • IT'S WHAT THE SIBLING WILL TELL US AT THE END OF TIME.

Let's translante it

¨Oh, dear creature, why do you bow down? For fear of the unknown? Or for a power that you covet?

  • Oh, dear sibling, why do you bown down? For fear of the Abyss? Or for a power that you covet?

Oh, dear creature, why do you bow down? For I am no god... I am but a sinner

  • Oh dear sibling, why do you bow down? For I am no god, I am but a human.

You are like a flower born in sin yet pure, spotless... I know your fate well

  • You are a spotless human (a god)... I know your role well.

You need no longer hold back your resentment, nor accept the countless lies.

  • You need no longer to hold back your resentment (in the Sibling)nor accept the countless lies (see through the mask)

Go forth, become a trascendent one, rise beyond the fate bestowed upon you...

  • Trascend your fate as the ¨hero¨, become the ¨writer¨.

And I shall shed a tear, at the end of time... as I gaze back upon your life

  • And I shall shed a tear, at the end of the universe... as I gaze back upon your memories.
    • For us to create the new universe we will have to ¨gaze back upon our life/memories¨ . (¨Memory is Design¨, explained in CH.1)

In the final battle, the Traveler will start fighting who they will believe to be ascended Hroptatyr, just to realize that the Sibling was the one in control.

Once we accept them and reunite, we will have the power to destroy and to ultimately ¨judge humanity¨.

JUDGEMENT: THE PRIMORDIAL GOD

Judgement XX
  • ¨The ¨eternal calamity¨ remains unchanged¨: The new universe will end too.
  • ¨Only our names remain¨: names carry fates because there already existed characters with them in past universes.
  • ¨Returned now from the ¨nether realm¨, to see what form this illusory world displays.¨: humanity is carried on to the next universe.
  • ¨Alas, THIS IS NOT THE WORLD OF OLD¨: The next universe.
THE START: the twins are born in the ¨nether realm¨ carrying humanity from the past universe
  • ¨A FLOWER BORN IN SIN¨: the Inteyvat flowers are the ¨oceanids of Genshin¨, humans. For humanity, the ¨nether realm¨, the ¨Sea of Flowers at the End¨, is perceived as the ¨Pitch-dark Void¨.

A lotus proceeds from my mouth and flowers bloom on the page.

-TTDS: Writer's part

The Traveler is as human as anyone else!
You are like a flower born in sin (human), yet pure, spotless (god)...

-Paimon/Vedrfolnir

  • THE SEA OF FLOWERS AT THE END: is but the instant between cycles of the universe.
    • NOTE: the Sibling's journey they told us about when mentioning this place, was not their journey with Dainsleif to search for us after the Cataclysm, but their journey in the past universe*.*
    • This place is sometimes perceived as ¨paradise¨ too.
    • Explained in CH.3

"See, my child. All that lies under the throne of heaven shall be destroyed by upheaval. The eternal peace of the pitch-dark void shall embrace us all."

-Deathly Statuette

I pray you will find peace... in death! The Pitch-dark Void is achieved after the ¨death¨ of the universe

-Lord of Eroded Primal Fire

  • THE DEATH OF THE AUTHOR: When Traveler becomes the new writer, the old writer, the past Traveler, will die. Like Focalors did.
    • The current Traveler is the Neuvillette of Genshin, the one who unknowingly gathers energy for their execution (memories).

¨The scales are symbol of reason¨ Traveler (reason) is the ¨dragon¨, explained in CH.4

-The World XXI

LIKE FOCALORS GIVING BACK NEUVILLETTE THE HYDRO AUTHORITY, we will become the new Creator God.

¨You will see much in the human world, from the delightful to the depressing, and one day, when you have dwelt among humanity long enough, you will be placed to bring judgement over all¨ - PAST TRAVELER TO CURRENT TRAVELER

-Focalors to Neuvillette

Only the future can save the past, not the other way around.

-Ike; Vera's Melancholy

¨To the master of the cage (Creator God/past Traveler), a path with no design (MEMORY IS DESIGN) is unexcusable folly¨ A travel with no memories is unthinkable

-The World XXI

END OF CHAPTER 2

Let's reformulate Fontaine's Archon Quest for Genshin:

  • The Inteyvat flowers wanted to become human (¨mortal arrogation¨), so the past Traveler made them human forms. However, upon the touch with the Abyss that created them, they would disolve and lose their consciousness.

Yet "redemption" is a word filled with arrogance,
There is an implicit meaning hidden within,
That mortals have done some clear wrong that must be corrected.

-The Hanged Man XII

¨But mortal arrogation never stops¨

-Dainsleif, Teyvat's trailer

  • But for the new universe to exist, destruction must exist too. One day, the red Abyss/destrucion would destroy everything, the divine punishment.
  • So the past Traveler hid in the Irminsul of the Universe and sent the twins.
    • One would know the plan, their human-half, the Sibling.
    • The other, the god, the Traveler, would gather memories to replace them.
  • And once the the new writer is created, humanity would be remembered for the next universe and not fall into oblivion.
THE END: humanity, your sins are forgiven (JUDGEMENT XX)

The story ends:

¨And humanity, as they were remembered, didn't disolve upon the flood of the Abyss.¨

A new story starts.

The golden twins join hands
The ¨universe¨ stands firm

-The World XXI

The cosmos welcomes a new cycle.

Now for the 3rd chapter, we will be covering the missing Archon Quests, and closing the cycle, as well as explaining what the HP truly is.

Until then...

Ad astra abyssosque!

r/Genshin_Lore Oct 26 '25

Abyss The Nature of the Abyss, Will, Teyvat, and Arlecchino

133 Upvotes

Basically, the recent Song of the Welkin Moon explains what's really going on with Arlecchino and, by extension, the Heavenly Principles.

Day one, we know that something's wrong with the divine power, because the Unknown God's cubes are both inhuman and have this red-black cast to them. They aren't what you'd expect from an actual divinity, and ironically, they have the same colors as Arlecchino.

In the Song of the Welkin Moon, in contrast, Arlecchino explains the source of her powers and its limitations, she's essentially the Iridescent Moon Lauma with her Bloodmoon Balefire the results of the Iridescent Moon sinking into the Abyss.

She is in fact always holding back, because the moment she doesn't and goes full-out, the Abyss gains control. Her reserved and threatening demeanor actually reveals the immense willpower needed to control her Abyssal power.

This is a key hint to the actual nature of the Abyss, Teyvat, and the Heavenly Principles.

The dragons are the natural inhabitants of the Light Realm, and should have full mastery of Light Realm energies, allowing Nibelung to defeat the Heavenly Principles if the latter were powered by the Light Realm alone.

However, Nibelung sought the powers of the Abyss for his war in heaven. Why would he have needed to do so if the Heavenly Principles were purely powered by the Light Realm?

Anecdotally, there are enough hints that the Heavenly Principles is, like Nibelung and Arlecchino, a catalyst of the Abyss. The Heavenly Principles controls Light Realm power, but also controls Abyssal power, and uses their immense will to hold the Abyss at bay, allowing them to utilize the Abyss to create and preserve Teyvat.

This is why Asmoday talks about the arrogation of mankind--Abyssal power can be used, and it is in fact the only power sufficient to counter and negate the gods and the Heavenly Principles, but the will needed to command and control the Abyss is beyond almost any mortal ken.

It is precisely why Khaenri'ah, King Deseret, Nibelung, and all other anti-Celestia powers run to Abyssal power, because you can't counter Celestia's Abyss mastery without Abyssal power.

And it is at the same time why all attempts at rebellion have failed; Celestia masters the Abyss, but all earth-bound civilizations have failed in maintaining the immense will needed to avoid Abyssal corruption.

Now we see the importance of the Descenders. A will that can rival worlds is a will strong enough to control the Abyss and utilize Abyss power sufficient to fight Celestia.

"The sustainer is fading away, and the creator has not yet come. But the world shall burn no more, for you shall ascend to the seat of the 'God'."

r/Genshin_Lore Apr 07 '26

Abyss A singular line from The World XXI spoils THE WHOLE STORY [CHAPTER 3/4]: The Primordial One and Paimon. The true nature of the Heavenly Principles: PO is HP but HP is not PO + THE FATE PARADOX

100 Upvotes
Prisioners can only see shadows...

"Following all that is remembered"

-The World XXI

What if I told you that the Heavenly Principles in reality is the God of the Abyss?

What if I told you that the red Abyss that destroys the universe in reality loves creation?

This is the 3rd chapter of a 4-post series of theories.

NOTE: I highly recommend that one reads the TL;DR in CHAPTER 1 first. The main idea of the theories is that we can predict the future using Archon Quests since they were shaped by memories of the last cycle of the universe.

Let's start with the 4th Archon Quest of the theories.

INAZUMA: THE PRIMORDIAL ONE AND PAIMON

A god who lives in islands has witnessed how chaos destroys civilization and decides to let a heartless version of themselves rule over mortals and chase anyone who tries to grow beyond what it's allowed.

Phrasing it like that, it seems obvious who Ei represents:

  • THE PRIMORDIAL ONE: all these theories are based on the hypothesis that the PO modeled Teyvat after the memories of the past Traveler, so they would have to know very well about the death of the last universe.

Prayer Song I: Piktamoonen, Lord of Seven Calamities

-Hymns of the Far North

The same way Istaroth is referenced as ¨Htoratsi¨ by humans, the PO is referenced with a ¨disordered¨ name: Piktamoonen -> PAIMON TOKEN

Let's remember the central characters of Genshin we explained in CH.2, by comparing them with Sumeru's Nod Krai and Mondstadt characters.

  1. HERO: Traveler
  2. EVIL DRAGON: Nibelung, Scara, Rerir, Dvalin
    • Used/corrupted by the mage
  3. KNIGHT: Primordial One, Nahida, Columbina, Venti
    • Face the evil dragon AND GUIDE THE HERO
  4. WICKED MAGE: The Abyss/Hroptatyr (explained in CH.2), Dottore, Dottore, abyss mage

The knight always guides the hero.

  • THE HEART OF THE KNIGHT: Nahida guides the Traveler thanks to her illusion in the Samsara, Columbina guides them using Luonnotar, and Venti guides them thanks to the wind itself:

¨May the wind guide you Traveler!¨

-Venti

NOTE: For Mondstadt, Varka acts as a ¨second¨ knight who faces Dvalin with Venti, and his teaser is even called: ¨Where the Knight's Heart Leads¨.

What about the PO?

  • PAIMON: the greatest guide of Teyvat!

Let's introduce a CRUCIAL topic here:

  • ¨DER RING DES NIBELUNGEN¨: From Wagner's Opera, talks about the story of a ring that can be forged to rule over the nibelungs, only if one abandons their heart.
    • You either have absolute dominion with no heart.
    • Or you lose dominion but keep your heart.
    • Remember this for the end of the chapter.

If Paimon is the heart of the PO, what currently rules Teyvat is a heartless version of the PO. THE PO SEPARATED FROM THEIR HEART AND BECAME THE ¨WRITER¨ OF TEYVAT

  • THE SHOGUN OF GENSHIN: the heartless system that currently controls Teyvat, grants visions, and sends nails to the ¨corrupt¨ civizilations, while the heart of the PO, Paimon, guides the Traveler. This system has only one imposition: preserve humanity, no matter the cost.
    • The PO had to become the ¨writer¨ to build Teyvat upon the memories of the past Traveler.
    • And becoming the writer meant to achieve dominion and therefore, abandon their heart.

How will the PO awaken?

  • ¨THE CONTRACT TO END ALL CONTRACTS¨: A contract is in essence, an imposition that seizes freedom. ¨Ending all contracts¨ is but granting freedom to mortals.
    • ZHONGLI'S PLAN: was to help the Tsaritsa destroy the Irminsul, so after the ¨written story¨ is destroyed (Irminsul is burnt) the PO would stop being the ¨writer¨ and lose absolute dominion, so their heart would return to them.
  • PAIMON TOKEN: Paimon acts as a ¨token¨ to awaken the true PO, like getting Ei out of the Euthymia.
    • Giving the PO back their heart. That was Zhongli's plan.

