r/Genshin_Lore • u/ghhostr • 7d ago
Meme Weekend Dragon family tree (6.6 spoilers) Spoiler
This is an updated dragon family tree (I hope it looks good).
EDIT: No, it doesn't look good, so here's the link.
To structure it, I had to include the Light Realm as the origin of everything, and the reason I didn't add other elemental beings that also belong to this realm (such as slimes, hypostasis, and others) is because the focus of this tree is mainly on dragons.
The downward lines mainly represent direct creations, but they can also indicate descent, origin (common ancestor), or species relationship:
Wenut and