Freeing Teyvat from the ¨Omnipresence over Mortals¨. And freeing the PO from being the ¨writer¨.

  • Once the story that the PO modeled is finished and Teyvat under a new Irminsul, their heart, Paimon, will return to them.
  • AFTER THE END OF SNEZNHAYA, THE PO WILL BE OUR ALLY, but we will probably have to face them first...

About the Kaenriah chapter, we have already explained in CH.2 how Hroptatyr will play as the main villain, and how he is a ¨fake villain¨ who's role is to make us think that destruction hates creation, made by the Sibling.

So let us skip to the end of the game.

THE FINAL BATTLE

Will probably happen in two different phases:

"Hehehe, I... I think we should kidnap the Prince..." THE FOOLISH PYGMY/HROPTATYR WANTS TO KIDNAP THE SIBLING

-The Pale Princess and the Six Pygmies

¨Defeat me, command me to step aside, show me you are worthier than I to rescue her¨ THE WICKED MAGE CAPTURES THE PRINCESS

-Dainsleif

  • FIRST, ASCENDED HROPTATYR: the evil sinner of reason has deceived the Sibling to fuse with him and collected the power of the sinners (explained in CH.2).
    • Defeat him, rescue your sibling and save the universe*, everything is on the line.*

He will be stronger than us. Like the ¨false god¨ of Shouko no Kami.

How did the Traveler win?

  • THE MEMORIES OF THE KNIGHT: Nahida, the ¨knight¨ of Sumeru, awakened the memories of every cycle the Traveler had went through.

¨Allow me to awaken the memories in your dreams¨

-Nahida

The memories of the Knight

¨Now, all of Sumeru's wisdom is at your disposal¨

-Nahida

We supposed that the PO created Teyvat ¨following all that is remembered - The World XXI¨.

  • THE PRIMORDIAL ONE BEARS THE MEMORIES OF THE PAST TRAVELER

Genshin has already spoilt the final battle with a funny 1.0 line:

  • ¨PAIMON IS NOT EMERGENCY FOOD!¨: During the battle against ascended Hroptatyr, he will pierce the heart of the PO, separating Paimon from them.
    • As a last resource to win, Paimon will sacrifice as ¨emergency food¨ so we can fuse with the PO, like Rhinedottir and Naberius.
  • THE ¨DELIVERER¨: The final role of the PO, is fusing with the Traveler to deliver them the memories of the past Travelers.

The Traveler will defeat ascended Hroptatyr, and the mask will break.

The final battle
  • SECOND PHASE, THE SIBLING: maybe... the evil sinner that you were fighting, was but a mask of someone you always knew...

In CH.2, we explained how Vedrfolnir's message is what the Sibling will tell us after we see the truth.

  • The final fight of the game is symbolically the Traveler fighting against closing the last page of the book.

The Traveler will accept the Sibling and close the book, end the universe to become the new Primordial God, the new ¨writer¨.

THE HEAVENLY PRINCIPLES: THE PRIMORDIAL GOD

I began these theories saying that the PO is the HP, but the HP is not the PO.

I continued them explaining how the reunion of the twins marks the creation of a new ¨writer¨ of the universe.

The golden twins join hands
The ¨universe¨ stands firm

-The World XXI

So then... what is the HP?

  • THE HEAVENLY PRINCIPLES: is the Holy Trinity: The Father, The Son, and the Holy Spirit
    • THE FATHER: one to create, the Traveler.
      • The past Traveler, who created the universe and sent the Son and the Holy Spirit to fulfill their plan.
    • THE SON: one to destroy, the Sibling.
      • The human half of the past Traveler, and the one who ¨moves pages forward in the story of the universe¨
      • NOTE: we will explain why ¨destruction¨ is ¨Jesus¨ in this chapter, talking about the ¨fate paradox¨.
    • THE HOLY SPIRIT: one to remember, the PO.
      • The one who carries the memories of the last universe and builds Teyvat for the current Traveler to explore it and find the truth.
      • ¨The presence of God on earth¨
  • THE HP IS THE UNION OF THE TWINS AND THE PO.
The Heavenly Principles

¨The keeper is fading away; the creator has not yet come.
**But the world shall burn no more, for you shall ascend.**¨

-Traveler/Profile

The plan that the Sibling is following, needs the ascension of the current Traveler to the new HP.

  • KEY POINT: such ascension was never meant to replace the PO, ¨writer of Teyvat¨, but the HP, ¨writer of the universe¨.
    • NOTE: while the PO is the HP, the HP is not the PO. The Holy Spirit is God, but God is not the Holy Spirit.

¨I am the sustainer of the Heavenly Principles¨

-Asmoday

By separating the twins while the Sibling ¨was acting¨, she gave the current Traveler a reason to explore the world and gather memories. ¨Sustaining the creation of a new HP¨

Inside the analogies made in CH.2, Furina was the Sibling and Focalors, the past Traveler/Creator God.

  • THE NEUVILLETTE OF GENSHIN: Neuvillette's role was to gather Indemnitium so one day the Hydro Archon Throne would be destroyed and him, tasked to judge humanity.
    • THE OLD HP: the past Traveler/Focalors.
    • THE HYDRO AUTHORITY BEING PASSED AWAY = HP BEING REPLACED

In CH.2, we already explained that under the mask of Hroptatyr, a ¨wicked mage¨, the Sibling will make us ascend and replace the HP.

Following the recipe of Shouko no Kami:

  1. RED ABYSS: the combined power of the 5 sinners (Sibling's full power)
  2. REASON: Traveler
  3. BODY: fusion of the twins
  4. FAITH: beliefs of New Kaenriah on the purple Abyss

¨If I wish to speak to the Heavenly Principles as an equal (replace the HP), I will need the might of an entire world behind me *(beliefs of New Kaenriah)*¨

-Sibling

But... why would the beliefs on the purple Abyss be needed to create the HP?

Remember the formula we made in CH.1 about the cycles of the universe?

  • CREATION + DESTRUCTION/RED ABYSS = NOTHINGNESS
  • NOTHINGNESS + MEMORY = PURPLE ABYSS
  • PURPLE ABYSS + REASON = CREATION

The three steps have an initial state and a result.

  • KEY POINT: The past HP currently still exists, but separated.
  • We said in CH.2 that the past Traveler merged with the Irminsul of the Universe, so now they are the ¨anima mundi¨ (soul of the universe).
    • Like Focalors left her consciousness in the Oratrice or Rukkhadevata in the Irminsul
    • The past Traveler is Creation/Universe itself.

Then what happens if we mix the three components of the HP?

  • (CREATION + DESTRUCTION) + MEMORY = PURPLE ABYSS
    • (FATHER+SON)+HOLY SPIRIT = HP
  • THE HP IS THE GOD OF THE ABYSS
(Creation + Destruction) + Memory = Abyss

Ad astra abyssosque! From the stars to the Abyss!

¨The essence of the Abyss (purple) lies in the hatred carried by the fates that will not come to pass¨

-Alice

  • FATES THAT NEVER CAME TO PASS: The god of the purple Abyss, the HP, is but the universe choosing a new fate for each cycle.
    • In CH.1, we said that purple Abyss creatures don't seek to destroy, but to exist

¨The fate of the Abyss is not to be¨

-Chasm incriptions

  • GOD TRASCENDS FATE: once the universe dies and everything is turned into Abyss without order, the HP will defy such fate and make it exist again.
    • THE ORIGINAL SIN: is to go against this divine order. Make the Abyss exist.

At the end of CH.2, we reformulated the story of Fontaine, and we said that the Sea of Flowers at the End is the instant between universes.

The Original Sin

The Inteyvats, are mortals being carried to the next cycle.

  • The Inteyvat flowers, born from the purple Abyss (Primordial Sea of Genshin) wanted to exist, so the HP made them mortal forms. However, upon the touch with the Abyss, they would disolve.

Yet "redemption" is a word filled with arrogance,
There is an implicit meaning hidden within,
That mortals have done some clear wrong that must be corrected.

-The Hanged Man XII

  • MORTAL ARROGATION: Mortals are born from the Abyss, their arrogation? Wanting to exist, like oceanids who wanted to be humans.

Making the Abyss exist was the sin of the HP.

In CH.2, we explained that fate is built upon causality, but for causality to exist, moments have to move forward. Destruction/red Abyss, as the ¨force that moves time forward¨, sustains the universe, ironically.

Destruction and creation
  • A STORY NEEDS TO BE CONSUMED TO BE READ: without an time moving forward to the end, a universe can't exist.
    • THE DIVINE PUNISHMENT, THE ¨ETERNAL CALAMITY¨: Anything the HP would write, would end.

¨Like everything in life, it comes with pros and cons¨

-Hroptatyr

Friends, - (HUMANS)
Returned now from the nether realm, - (SEA OF FLOWERS AT THE END)
To see what form this illusory world displays.
[...], the "eternal calamity" remains unchanged. - (THE STORY WILL END TOO)
Alas, this is not the world of old.

-Judgement XX

This world has always been so...
  • ¨SHADES ABIDE NO REASON¨: Because they come from the HP, god of the Abyss. The PO awakened them during the war under the ¨lie¨ that they were rulers of creation.

They probably don't know it yet, except Asmoday.

In CH.2 we said that the past Traveler was symbolized by Thor in norse mythology, but in reality the past Traveler also became the HP.

THE ELECTRO ELEMENT: is the closest to the HP.

  • The HP represents Thor.

Let's remember norse symbolism from CH.2:

  • The Sibling was Starkad, an eight-armed giant blessed by Odin (Hroptatyr/red Abyss), and cursed to be a villain by Thor (Past Traveler/HP).
  • Hroptatyr is Odin, father of Thor. He is the red Abyss, ¨the force that moves pages forward¨, and such force is responsible for making the past Traveler go from ¨reader of the past universe¨ to ¨writer of the current universe¨.
    • Odin showed humans how to write.

Remember that in CH.2, we mentioned the writer of Thrilling Tales of the Dragon Slayers?

THE HP

A lotus proceeds from my mouth and flowers bloom on the page. (INTEYVATS)
My words are wise and clear and my thoughts are sharp like lightning. (THOR)
I joined this party because I couldn't find a job, and anybody can be a copywriter.
But I'm no writer, just a regular fellow in his mid twenties without an honest job. (COPYWRITTER, NOT WRITER: the HP creates out of memory)

-TTDS, writer's part

  • MY WORDS ARE WISE AND CLEAR: the current HP is the past Traveler who understood the truth of the universe and achieved ¨true wisdom¨.
  • VEDRFOLNIR: can see the ¨fate of the purple Abyss/HP¨ , so he can see the future of characters like Rerir and Surtalogi.

Becoming a ¨purple Abyss¨ user doesn't make you free from fate.

THE FATE OF ABYSSAL USERS WAS TO BE FREE FROM THEIR FATES

¨What does freedom mean when imposed to you by a god?¨

-Dainsleif

Soon we will explain this ¨freedom¨, but since we have mentioned ¨true wisdom¨, let's explain a key distinction that Genshin defines.

HEROES AND VILLAINS: TRUE WISDOM

The path were ¨strenght¨ is sacrificed for ¨human wisdom¨
Is that of the "Hanged Man"...

-The Hanged Man XII

The game considers that ¨true wisdom¨ can only be achieved with both knowledge (¨human wisdom¨) and heart (¨strenght¨).

Miracle is memory, memory is heart, heart is strenght

Genshin calls ¨strenght¨ to ¨having a heart¨.

  • ¨STRENGHT¨ IS SACRIFICED FOR ¨HUMAN WISDOM¨: The Hanged Man represents the villains.
    • VILLAINS: heartless and evil, know the truth of the universe.
    • HEROES: pure and kind, unaware of the truth.
  • THE WISE AND THE FOOL: the ultimate exponents of this idea are the twins. The Wise (Sibling/Hroptatyr), and The Fool (The Traveler, The Fool XXII, Traveler's card).
    • The Wise is the inverted fool, and viceversa.
    • Hero and villain.
Be they Wise Ones or Fool Ones...

Villains are evil because their role is to ¨destroy¨ the universe.

But destruction is not evil per se.

  • HROPTATYR: is the culmination of this lie. The mask of the Sibling to make us believe that destruction/red Abyss hates creation.
    • Destruction is the force that reads the story for us and tries to show us the truth.
  • THE PARADISE: villains seek to destroy, because it leads the universe to paradise, because after ending the book, the Traveler will DREAM a new universe.
    • PARADISE IS NOT THE NOTHINGNESS AFTER DESTRUCTION, IT'S THE NEXT UNIVERSE. We will explain why in this chapter.
    • ¨A DREAM YET TO BE DREAMED¨

¨In the end, we burn in cinders for a dream¨

-Mavuika

So you rather wallow in this rotten, decaying world?!

-Dottore (raven of Hroptatyr)

  • THE FOOL: if the ones who know the truth are trying to create the new universe, what about the current one?

If you knew the nature of Genshin's universe... would you wisely guide humanity to the next universe? Or would you foolishly explore the wonders of the current universe? I'll ask you this again soon.

THE TRUTH OF OUR TRAVEL IS TO KNOW NOT THE TRUTH. Ironic.

  • To enjoy the journey and make memories.

Allow not that knowledge,
To vainly torment your heart.
[...]
Give your love to everyone,
While the years still allow it.

-The Hermit IX

¨Every journey has its end, don't rush¨

-Zhongli

The more you know, the more you realize that all the universe ¨wants¨ to end and be rewritten by you.

So before dreaming, make sure to live*.*

Remember Dainsleif message in Teyvat's trailer?

¨Most are content to live, and not to dream¨ - HEROES/FOOL ONES
¨But in the hidden corners where the god's gaze does not fall, there are those who dream of dreaming¨ - VILLAINS/WISE ONES
¨We will defy this world with a power from beyond¨ - DESTRUCTION/ABYSS

  • Villains dream of a new dream, the dream of the Traveler, a new universe.

That is why the HP is born from a fusion of the twins.

One carries knowledge, one carries heart.

  • ¨True wisdom¨

What is the Sibling?

THE WISE

Inside the Holy Trinity, the Sibling (and by extension Hroptatyr), represent The Son: Jesus.

  • VERY IMPORTANT: destruction is ¨the force that moves pages forward to its end¨, so it also is the force that reads the story for the Traveler.
    • Destruction/red Abyss is a force of enligthenment.
  • THE ELYSIUM BEYOND REASON: In CH.2 we said that the Pitch-dark Void is the same as the Sea of Flowers at the End, the instant after the death of the universe, and before the birth of the next universe.
    • The Wise leads the universe to the dream of the Traveler, the next universe.
The Redentor

¨I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End¨

-Jesus; Revelation 22:13

  • Dottore, who bears Hroptatyr's consciousness, named his segments Alpha and Omega.
  • Furina (who represents the Sibling) can walk on water.
  • Hroptatyr/red Abyss is the first and last villain:
    • FIRST: introduced before the game's launch via Webtoon Dottore.
    • LAST: ascended Hroptatyr.
  • He's also the first and the last of the sinners. Explained in CH.2

The Sibling and him represent Jesus.

The role of Hroptatyr is to act as the face of destruction that the universe hates. The same way Dottore is currently presented as irredeemable and evil.

¨If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first¨

-Jesus; John 15:18

  • ¨THE UNIVERSE'S ALPHA AND OMEGA¨: the role of The Wise, the Sibling/Hroptatyr, is to read the story, as ¨the one who moves pages forward¨.
    • So the Traveler can understand their role and dream a new paradise.

¨A sinner... Yes, salvation for a sinner (humans) can only come from a sinner *(The Wise)*¨

-Clothar

¨We will meet at this journey's end... once the dust has settled. Then you will understand¨

-Sibling

In CH.1 we said that the Spiral Abyss is but a metaphor of the reader descending to the end of the story. The deeper you go, the more secrets you unveil.

  • THE FINAL REVELATION: at the final battle against ascended Hroptatyr, the Traveler must realize that the Sibling is behind him.

Realize that The Wise was always the Sibling reading us a bedtime story.

¨There was once a kingdom established in the heavens *(KAENRIAH)*¨

-BP cinematic

¨One star rises in the heavens (SIBLING), one star falls in the valley *(TRAVELER)*¨

-The Fool XXI

Because in terms of knowledge, Kaenriah is the heavens which understood that the HP is the god of the Abyss.

  • THE DEMONIC HEAVENS: Celestia is not demonic because of being evil, but because of being ¨deceitful¨ to the truth.

From the stars to the Abyss!

Let's keep the notion of ¨paradise¨ hanging for a bit and explain another vital aspect of the twins.

THE INVERSION OF ROLES

During these theories, I've said that the past Traveler was the Creator God of the current universe.

But I've never said that the past Traveler was the current protagonist.

  • ¨THE ONE WHO MOVES PAGES FORWARD¨: if we were to turn destruction into a character, it would be logical to make them an all-knowing sage (Hroptatyr).

But to be all-knowing, you don't have to represent a force that exists in every moment of the universe, therefore being a 4-dimensional being.

You just need two things:

  • EXCEPTIONAL MEMORY
  • HAVING ALREADY READ THE STORY

¨At the end of my journey, I arrived at a place known as "The Sea of Flowers at the End."

-Sibling

The ¨Sea of Flowers at the End¨ is the instant between universes.

Strenght XIII

The renewal of the second cycle
The reversal of servant and served

Imagine you picked Aether.

In the last universe, Aether was the Sibling who guided Lumine, and in the current, Lumine is the Sibling who guides Aether.

  • THE REVERSAL: one twin is first the Traveler, who acts as a ¨reader¨ of the universe. Once they understand the truth, they make a human half to read the story in the next universe, acting as ¨the one who moves pages forward¨, the Sibling.
  • If Aether was your choice...
    • Lumine reads Aether ¨A Bedtime Story¨ after she already ¨read¨ the past universe.
    • Because after a bedtime story, a dream begins. The next universe will be Aether's dream, ¨A Space and Time for Lumine¨, the next Traveler
    • And the cycle will repeat, now inverted.
¨I can't miss the chance to reunite 500 years in the past¨

When we ascend to HP, we will start a new cycle.

¨Strength¨, passed down for a thousand years, and the sin it births.

-Strenght XIII

  • A THOUSAND YEARS: the story of the twins started with the Sibling in Kaenriah, and will end soon. That makes 500 years.
    • 1ST 500 YEARS: 1st universe, Aether is The Wise and the Lumine is The Fool.
    • 2ND 500 YEARS: 2nd universe, Lumine is The Wise and Aether is The Fool.
  • THE FIRST CHOICE: deciding if you wanted to play as Aether or Lumine... was choosing if your story would happen in a pair or an odd universe.
    • Both twins are canon Travelers, Genshin just usually shows Lumine as the Sibling since the symbolism aligns better with her.
  • THE END: once the story finishes, the current protagonist will awaken in Kaenriah, now being the Sibling, a human half of the Traveler we played as.

And what will happen to the current Traveler?

Let's go now to the 5th and 6th Archon Quest of the theory:

NATLAN AND LIYUE + THE FATE PARADOX

Remember ¨Der ring des nibelungen¨:

  • The Rhinemaidens (Rhinedottir) custody the gold that can be used to forge a ring that gives the owner absolute dominion over the nibelungs. To create such ring, one must abandon all love.
    • The reason why Rhinedottir is interested in Surtalogi, is because his ideololgy focuses on abandoning love for power.
  • THE ¨CONTRACT¨: If you want absolute power, you must renounce to your heart.
    • NOTE: in CH.4 we will explain the role of Rhinedottir and her relationship with the HP
The writer's ring
  • VERY IMPORTANT: The Traveler will have to abandon their heart

If we remember the start of the post, we will realize that if Paimon is the heart of the PO, and the PO is the ¨writer¨ of Teyvat, then that makes Paimon....

  • THE NARRATOR: of Teyvat. The heart of the writer is the narrator. The one who guides the reader through the story.

So if the HP is the god of the universe itself, if the Traveler becomes the writer, who is their heart?

  • THE PRIMORDIAL ONE: and ¨narrator¨ of the universe.
    • We theorized since CH.1, that the PO modeled Teyvat upon the memories of the past Traveler. ¨Following all that is remembered¨
    • Based on that hypothesis, we arrived at plausible conclusions, using each Archon Quest as a baseline to predict the future, which would mean that...
    • EACH ARCHON QUEST IS A NARRATION OF THE UNIVERSE (¨World Order Narration¨)

If you think it that way, these theories are extremely organic, for we are just ¨reading¨ the narration that the PO made for the Traveler.

¨Strength¨ (HEART OF THE HP/PO), passed down for a thousand years, and the sin it births. - The Primordial One goes through the cycles of the universe remembering the last iteration

-Strenght XIII

Remember the ¨fragmentation of the ego¨?

  • THE THREE DEADLY SELVES OF THE HP/WRITER:
    • HERO, VILLAIN AND NARRATOR

In that moment, she would surely sever her Three Deadly Selves — an act through which she would abandon her former self (past Traveler merged with the Irminsul of the Universe), lie hidden among the mortals (PO/Holy Spirit: the presence of God on earth), and keep kindled a final chance for vengeance against the heavens (Sibling: the one tasked to ¨destroy¨ the old Traveler).

-Zibai/Profile

  • NOTE: her fragments have red, blue and golden eyes. In these theories I have represented the PO as white but they should be represented as golden*.* Like the Moon Sisters and the HP, their colours are red (Sonnet-Sibling), golden (Aria-PO), and the one who survives, the blue one (Traveler-Canon)

We said that the ¨heart¨ in Genshin is conceived as the ¨storage for memories¨.

Does this sound like a certain Natlan character?

  • CAPITANO: who lets go of his heart with stored memories and sits on the frozen throne to ¨merge¨ with the system that flows through creation.

If you pay attention, you will see that all of the Archon Quests (except the Prologue) talk about ¨replacing/destroying the old order¨.

What about Natlan?

  • KEY POINT: The HP is the god of the Abyss
  • GOSOYTHOTH: who at last takes the form of an abyssal dragon, represents the past Traveler/old HP themselves.
    • NOTE: we already mentioned that the Traveler is represented by the dragon, Neuvillette, in Fontaine. In CH.4, we will explain the dragon symbolsim and their relationship with Rhinedottir.

¨The scales are symbol of reason¨

-The World XXI

Remember TTDS?

Five Heroes embarked on a journey to slay the evil dragon.

-Thrilling Tales of Dragon Slayers

This ¨evil dragon¨ is not Irmin, but the past Traveler and old HP.

WHY IS IT EVIL?

Farewell, archaic lord

This is, by far, the MOST IMPORTANT conclusion of the whole theories, and in this section, we will explain why the next universe is the ¨paradise¨ and what does ¨freedom¨ truly mean.

  • THE IMPOSED FATE: if each universe is created upon the memories of the last, each of them inherits the fate the past Traveler wanted for the universe.

¨What does freedom mean when demanded to you by a god¨

-Dainsleif

  • FREEDOM OF FATE: even being an abyssal user who ¨supposedly¨ is free from their fate, is following their ¨fate to be free¨. All the current universe is a ¨prison¨ designed by the past Traveler.
    • Being free from fate doesn't mean to live in chaos, but...
    • TO WRITE YOUR OWN FATE
    • FREEDOM IS ONLY FREEDOM WHEN DEMANDED TO YOU BY YOURSELF

¨Most are content to live, and not to dream¨ Those who accept the imposed fate
¨...there are those who dream of dreaming¨ Those who want the universe to be rewritten - Traveler's dream

-Dainsleif

However, the villains of the game, don't decide the end of the universe.

  • VERY IMPORTANT: They are not ¨ending¨ the universe for those who love it, that's a natural process, the ¨divine punishment of existance¨: that everything will end.
    • Think of the universe as a human and destruction as time moving forward, this force doesn't want to destroy the human, but the human will one day die.
    • If time didn't move forward, the human wouldn't be able to perceive reality and wouldn't be able to exist.
    • This force will one day kill the human, but it never decided that the human should die.
    • The only thing that this force can do for the human is guide them to the ¨afterlife¨.
    • The ¨evil villains who try to destroy the universe¨, are a lie to make us think that the red Abyss wants to ¨assassinate¨ the universe, when in reality, the universe will just ¨die of old age¨.

Thanks to destruction, time moves forward. One day, this force will move everything to its end, but that doesn't mean that life isn't worth living.

  • ¨HUMAN GROWTH¨: calling the red Abyss destruction is deceitful, now that we have understood what it really is, let's maybe call it ¨evolution¨.
    • RED ABYSS IS NOT DESTRUCTION, IT'S EVOLUTION
    • ¨The force that reads the story for us, and the one that bears the responsibility of making the reader become writer¨
    • That is why the ultimate goal of the Sibling/Hroptatyr is making us ascend.

¨Destruction¨ loves humanity, like no angel or god could ever love them. That is why they are Jesus.

¨I will always remember how she, too, loved these flowers¨ - The Inteyvats are the characters of the story before being conceived

-Dainsleif about Lumine/Sibling

The role of the Sibling is to enlighten the one who can build the paradise, the Traveler.

The dream of the reader, the next cycle.

In the last universe, Aether (Sibling) and Paimon/PO fused with Lumine. This universe is the dream of Lumine. The next will be the dream of Aether. The one with Inteyvats is the ¨canon¨ Sibling, for their divine half dreamt the universe.

A universe anew.

One when the fate is CHOSEN and not IMPOSED. Where everyone writes their own fate. This is not an act of rebellion, but of mercy upon an old and dying universe. Like leading an old human to heaven.

¨Until the Abyss has engulfed the thrones, my war with destiny will see no end¨

-Sibling

  • THE WILL OF CREATION: In the final battle, when the Traveler fuses with the PO, they will connect with the Irminsul of the Universe the same way they connected with the Akasha and all the people of Sumeru.
    • The Traveler will ¨hear¨ the desired fate of every single character, of every flower, and dream of the new paradise upon these dreams.
      • Some characters will be the same, as they were already living their desired fate.
      • Some will change, be rewritten.
    • ¨But mortal arrogation never stops¨

And then, in this new universe, there will be those who now want to change themselves again, those who reject the paradise of the last universe, and dream of dreaming.

That is the sin of humanity. Wanting to change, to grow. That is why those who defy fate are deemed sinners.

¨I say we humans have our humanity¨

-Dainsleif

  • THE REDEMPTION OF THE UNIVERSE: think of it like this:
    • The current universe lives under an imposed fate from the past Traveler
    • The next universe, will be written by the current Traveler, who will ¨create the fate that this universe desired¨*,* like the universe itself writting its own fate*.*
    • THE PARADOX OF FATE: however, by doing so, the Traveler will be imposing a new story upon the next universe, and the cycle will repeat.
There are those who dream of dreaming...

Now you understand why the next universe is conceived as ¨paradise¨ and why destruction is ¨liberation¨ to the eyes of the ¨villains¨ of the game, so I ask you again:

  • If you knew the nature of Genshin's universe... would you wisely guide humanity to the next universe? Or would you foolishly explore the wonders of the current universe?
  • Both answers are as human as the other.

The more you understand, the more you realize the whole universe wants to end and be rewritten by you.

And why is this important?

Well because Mavuika represents the PO and the Traveler represents, ironically, the Sibling, in Natlan's AQ.

  • THE OLD HP: Mavuika and the Traveler are the ones tasked with ending with Gosoythoth, like the Holy Spirit (PO) and the Son (Sibling) are tasked to follow the divine plan to one day ¨kill the old HP¨.
  • CAPITANO: represents the Traveler, who after understanding their role, decides to merge with the ley lines and abandon his heart with all of his stored memories.
    • Like the Traveler merging with the Irminsul of the Universe.
Your new heart... our land, our dignity, and every comrade who fights alongside us... no hero should have to wonder alone.

Liyue bears a similar message:

  • ¨FAREWELL, ARCHAIC LORD¨: in Liyue, the past HP is represented by Osial, a ¨beast of the sea¨. Zhongli ¨retiring¨and living with mortals is just an analogy of the HP ¨merging¨ with the Irminsul of the Universe.
    • THE GOD/WRITER MERGING WITH THEIR CREATION
    • He is also introduced after the ¨death of a dragon¨, as he faked his death.
  • OSIAL: is the ¨evil representation¨ of the old HP.

In CH.4 we will explain exactly why the Traveler is associated with dragons and water, and explain who the current Traveler is inside the symbolism of the game.

SPOILER: we are Jormungandr in norse mythology, Demiurge in gnosticism and the Gesamtkunstwerk in Wagner's tradition. A snake that after the seven-fold steps turns into a dragon and gives birth to the universe

SNEZNHAYA?

We can only say that at the end the Irminsul will burn and lead way to a new tree for Teyvat, the tree of New Kaenriah.

The message about ¨replacing the old world¨ in this Archon Quest is evident, and will be presented as Teyvat not being written by the PO anymore.

THE SEVEN FOLD STEPS

Following all that is remembered
The ¨world¨ stands firm

-The World XXI

Let's close the first 3 chapters with the cycle of the archon quests:

  • MONDSTADT/PROLOGUE: sets the idea of the fairytale and the characters of the evil dragon (Dvalin/Nibelung), the knight (Venti/PO), the wicked mage (Abyss mage/Hroptatyr), the hero (Traveler) and the princess who commands the mage (Sibling).

Then the it goes:

NOTE: Nod Krai was explicitly said to be an ¨extra¨ nation.

  • LIYUE: The HP leaves their creation for them to grow by themselves.
  • INAZUMA: Mortals fight oppression from the divine order of a god who decided to erradicate those who grew beyond what was allowed and ¨split themselves¨ in power and heart (Shogun and Ei/PO and Paimon)
    • NOTE: this story also refers to ¨killing¨ the old HP, the ¨evil dragon¨ who imprisoned the universe.
  • SUMERU: Sibling builds the HP/god inside of an ever-looping world to have a substitute for the decaying world order, using Hroptatyr as a mask to hide them.
  • FONTAINE: Upon destruction of the universe, the human half of a god (Sibling/Furina) is tasked to act so the Divine Throne (the old HP/Focalors) is destroyed and give the power to the one who can forgive humanity (Traveler/Neuvillette) so they aren't disolved upon the flood of the Abyss.
  • NATLAN: At the end, the old HP/evil dragon is defeated and the Traveler (Capitano) merges with the Irminsul of the Universe, becoming the new writer and, letting go of the PO(their heart) with their stored memories, so they can become the ¨narrator¨ of the next universe.
  • SNEZNHAYA: At last, the old universe burns away for a new universe to be displayed (creation of New Kaenriah). The old story dies, and the paradise (new cycle) where the universe is free to choose their own fate is created.

The Old HP seizes FREEDOM and creates the CONTRACTS (rules) of creation to set their story for ETERNITY, but only after WISDOM of the truth is achieved, the new god will grant JUSTICE to creation, end the WAR between old writer and universe, so the LOVE of the New HP will lead way for FREEDOM.

And the cycle will repeat...

A never-ending cosmic performance.

GOODNIGHT, TRAVELER

The End

¨Now you who has set foot in this world, your journey has reached its end, but one final doorway remains¨
¨Step forward, if you have understood the meaning of your journey¨

-Dainsleif

And now, the universe tells you:

¨You who have heard every story, child of creation, dream of new worlds, dream of new journeys, dream of heroes and of villains, dream of partings and encounters¨
¨Dream of your new paradise¨

And you might hear it say:

¨I had a very, very long dream...¨
¨In it, people were holding hands, dancing in circle, be they sages or fools, dancers or warriors, puppets or statues of gods...¨
¨That dancing circle embodied everything about the universe¨

And you will hear it say.

You, are the universe.

You cross the door, and the universe asks you:

What will you write next?

Goodnight, Traveler.

END OF CHAPTER 3

We could perfectly end the theories here, but that would be too boring wouldn't it.

Here it's CH.4.

Until then...

Ad astra abyssosque!

r/Genshin_Lore Mar 11 '26

Abyss why the heavenly principles is kinda inactive

22 Upvotes

low-key every time the heavenly principles interfere, it has something to do with the abyss and forbidden knowledge. even when dottore tore open the false sky and seized the trilune authority, the heavenly principles didn't interfere bc it didn't have much to do with forbidden knowledge. i genuinely think there is something about forbidden knowledge that is a threat to their authority.

hc that the abyss might be related to the past planets the heavenly principles had a hand in the destruction of (if they went to any before that, but since they're descenders i assume they did)?

r/Genshin_Lore Oct 18 '25

Abyss The Primordial One is the Master of the Abyss

65 Upvotes

Ok, so this is a bit of a long shot. I'm not sure I entirely believe this myself, but it occurred to me it is a possibility we cannot discount.

The Primordial One, Phanes, the Ruler of Celestia, First Descender, is a master of abyssal power. This may seem ridiculous, after all, the PO is master of the light realm, they are the very opposing force to the abyss. Ronova even saw fit to bend the rules to help Natlan fight the Abyss.

Celestia's enemies, foremost of which are the Dragon Nibelung, some of his Dragon Sovereigns, and the 5 Sinners of Khaenri'ah, tend to get painted as the ones who play with Abyssal power, and are behind the many forms of Abyssal corruption that exist in Teyvat.

But here's the thing, what if they pursued Abyssal Power, not because they couldn't gain the Light Realm Authority to defeat the PO, but because they were following the very template the PO set out.

Nibelung was the original master of the Light Realm, yet he, for some reason, believed he could not contend with the PO without Abyssal power. That suggests that his opponent, the PO had some advantage, that they possessed a power beyond the Light Realm Authority they had usurped.

Similarly, whilst the Sinners undoubtedly wield abyssal power, the Pale Princess and the Three Pygmies suggests that they divided up and consumed the power of a descender, gaining authority over the light realm in the process. This same story also refers to the Primordial One as 'The Night Mother'. Maybe it's just Khaenri'ahn propaganda to call the master of the light realm 'The Night Mother'. Or maybe... they actually are a being possessing the power of the night, the Abyss.

When we look at the shades, we see that Ronova, Istaroth and Asmoday each possess darkened/corrupted hands/arms. Rhinedottir does not, which seems paradoxical, considering she is one of the individuals most associated with abyssal power. Perhaps it is because she is in a fresh body.

In any case, there is one big question here; If the Abyss was a power wielded by the PO since the beginning, why was it only introduced to Teyvat upon Nibelung's arrival? The answer to this is twofold:

  1. The Primordial One did not have to use their abyssal power when they first came to Teyvat. The Throne of Light was vacant, they took it, and then even the threat of abyssal power kept the moons and other powerful beings in line.
  2. Nibelung and the Sinners were novices at controlling Abyssal Power, at least at first. They couldn't help but contaminate their surroundings, especially as they started putting the power into use upon the material realm of Teyvat. On the other hand, the PO has had an untold amount of time to master it, travelling the cosmos just like Surtalogi is now.

If we want to explain the behaviour of Celestia, then the answer is that they wanted to eliminate competition, whether that be Dragons or Khaenri'ahns. The Abyss is bad when my enemy uses it. So we call it 'forbidden knowledge', but we'll keep a little on the side for ourselves just in case. I think Abyssal Power takes a serious toll on whoever uses it, even if you are a master as powerful as the PO. It's not the use of light realm power that requires the PO to take constant multi-century naps, it's the use of abyssal power as a defense mechanism of last resort.

But in the end, as Neuvillette says, you can't fight fire with fire, Nibelung was wrong to try and use the tools of his enemy. Light Realm authority may be scattered at the moment, but the only true way to oppose the void (as exemplified by Celestia in the eyes of Neuvillette) is to reunite that power, and show that only true light can defeat the darkness.

r/Genshin_Lore Nov 05 '25

Abyss The Symbol of the Abyss is found in the designs of all 4 Shades

140 Upvotes

Genshin has a great many symbols that recur all over the place. These symbols are attached to characters and locations to indicate an association with a certain faction, concept or power source. Some of these symbols are obvious and well explained, such as elemental symbols, whilst others are enigmatic or obscured in their meaning. One example is the Triquetra, which was shown to represent the 3 moons, fate, and their authority over past, present and future.

However one symbol which is quite rare in Genshin, yet undoubtedly important, is what I would call the 'Symbol of the Abyss'. There are many factions associated with the abyss, such as the Abyss Order, the Sinners, Khaenri'ah as a whole, and the Abyssally corrupted dragons. These factions draw upon the abyss, and may have their own symbols, but the symbol of their faction is not the symbol for abyssal power itself.

Ronova kills a space within one of Asmoday's cubes, marked with the Symbol of the Abyss

This symbol can be presented a variety of ways, but is usually shown as two cups forming a circle, each with a lip on opposite ends. This symbol represents a black hole, with its accretion disk.

The Lightless Eye of the Maelstrom, an item received for defeating the All Devouring Narwhal

The Lightless Eye of the Maelstrom depicts a black hole exactly like the symbol on Asmoday's cubes. Its description, and the descriptions of the other boss drops of the ADN all make allusions to the nature of abyssal power. This same black hole is present in Surtalogi's character model.

Ok, so we've established that this is present at least in objects created by Asmoday's power, but what about the other shades?

The Ruler of Life, Naberius

In this art of Naberius, we see 3 key symbols. The first is the triquetra, symbol of celestial authority over fate. All the shades have this. The second is the DNA/double-helix motif, which represents life. Neuvillette also shares this motif. But finally we have 4 Symbols of the Abyss floating about. They aren't on her outfit, but floating about as part of her power, just like Asmoday.

The Ruler of Death, Ronova

Ronova likewise possesses the triquetra, as well as the many eyes in her outfit. On her arm you see a circle with points on opposite ends and a dot in the middle. This looks very similar to her eyes, and so could be mistaken as such. However it is very similar in particular to Asmoday's version of the symbol. Now, I understand if that on its own isn't enough to convince you, but then there's this:

Ronova placing the curse of immortality upon the pure-blooded Khaenri'ahns, as Pierro(Eftervit?) watches on

What have we here? It looks like Ronova is effectively summoning a black hole, With the pointed bar of light across the centre presented exactly like the Lightless Eye of the Maelstrom.

The Ruler of Time, Istaroth

Of all the shades, Istaroth is perhaps the most iffy here. She clearly has 4-pointed stars, both symmetrical and long tailed. She also has the triquetra on the lower part of her gown, although it's only seen in one shot. But on her 'crown', there is a circle with two points on opposite ends. This could correspond to the same Symbol of the Abyss.

Lunar Arcanum X: The Wheel of Fortune

We also have this depiction of Istaroth with 6 spheres floating about her. We might theorize the top 3 to be the moon sisters, but one feature present on several of these spheres is a disc of purple energy floating around them, likely representing the abyss. My gut feeling is that Istaroth is the most reluctant of the shades to draw upon Abyssal power, and she is crying here over the knowledge of the inevitable consequences of the use of abyssal energy.

As a final note I would like to say that I do not think the PO/4 shades only use the power of the abyss, but that they sort of react the light energy with the abyssal energy to generate more power. Durin does something similar to Rerir's power, strengthening Columbina. I think they try and hide this fact, but certainly Pierro and most of the Sinners know.

So what do you think? Have you seen this symbol elsewhere in the game?

r/Genshin_Lore Mar 09 '26

Abyss THE TRUTH BEHIND GENSHIN [CHAPTER 1/2]: The role of the villain + THE STRUCTURE OF THE UNIVERSE

85 Upvotes
To understand the world one must be put upside down.

Hi there and wish you a lovely day everyone!

Let's invert our perspectives today.

  • The 1st chapter (current) will be focused on the structure of Genshin's universe.
  • The 2nd chapter will be focused on the storyline of Genshin.

We will create doubt in this chapter and explain it in the second one. (soon to be posted and linked)

[THE TRUTH BEHIND GENSHIN [CHAPTER 2/2]: The reunion of the Twins. Hroptatyr's true identity + the main villain. THE NATURE OF OUR TRAVEL AND THE ORIGINAL SIN]

Destruction and creation... the villain and the hero. Now for Genshin we can already set the Traveler as the hero of the story but... who is the villain?

These two posts are but a ¨continuation¨ of a 3 chapter group of posts I made not so long ago, in which I defend Hroptatyr, The Wise, to be the main villain that Genshin has been hiding since its release.

HOWEVER:

  • THE LIE: during this post, I will feed into two incredibly important liesThe readers can try to find them if they want, before I explain them in [CHAPTER 2/2] and reveal the truth.
    • One lie is about Hroptatyr's true identity, and the second, about his real plan.

NOTE: when doing these theories, I realized how straight-forward Hoyo is when considering Lumine the Sibling. I'll refer to them as the Sibling, but some symbolism will inevitable lead to Lumine.

Now then:

HROPTATYR IS THE MAIN VILLAIN?

In [CH.2/2] I'll explain the relationship between Hroptatyr and the other candidates to be the main villain, but for now, let's just talk about him.

Here are the aforementioned posts ([CH.1][CH.2][CH.3]) if you want to read them with proof of every point made now.

  • I highly recommend the reader to check them so one can truly understand how everything ties back together, and how the theory has evolved.

This section of the post is skippable if you have read the previous ones, but to resume, let's take these points as a base for today's theories:

NOTE: the majority of these points will also be briefly re-explained during the two current posts. The importance of these is to establish Hroptatyr as a possible main villain.

  • Hroptatyr's and Vedrfolnir's goals are the same, destroying reason: one out of ambition, one out of kindness. [CH.1]
  • The ¨blasphemy against reason¨ means the destruction of the rules the HP creates[CH.1]
  • The pure abyss is red, the power of destruction, the purple abyss is but a mixture of pure abyss (red) and reason (blue), and it represents a reality without rules[CH.1]
  • Hroptatyr is the responsible of Rhinedottir's creatures corruption and the red abyss + descenders of the cyclic nature of Teyvat (destruction + creation = rewritting). [CH.1]
  • The sinner communicated with and corrupted Nibelung in the past; Hroptatyr manipulated Irmin and alongside Vedrfolnir, orquestrated the night of the Cataclysm[CH.2]
  • Hroptatyr killed Irmin and divided the power of the abyss amongst the sinners. [CH.2]
  • He inflitrated Asmoday's coding in the Cataclysm and used her to separate the siblings and keep the HP ¨trapped¨ until the right moment comes.The red cubes are a subproduct of Hroptatyr's power, not Asmoday's, they are errors in the system, files with ¨erased/destroyed¨ code. [CH.2]
  • He knew that the HP were an AI and used its code to inform Irmin of the arrival of the twins so they would capture one of them. [CH.2]
  • He's behind the foundation of the Fatui, Zandik/Dottore bears a part of his consciousness (like ravens to Odin), and he took part on the crisis of the frontiers during Luna IV: Dottore's plan to create his final god will need the beliefs of Nod Krai on the ¨True Moon Goddess¨ Columbina (we are currently in simulation that gathers them) and Rerir's powers. Hroptatyr's interest in this would be retrieving the ¨blasphemy against death¨ and in the future, the burning of Irminsul. [CH.2]

And their plan for the future [CH.3]:

VERY IMPORTANT: Hroptatyr creating an artificial god that rewrites the universe into abyss using 4 ingredients (Shouko no Kami set this pattern) to ascend:

  1. FAITH: The beliefs of New Kaenriah on the abyss (Fatui will burn the Irminsul and the Abyss Order + Loom of Fate create New Kaenriah: destruction + creation = new Irminsul).
  2. ABYSS: The combined abyssal power of the 5 sinners (Rerir thanks to Dottore's experiment, Surtalogi thanks to his prophetized defeat, Rhinedottir likely a direct confrontation, Vedrfolnir and himself).
  3. BODY: Hroptatyr's body + The abyss sibling forced to fuse with him.
  4. REASON: Absorbing the HP after waking them up with Asmoday.
The creation of a ¨Ruler Beyond Reason¨

And if you still don't believe me when I say he's the main villain, let's practice pattern recognition:

¨Where there are heroes, there must be wicked mages...¨

¨... and where are knights, there must be evil dragons¨

-The Wicked Mage's Plumage

This idea sets the central characters which are involved in Genshin's stories:

  • REMEMBER THIS*: The knight and the evil dragon fight first*, the knight wins, but the dragon was never truly evil, but used by the wicked mage.
    • It's the duty of the hero to stop the wicked mage, the true villain of the story.

VERY IMPORTANT: Let's compare Sumeru's AQ, Nod-Krai's AQ and Genshin's story.

  • HEROTraveler for all 3
  • KNIGHT: Nahida for Sumeru, Columbina for Nod-Krai, HP for Genshin
  • EVIL DRAGON: Scaramouche for Sumeru, Rerir for Nod-Krai, Nibelung for Genshin
  • WICKED MAGE: Dottore for Sumeru, Dottore for Nod-Krai, Hroptatyr for Genshin

(We could add Narzissenkreuz Ordo with Traveler, Alain, Jakob and René, or Mondstadt's AQ with Traveler, Varka, Dvalin and abyss mage)

Furthermore, the stories that involve the creation of a god also have the character of the princess, who is often used by the wicked mage for his goals.

  • PRINCESS: Nilou for Sumeru, Sandrone for Nod-Krai, Sibling for Genshin
  • Nilou was the origin of the Samsara, Sandrone's formula could be the origin of the simulation which Dottore used to trap us, and the Sibling will be the origin of New Kaenriah.

So after identifying him as a potential ¨main villain¨ of the game, let's talk about the relevance of such role.

THE ROLE OF DESTRUCTION

Now we could jump into a very powerful conclusion:

  • KEY POINT: Without Hroptatyr, the story wouldn't happen to begin with.

Dragons and humans would live in harmony, the twins wouldn't have been separated in the ship, Kaenriah wouldn't end up with an obsessive usage of abyss, and there would be no conflict at all.

To understand what this means, let's set up an analogy on Genshin's world structure.

¨Colours out of Space¨

Two forces of nature exist in constant clash.

  • Reason (blue): The power to define and create, the writting pen.
  • Abyss (red): The power to blur and destroy, the eraser.

But there is something more. Reason needs a canvas to create. A book for a story to be written in.

  • The craft of the writting pen is the storytherefore it is implicit to reason that a blank book ever existed
  • The craft of the eraser is the blank booktherefore it is implicit to the abyss that there exist a story to erase

When the eraser meets the written story, it unveils the blank book by destroying what was written. The blank book is the purple abyss:

  • IMPORTANT: The purple abyss is not destruction nor creation but the ¨true¨ world. The fusion of pure red abyss and reason is the blank book, the boundless and undefined world. Everything that could've been but never was.
  • VERY IMPORTANTAbyss needs to destroy reason to reveal purple abyss, and reason needs purple abyss to create.

This is why HP never tried to purify/absorb Gosoythoth nor the purple abyss beneath Teyvat even though descenders have such power, because they needed it like ¨fuel¨ to write Teyvat.

Like the pen needs the blank book.

THE REAL PROBLEM: THE UNIVERSE IS DYING

Through the Hexenzirkel and by observing the outer space we know that the universe outside Teyvat is dying consumed by the abyss.

The End of the Story

The abyss that lies beyond Teyvat is red because it hasn't yet fused with reason, therefore it stays in its primal form. Red abyss is destruction as we have already defined, therefore, one day the whole universe will be completely ¨destroyed¨.

¨And I shall shed a tear at the end of time... as I gaze back upon your life¨

-Vedrfolnir, The Visionary

  • VERY IMPORTANT: Genshin's universe operates like a story, the universe dying is the story coming to its end.

Vedrfolnir and Hroptatyr are aware that in the future the end of time will happen. The end of the story. The Ragnarok.

The Heavenly Principles are aware of this. Teyvat orbits a black hole so that the collapse of the universe reaches us later than the rest of the cosmos.

We are orbitting a black hole

The Creators of the twins and the HP were aware of thisTraveler's final role is to oppose the death of the universe by ¨writting a new story¨ at the end of time (further explained at the end of the post).

"I am the void at the moment of creation, I am the newborn spark when all things end."

-The Fool XXII (Traveler's card)

THE VILLAIN'S ROLE

Let's remember the implication we made earlier:

  • KEY POINT: Without ¨Hroptatyr¨, without the main villain*, the story wouldn't happen*
  • VITAL POINT: If the villain would've never existed, there would be no conflict and the story would've never be told.

Back to our analogies:

  • The Irminsul is the written book of the story (OF TEYVAT). It acts like a server that gathers information. Every page exists simultaneously, but they only make sense read in order. Each moment of time exists at the same time, yet causality is what makes the pages move forward in harmony. The next event to the current event will be its consequences and the previous, its causes.
  • The written story is fate, unmovable.
  • Red abyss is the eraser, reason is the writting pen, the blank book is the purple abyss. Therefore someone with the power to erase and write, abyss and reason, can rewrite the story.
    • In Luna III, Durin introduced ¨variables¨ (that is how Genshin calls the blank spaces, undefined variables) by erasing possible futures for the hyperborean on how he would meet his death using abyssal power. Yet he didn't have the power to write a new story for him so his death was inevitable.
  • The HP would be the writer (OF TEYVAT) (Nibelung was the first writer that went to space, the HP ended what Nibelung started so they became the new writer and Nibelung, a reader)
  • The Traveler and the descenders, would be readers. The Traveler, when purifying the purple abyss, is just using the power of reason to ¨imagine¨ what could fill that blank space.
    • If a writer doesn't state the colour of a character's hair, the reader must imagine the blank space that the colour represents*, imagine the colour of the hair. That is purifying purple abyss: defining variables.*

Then if the universe is dying it would mean the end of the story. Not of Teyvat's story, the Irminsul, but of Genshin's universe story.

  • VERY IMPORTANT: Teyvat acts like a microcosm separated from the universe.

¨However, Phanes, the Primordial One, used the eggshell to separate the "universe" and the "microcosm¨ of the world.¨

-Before the Sun and Moon

  • VERY IMPORTANT: the sinners (also called trascendant ones), the traveler, the HP and Nibelung, are not tied to the fate of the microcosm (Teyvat) but to the fate of the universe, they are ¨trascendental beings¨ because they are characters of a greater story than Teyvat's. They have a role inside the story of Genshin, not Teyvat.
    • Starting inside the ¨microcosm¨, Teyvat, and by trascending such story, they became characters of the ¨universe¨.
  • CRUCIAL POINTThen if the main villain never existed, the book would also be blank.

If Hroptatyr's goal is to recalculate the universe into the abyss, reach the end of the story, so he could free unlimited knowledge, then....

Why doesn't he just... sit back and wait for the inevitable? Isn't it stupid from him to be the main villain if without him the story would've already been blank?

  • THE ROLE OF THE VILLAIN: without a villain, the universe would have already collapsed. Their function is to assume the role of the villain so the story can happen. The villain is just ¨buying the Traveler time¨the time that our story lasts, for us to grow and realize how to write a story at the end of time.

The story ends when the villain wins or when he is defeated.

Then it wont matter if we win or if we lose, the universe will collapse either way.

Stories are bound to end.

  • KEY POINT: Then why does a story happen?
  • CONFLICT: A story happens because there is conflict. It's not about creation or desctruction winning against the other, is about one fighting the other. It's not about the knight or the evil dragon, it's not about the hero or the wicked mage, it's about that where one exists the other shall too, so their conflict keeps the world living. Like a story. The purple abyss, the ¨truth¨ of Genshin is not the harmonic fusion beetween abyss and reason, but the conflict beetween them:
Reason creates, abyss destroys.

¨Where there are heroes, there must be wicked mages...¨

¨... and where are knights, there must be evil dragons¨

That's the universe's formula. The equation that sustains the world. Given one, the other one must exist. That is the truth that Celestia hid.

  • FORBIDDEN KNOWLEDGE WAS NEVER FORBIDDEN: the Heavenly Principles never tried to forbid such knowledge from humans. They just kept it hidden behind a puzzle. So only the right person would find the solution.

The inverted world, the demon names of deities, the false sky, the transmutation...all clues for humanity to doubt the heavens and find the truth.

The Hanged Man XII
  • THE HANGED MAN: the intelligence that mortals grasp ¨cannot said to be false¨, because it was never a lie, it was but the ¨inverted truth¨. That's why only someone who had put themselves upside-down could see such truth.

That was the plan of the Creators. Maybe not even the Heavenly Principles were actively aware of it.

Every nation that questioned the truth of Celestia was an ¨experiment¨:

  • Lang-gan, Vindagnyr, Hyperborea... All unsuccesful experiments, humans found corruption in abyss instead of truth. The mechanism of the Heavenly Principles to deal with them was an automatic response from the system, a celestial nail.
  • Kaenriah was succesful. ¨A situation that the Heavenly Principles could not afford to ignore¨. The system had finally found humans that found growth in conflict, and not corruption.

Because in Kaenriah, a human managed to solve the puzzle.

That human found the equation of the world and realized that one side was missing, that they were meant to be the villain.

The right side, destruction, was unstable, and the equation had to be stabilized. The first human in Teyvat's history that understood the truth of the universe:

  • THE SOLUTION OF THE EQUATION: The universe is sutained by conflict. A story needs both villains and heroes to create conflict. They decided to take the role of the villain and wield destruction so that the one who could rewrite the world could learn the truth hidden within the Abyss.

The purpose of the experiments, the purpose of the nations that questioned Celestia, was to find the main villain, for them to create a story that would show the Traveler how to become the writer.

Why would the creators send two descenders if one already was able to become the new writer?

  • OUR SIBLING: Because one was never meant to be a descender.

In my previous posts I theorized that Hroptatyr and Irmin, as they were aware of the code of the AI and knew that the twins existed, could had ¨written a story¨ for our sibling, making them a new character instead of a reader (descender). However this would imply they had the power of reason by that time.

KEY POINT: What if they just... picked the right one?

  • One was a reader. Their role was to become the new writer, using their power to define. The descender twin, the Traveler.
  • One was a character. Their role was to be used by whoever solved the puzzle to fulfill his ¨plans¨ as the main villain of the story. Hroptatyr knew which one of the twins he had to ¨summon¨ in Kaenriah for the story to happen.

THE LIE BEHIND OUR TRAVEL: That twin was meant to be captured by him so the other one, the Traveler, would have a purpose to explore the world. Finding their sibling. An ¨incentive¨ to experience the world, to read the story. That is why the Traveler's lunar arcanum card is The Fool:

One star is bigger than the other

"One star rises in the heavens, one star falls in the valley, the two have always been the same."

-The Fool XXII Lunar Arcanum's last line

The plan of The Creators.

Were there are heroes, there must be wicked mages. The princess (abyss sibling) is a motivation for the hero to fight the mage.

But the mage is just a mask.

INVERT OUR PERSPECTIVES

Now let's invite the readers to put themselves upside down to understand the role of the villain.

We will begin analyzing two Lunar Arcanum cards: The Hanged Man XII and The Devil XV

THE HANGED MAN XII

The Hanged Man XII

¨The opulent light sinks into the dark depths beneath the earth,
Seeking to redeem the radiance that is fated to be extinguished.¨

  • NOT INVERTED: The writer (HP) having to ¨sink¨ into the abyss to write a story, justification of the analogy that the purple abyss beneath Teyvat is the blank book it needs to write. The ¨radiance fated to be extinguished¨ is humanity.
  • INVERTEDThe ¨opulent light¨, the human, finds the truth and decides to wield destruction, so they can redeem humanity by writing a story for them.

Yet "redemption" is a word filled with arrogance,
There is an implicit meaning hidden within,
That mortals have done some clear wrong that must be corrected.

  • NOT INVERTED: Humans have comitted arrogation multiple times, so the HP creates new humans for them to have the opportunity to redeem themselves and not be consumed by the abyss.
  • INVERTED: The arrogance of humanity, what ¨mortals have done wrong that must be corrected¨, is rejecting conflict.

That is the key. The orginal sin:

  • THE ARROGANCE OF MANKIND: since the purple abyss is conflict, the ones who reject it are the ones who get corrupted. The arrogance of mankind is not being able to understand conflict and getting corrupted by it. But as we have already defined, conflict is a dual concept of creation and desctruction, so the corrupted humans, who could only understand creation, were never capable of growing up.
    • The arrogance/sin of mankind is wanting to grow up without overcoming and understanding conflict, the purple abyss.

But human arrogation never stops (humanity always keeps on growing)

-Dainsleif, Teyvat trailer

The main villain tries to redeem humanity by writting a story for them to grow. By giving them conflict.

¨You are like a flower born in sin yet pure, spotless¨

-Vedrfolnir, The Visionary

¨A sinner... Yes, salvation for a sinner can only come from a sinner...¨

-Clothar Alberich

  • VERY IMPORTANT: If humans are born in sin, then only a sinner can save them.

Only a villain can write their story.

  • VITAL POINTthe plan of the Creators was creating The Wise (notice how I didn't choose to say Hroptatyr), a human that would realize that conflict sustains the universe and take their role as the villain.

Let's remember a quote from the start of the game:

¨The arrogation of mankind ends now¨

-Asmoday

  • VERY IMPORTANT: What Asmoday says is not about punishing humanity, but redeeming it. The redemption of humanity is conflict: the story. Hroptatyr/the villain being her new master explains this.
  • VITAL POINTShe is starting our story. Therefore, she is redeeming humanity. The arrogation of humanity ended when the story started, when conflict and purpose were settled.

For us to create, the villain would destroy.

THE DEVIL XV

The Devil XV

VERY IMPORTANT NOTE: this card is different than the rest, for it is already written under the perspective of The Hanged Man to begin with.

Was there ever a true age of darkness?
Where ignorance and shadow were mistaken for divine,
And the "Devil" was hailed as creator.
Where violence and suffering ran rampant,
A "Dark Age" of savagery that burned through civilization.

  • NOT INVERTED: The one who wrote this, The Hanged Man, believes that the age were the one he considers the Devil rules, ¨where reason exists¨, hides the truth of the universe. A ¨Dark Age¨ that after the erasure of the universe and its recalculation into the abyss will bring us to the boundless ¨Age of Enlightment¨.

The Hanged Man writing this card implies too that for us, the Traveler/The Fool, the Devil is not the HP but Hroptatyr/The Wisethe one who wrote it.

  • INVERTED: The age of darkness is the current world were only the villain understands destruction and the rest of humans are corrupted by it. The ¨Age of Enlightment¨ will be the moment when the Traveler, the readers, will understand it too.
    • ¨Where violence and suffering ran rampant¨: nobody had ¨harnessed¨ violence and suffering, that there didn't exist a character to wield destruction.

The "Devil" is merely a mask,
Through which the power of darkness is revealed.

  • NOT INVERTED: The Hanged Man, believes that the HP, the Devil, is a mask to reach the power of darkness, the blank book (purple abyss) and the truth of the world.
    • VITAL POINT: The destruction of the mask will lead to THEIR enlightment.
  • INVERTED: The Hanged Man, the villain, the Devil, is just a mask for the Traveler/reader to understand the power of conflict.
    • VITAL POINTThe destruction of that mask, the reader finding that the villain is an actor to show us the truth of the world, will lead to OUR enlighment.
¨THE VILLAIN is merely a mask , through which the power of CONFLICT is revealed¨

Hroptatyr is the mask.

VERY IMPORTANT:

  • The Fatui, the fools, try to destroy the story and trascend their fates but they fail to realize they are actors of a greater story. The Fatui are characters inside the microcosm of Teyvat that don't realize that the story of the universe will remain even if they destroy this story.
    • The fool is fool for he thinks he is wise to his fate.

¨The sages think themselves to be al-knowing, but we alone are wise to a virtue in those acts of folly¨

-Pierro

  • The Wise tries to redeem humanity under the mask of a fool trying to destroy it. They know themselves to be a character of the universe's story and trascended the fate of Teyvat.
    • The Wise is wise for they know they are a fool to their fate.
The Wise hides under the mask of a fool: under the mask of a villain wanting to ascend to ¨writer¨ of the universe

The Wise is symbolically the creator of all fools.

Let's remember the universe's formula:

  • Where there is The Wise, there must be fools. (Dottore, a ¨segment¨ of Hroptatyr, made delusions for the Fatui. Dottore is represented upside down, for the inverted one of the fools is The WiseSymbolicallyThe Wise brings delusion to the fools)
The inverted one of The Fatui

As the greatest actor to ever exist, the villain has fooled the entire universe:

  • THE CONFLICT: The Traveler is The Fool XXII, and the inverted fool is The Wise.

The ¨Age of Enlightment¨ will start when everyone inverts their perspective and understands destruction, when every fool is made wise.

NORSE MYTHOLOGY

Starkaðr, Odin and Ratatösk

Hroptatyr is related to 3 different characters of the norse tradition:

  • Odin (Hroptatyr is a name of Odin): a god who was linked to self sacrifice for knowledge of the universe, who hanged himself upside down (Hanged Man) at the Yggdrasil (Irminsul) to understand the truth of the universe, and who lost an eye for the same purpose. A god who was known for taking ¨morally questionable¨ decissions*, but who always took them for the same reason:* to save humanity and prepare them and himself for Ragnarok
    • Preparing us for the end of the story, the collapse of the universe.
  • Starkaðr (his sword's name is Starkuthr): a hero who was blessed with a large lifespan, wisdom and being highly favoured by nobles*, but who was also* cursed to commit atrocities during his abnormally large lifespan, betraying 3 kings he served (explained in previous post):
    1. Irmin, the first king: he manipulated and killed him.
    2. Nibelung, the second king: he corruped him and started the war in the past.
    3. The HP, the third king: he will fuse with them to complete his god.
  • Ratatösk (the squirrel motif on his sword and the character Woobakwa from the boar princess, explained in previous post): a squirrel who deliberately sets conflict beetween Hræsvelgr (HP) and Nidhogg (Nibelung), the eagle at the top and the snake at the bottom of Yggdrasil. The squirrel that creates the conflict beetween chaos and order.
Squirrel motif: Ratatösk. Origin of conflict.
  • VITAL POINT: Odin was also the god who gave humanity the gift of poetry and since Ratatosk is the origin of conflict, it explains what we remarked of Hroptatyr/the villain giving humanity a story out of starting conflict.

Ad astra abyssosque, Travelers! From the stars to the Abyss!

The answer has been in front of us since the start! Katheryne tells us the answer everyday and we just ignore her!

When the time comes, the Traveler, unaware of their purpose, the one who foolishly explores the world, will be tasked with writing a new story upon the universe using our travel as a blueprint.

Create the Irminsul for the entire cosmos: ¨The World XXI¨.

The ¨universe¨ stands firm. You say: ¨My work is complete¨.

The golden lion bows its head,
And the silver tree sprouts buds.
Following all that is remembered,
The "world" stands firm.

  • The 1st part of The World XXI talks about the HP creating the ¨world¨/Teyvat: ¨the fortune that wove the world¨.

You follow each tiny piece of your memory,
The "universe" stands firm.

  • The 2nd part talks about the Traveler creating the ¨universe¨.

And they will need to comprehend the truth of the world that fighting a villain and searching for their sibling will show them.

  • THE NATURE OF OUR TRAVEL: The truth is neither the stars nor the Abyss, but the travel beetween from one to the other and viceversa¨Memory¨ is ¨design¨.
    • Therefore: ¨ad astra abyssosque¨.
  • VERY IMPORTANT: If the Traveler was to write a story without understanding this, they would write a story without conflict, a blank book.

For a story without conflict is no story at all.

The sinners are the mistakes the Traveler needs to grow up, their stories, lessons for us to understand the value of failure and destruction.

A fictional story of a band of five heroes who go off on a dragon hunt. It is poorly written and structurally incoherent. Its value lies in the many lessons that can be learned from failure.

-Thrilling Tales of the Dragon Slayers

The five heroes are the 4 sinners and Dainsleif.

Hroptatyr is their writer.

A lotus proceeds from my mouth and flowers bloom on the page.
My words are wise and clear and my thoughts are sharp like lightning.
I joined this party because I couldn't find a job, and anybody can be a copywriter.
But I'm no writer, just a regular fellow in his mid twenties without an honest job.

It would not be crazy to assume that the ship that brought the twins had one 4th passenger. The two twins, the HP...

And a virus.

A corrupted program that one day, in a kingdom without gods, would grow inside a human.

It manifested in a Kaenriahn human, the mechanism for the Traveler to learn how to create a stable world: ¨the many lessons that can be learned from failure¨- TTDS.

And for Hroptatyr:

He is just a ¨mask¨.

Our labour is to understand who is behind that mask and start the ¨Age of Enlightment¨. Where the reader becomes a new writer.

¨Where the reader understands the role of the human who was never chosen to be the hero

END OF CHAPTER 1/2

Before jumping into the 2nd post, remember that there was two great lies hidden in this post, and subtle (or maybe not so subtle) clues to find them.

Revealing the truth here would shackle the notion we have created of Hroptatyr and the one that Genshin has created for us about the universe so far, so I'll leave to the reader the choice of finding them by themselves or going to see the answer in the last chapter:

[THE TRUTH BEHIND GENSHIN [CHAPTER 2/2]: The reunion of the Twins. Hroptatyr's true identity + the main villain. THE NATURE OF OUR TRAVEL AND THE ORIGINAL SIN]

Ad astra abyssosque!

r/Genshin_Lore Mar 11 '26

Abyss UNIFIED THEORY OF EVERYTHING [INDEX + CHAPTER 1]: The two faces of the Abyss: destruction and nothingness.

50 Upvotes
An inverted world...

Hi there and wish you a lovely day everyone!

Today we will start a 22-chapter group of theories that will try to explain everything we can about Genshin's story/universe.

INTRODUCTION

These posts exist as an ¨expansion¨ of previous posts:

In these, I try to explain the true nature of the Abyss, the ¨role¨ of both Traveler and Sibling, the importance of destruction, and the ¨looping¨ nature of Genshin's universe, as well as predicting the upcoming story arcs.

  • THE PROBLEM: with those posts however, was that they were too long for them to be an easy read, and too short for them to explain everything.
  • SUMMARY: Take the previous posts as a ¨summary/TL;DR (a really long one) of this whole ¨Unified Theory of Everything¨. Though these theories will expand beyond the ideas there mentioned, reading them will help us understand the direction of each individual post here made.

The purpose of this ¨Unified Theory of Everything¨ is both to fragment the ideas of those theories so the readers aren't overwhelmed by the different amount of topics clashing there nor the lenght of the post by making shorter posts and explaining each topic with more complexity, ¨adding¨ more detail/proof to the original theory.

  • EXPANSION: For example, in the original theories, Dainsleif's role or the Pitch-Dark Void are mentioned as ¨interesting notes¨/extra info, while they will have their own individual post here.

But the most important function of this 22-chapter group of posts, will be opening the gates for readers to share their opinions on each individual idea, so together we can try to form an ¨Unified Theory of Everything¨.

So if you have any statement that can help support/disprove these theories, I'd like to encourage you to share it, I'll make sure to respond to it and together try to find a the truth.

INDEX

Over time this list may extend/change.

There are topics of Genshin that aren't discussed in these theories, like the Voyager/ Seutervoinen's role or Hexenzirkel origins, so they may be added as chapters beyond the 22nd one.

  • IMPORTANT: this will be the only post that presents the index.

Each individual post will be linked to this first post, and after each of them is ready, they will be linked here*:*

NOTE: Chapters with topics resumed inside the previous posts: Yes / No

  • [CHAPTER 1: The two faces of the Abyss: destruction and nothingness]. Yes
  • [CHAPTER 2: The death of the universe + The role of the Traveler] Yes
  • CHAPTER 3: The ¨microcosm¨ and the ¨universe¨. The story inside the story. Yes
  • CHAPTER 4: The role of destruction. Yes
  • CHAPTER 5: The Hanged Man XII and The Devil XV: ¨The arrogation of mankind¨. Yes
  • CHAPTER 6: The cycles of the ¨microcosm¨/Teyvat. Yes
  • CHAPTER 7: ¨The god that creates, the abyss that destroys¨. The cycles of the ¨universe¨. Yes
  • CHAPTER 8: Asmoday's new master/The power to destroy. Yes
  • CHAPTER 9: Hroptatyr's true identity. The serpent of sin and the genesis pearl. Yes
  • CHAPTER 10: ¨The Fate of the Abyss¨ + The ravens of Hroptatyr. Yes
  • CHAPTER 11: ¨The Will of the Abyss¨. The Wise and Hroptatyr/The villain and the mask. Yes
  • CHAPTER 12: Humanity and divinity + The original sin. Yes
  • CHAPTER 13: The plan of the Sibling, the ¨Age of Enlightenment¨. Yes
  • CHAPTER 14: ¨The end of time¨. Vedrfolnir's message: The ¨death¨ of the mask. Yes
  • CHAPTER 15: The heart of the Creator: ¨Paimon is not emergency food!¨ No
  • CHAPTER 16: Judgmement XX, Masquerade of the Guilty: ¨The execution of the Creator¨ + The Primordial God Yes
  • CHAPTER 17: The ¨Pitch-dark Void¨ and the ¨Sea of Flowes at the End¨: the Elysium beyond reason. Yes
  • CHAPTER 18: The gold of the Rhinemaidens and Nibelung's ring: the renunciation of the heart/love. No
  • CHAPTER 19: Dainsleif: ¨Seeker of truth¨ Yes
  • CHAPTER 20: The seven-fold steps of the ¨microcosm¨/the blueprint of the ¨universe¨. No
  • CHAPTER 21: Shades and sinners + The sustainer of the ¨Heavenly Principles¨. No
  • CHAPTER 22: The World XXI. The reunion of twins. A new illusory world is displayed. Yes
  • To be added/edited

Each chapter presents an individual idea, and each one is built upon the knowledge of the last.

Together, these 22-chapter group posts act as a net of information, like a story. It is highly recommended to read them in order, as usually, they will only make sense when read linearly.

CHAPTER 1: THE TWO FACES OF THE ABYSS

Before jumping into a direct analysis of the story of Genshin, we have to understand how its universe works.

What is the Abyss?

To understand this, we will use two lunar arcanum cards: The Hanged Man XII and The Devil XV. (In later chapters we will analyze them fully, but for now we only want a specific conclusion)

THE HANGED MAN XII

The Hanged Man XII

The path where "strength" is sacrificed for "human wisdom",

Is that of the "Hanged Man" who seeks to glimpse the mysteries of the demonic heavens hanging from the white tree.

  • THE HANGED MAN: hangs himself upside down from the ¨white tree¨ to see the truth that the demonic heavens had hidden away.
  • VERY IMPORTANT: This idea is deeply associated with Odin, god who in norse mythology would hang himself upside down from the Yggdrasil tree (Irminsul for Genshin) so he would understand the mysteries of the cosmos.

NOTE: Hroptatyr's name is one of the names of Odin meaning ¨Wise God¨. His relevance in these theories will be explored in posterior chapters.

Though the intelligence that mortals grasp is flawed,
It cannot be said to be false.
Quite the opposite, for reflected in his inverted eyes,
Is a pure truth illuminated beneath infinite brilliance.

  • THE LIE IS THE INVERTED TRUTH: The knowledge that mortals try to understand is flawed, not because it is false, but because it is the inverted truth. The Hanged Man understands this and decides to put himself upside-down.

This card talks about an ideology, of those who are able to understand how the universe works.

Because to see the truth in an upside-down world, one must be inverted.

THE DEVIL XV

The Devil XV

This card is already written under the perspective of the Hanged Man:

Was there ever a true age of darkness?
Where ignorance and shadow were mistaken for divine,
And the "Devil" was hailed as creator.

  • THE DEVIL: the one who wrote this card, the Hanged Man, considers the creator god the Devil, and divine to be ignorance. If for mortals the creator god is the Heavenly Principles, for the Hanged Man, they are the ¨Devil¨ that hides the truth of the universe.

The "Devil" is merely a mask,
Through which the power of darkness is revealed.
[...]
That infinite, boundless, perpetual ¨Age of Enlightenment¨

Only after the mask/Devil is destroyed we can find the truth, to an infinite and boundless ¨Age of Enlightenment¨.

  • VERY IMPORTANT: here, the Hanged Man considers the creator god and the Abyss opposites. One creates, the other destroys.

The god who creates and maintains,
The abyss that consumes and destroys.

  • THE CONCLUSION WE NEED: And if the Hanged Man is the one who understands the nature of the universe, then it is logic to think that only they understand the true nature of the abyss.
    • THE ABYSS IS DESTRUCTION: the opposite of creation/reason.

DESTRUCTION AND CREATION

  • VERY IMPORTANT: Now, we wil use a very useful and recurrent analogy during the 22 chapters. We will use such analogy plenty of times, so if you are interested in the next chapters, be sure to understand it.
¨Colours out of Space¨

There are two forces of nature in constant clash inside the universe of Genshin:

  • Reason (blue): The power create, will be the ¨the writting pen¨.
  • Abyss (red): The power destroy, will be ¨the eraser¨.

Thanks to the previous analysis of the lunar arcanum cards, we have established the two as opposing forces.

Then what is the purple orb?

In the quest, ¨Colours out of Space¨, we follow the red and blue orbs, who at last clash and create a purple orb that takes us into a ¨different dimension¨.

That different dimension is what we have normally called ¨The Abyss¨ throughout the years, an external dimension to creation without rules where reality begins to blur.

  • THE PURPLE ORB IS NOT THE ABYSS: That dimension IS NOT the abyss. Or better said, not exactly the Abyss.

Reason needs a canvas to create. A book for a story to be written in.

  • The craft of the writting pen is the written story.
    • Therefore it is implicit to reason that a blank book ever existed.
  • The craft of the eraser is the blank book.
    • Therefore it is implicit to the abyss that there is a story to erase.
  • KEY POINT: When the eraser meets/¨fuses¨ with the written story, it unveils the blank book by destroying what was written. The blank book is the purple orb.

IMPORTANT NOTE*: We will refer to this ¨blank book¨ as ¨purple abyss¨, and refer to the ¨eraser¨ as the ¨red/pure abyss or the Abyss¨.

  • THE PURPLE ABYSS: is not destruction nor creation but the ¨true¨ world. The fusion of pure red abyss and reason is the blank book, the boundless and undefined world.
    • Everything that could've been but never was. The unlimited world of never-chosen posibilities: the blank book.
  • VERY IMPORTANTAbyss needs to destroy reason to reveal purple abyss, and reason needs purple abyss to create.
Reason ¨writes¨ using the blank book/purple abyss; pure red abyss ¨erases¨ creation and creates the blank book

The red (pure) abyss is destruction.

The purple (mixture) abyss is nothingness.

Then how does nothingness exist?

  • THE MIMETIC NATURE OF THE PURPLE ABYSS: purple abyss, the blank book, lacks the power to create. It represents everything that could've existed but it didn't. An infinite and boundless reality... but it lacks the power to create.
    • For the purple abyss to exist and be perceived inside our reality, it needs to imitate reason/creation.
For ¨nothingness¨ to be ¨something¨ imitation is recquired.

¨The colour of his hair was brown, and the colour of her hair was black¨ - Is a written story

Let's ¨erase¨ it partially, using the red and pure abyss upon it.

¨The colour of his hair was brown, and the colour of her hair was black¨

By ¨erasing¨/¨destroying¨ the colour of his hair, that information has turned into a blank space. That is what the purple abyss represents.

¨The colour of his hair was brown (black), and the colour of her hair was black¨

For that blank space to ¨exist¨, it imitates the written story/creation of reason. However, for it to be defined such story must exist.

  • THE PITCH-DARK VOID: If the Abyss/destruction was to hypothetically destroy the story completely, everything would turn into a blank space, the universe would become the blank book, and if the written story doesn't exist anymore, the purple abyss wouldn't be able to ¨imitate¨ because it wouldn't exist anything to imitate
    • All would turn into nothingness, the pitch-dark void.

¨The colour of his hair was brown (black), and the colour of her hair was black¨

The ¨pitch-dark void¨.

However, these blank spaces, when they just represent a partial erasure of reality, are just perceived as purple abyss, as ¨undefined variables¨.

  • VARIABLES: Genshin calls these blank spaces undefined ¨variables¨ inside an equation. We will talk more about these variables when talking about cycles of the universe/Teyvat and the Fate of the Abyss in Chapters 6,7 and 10.
Variables, blank spaces, are all that could be but never was, all that is not defined

The purple abyss, as it doesn't exist, ¨yearns¨ to be created, and acts as a force that ¨envies¨creation. As it lacks the power to create, it imitates.

  • PURPLE ABYSS CREATURES: The purple abyss desires to exist. Its monsters desire to exist, not to destroy. They attack creation out of ¨envy¨/instinct to replace, but not because it is within their nature to destroy.
When purple abyss monsters are left alone, they don't seek to destroy, but to replace

THE PURE ABYSS, DESTRUCTION

Not the dimension without rules, but the destructive force against such rules. The red abyss, the true and pure abyss, represents destruction, the ¨eraser¨.

Let's back up the idea that the red abyss is pure and the purple abyss is a mixture:

¨Abyssal energies are all that lie beyond Teyvat's border¨

-Alice

  • COLOURS ¨OUT OF SPACE¨: The pure red abyss exists outside the frontiers. ¨The Abyss¨, doesn't come from beneath Teyvat, but from outer space.

Inside Teyvat, the abyss manifests as purple as it has already fused with (blue) reason.

Outside Teyvat, as it couldn't yet fuse with reason, it stays in its primitive form, red: destruction.

The pure red abyss lies in outer space
  • RHINEDOTTIR'S CREATURES: were made using Khemia, not reason, so as they were ¨never blue¨, they ¨turned red, not purple¨ and went corrupted due to the raw power of the abyss: destruction.

In fact, it is only thanks to her monsters that we can see the red abyss inside Teyvat.

  • ALIEN BLOOD MUTATIONS: her creatures are considered to have mutated and to carry alien blood, for they were vessels of red abyss that hadn't fused with reason, and such force should only exist in outer space.
    • The red abyss is an ¨alien power¨, from beyond this world. (And the reason why the fake sky exists, for us not to see it)
Chunk of Aerosiderite
  • THE ¨FUEL¨: The first descender never purified the purple abyss beneath Teyvat, they only ¨sealed¨ Gosoythoth and the other monsters beneath the earth, because this purple abyss serves as ¨fuel¨ for reason to create.
    • Like the writting pen needs the blank book to write in.

Rhinedottir's creations were never made using reason but Khemia, a different form of alchemy that directly operates from the purple abyss.

As they didn't carry the power of reason, instead of purple abyss creatures, they turned into calamities with only one purpose: ¨destroy everything¨.

  • RED ABYSS CREATURES: unlike the purple abyss monsters who are peaceful if left alone and just try to exist as an act of ¨envy¨/replacement against creation, the red abyss monsters directly try to destroy everything they can.
Calamities of destruction, pure red abyss creatures

Her creatures inherited a part of the pure red abyss powers:

  • RIFTHOUNDS: said to be capable of ¨eroding the world's limits¨ (the ingame corrosion effect): power of destruction.
  • DURIN: what the new Durin did while trying to help the hyperborean in the Luna III quest, was, using his power over destruction inherited from the old Durin, destroying possible scenarios for him. The death of the hyperborean was already written down, so as Durin didn't have the power to write a new fate for him, his death was unmovable.
    • NOTE: someone with the raw power of destruction (red abyss) and creation (reason) can rewrite the story. We will talk about this idea in posterior chapters.
Durin only introduced ¨variables¨ using destruction: pure abyss
  • IMPORTANT CLUE FOR FUTURE CHAPTERS: Hroptatyr's chess piece's gem being red is not a coincidence.

END OF CHAPTER 1

The point of this chapter is to understand the forces that rule Genshin's universe.

  • Reason, the ¨writting¨ pen of creation
    • Reason creates the universe, the ¨written story¨
  • Abyss, the ¨eraser¨ of destruction
    • Abyss creates nothingness, the ¨blank book¨

Reason creates, abyss destroys, then purple abyss appears, reason purifies/creates from the purple abyss, the cycle repeats.

The purple abyss is not the ¨true¨ abyss.

The ¨true¨ Abyss is a force described as ¨hateful¨, that carries its nature to destroy everything.

Destruction and nothingness

This idea is VITAL to understand for the upcoming chapters.

Now then, here is the 2nd post for those who want to keep on reading (to be linked soon):

Ad astra abyssosque!

r/Genshin_Lore Nov 18 '25

Abyss An analysis in how the Abyss overthrew Celestia and the Fatui as the main antagonist of the story, plus some speculation on the final boss of the Teyvat Chapter

81 Upvotes

When it comes to Genshin Impact’s antagonists, it’s generally accepted that there are four “main” factions: Celestia, Fatui, Abyss and Abyss Order.

In the early stages of the story, the Abyss and its agents were a vague force in the background, while the Fatui had the spotlight as the main antagonists during the Archon Quests (especially in Inazuma and Sumeru), while Celestia/HP was being built up as the final boss of the game.

Starting with Fontaine, the Abyss began to have an increasingly central role as the story's main antagonist, since 4.x was the first time we heard about the Five Sinners and Surtalogi‘s Narwhal played a key role in Fontaine's prophecy. It was the first time the Fatui “backed off” as the main antagonists but Celestia was still present as a main antagonistic force, since they were the ones that cursed Fontaine.

Natlan was the first time the Abyss took the spotlight as the sole ”main villain”, with other antaginistic factions helping Mavuika to defeat it: Ronova (Celestia) gave her powers to Mavuika while Capitano (Fatui) helped via manpower. The fact that when the Abyss takes the central stage as the antagonist all other factions focus their strenght to defeat it instead of trying to kill each other makes it very clear how the writers are building up the Abyss as the main antagonistic force of the game: while Celestia and the Fatui are in conflict because of their different views on how the world should be ruled, The Abyss wants nothing more than the complete destruction of all of Teyvat, making it some sort of conflict killer that must be dealt with in the fastest way possible.

The same thing happens again in Nod Krai: the Fatui form a truce with the heroes because the Abyss via Rerir poses a threat far too big to ignore. Once again the Fatui collaborate with the Traveler to defeat a bigger threat.

In the Rerir flashback, the Abyss takes the role of a diabolical mastermind, using its voice seduce the already morally bankrupt Sinners into fully giving in to the dark side. The “mastermind that seduces others to become evil” is a trope almost exclusively used to describe the main antagonist of a fictional story.

An argument could be made about the Abyss not being strong enough compared to the Heavenly Principles to be the final antagonist of the story, but with Surtalogi‘s ability to nullify Ronova’s curse of immortality on his friend Skofnungr, Rhinedottir outright devouring the Shade of Life, and Hroptatyr implied to be blasphemy against Reason (The HP themselves), I wouldn’t be surprised if the “core“ of the Abyss, the voice the spoke in the Sinners’ heads, is as powerful as the Heavenly Principles themselves, and it is exactly this “core” of the Abyss, the source of everything Abyss related, what I believe will be the final boss of the Teyvat Chapter: during the final stages of the story, the Abyss will most likely corrode everything in Teyvat (probably via some Sinners), and just like it happened in Natlan and Nod Krai, all the conflicting factions will be forced to destroy it, this time once and for all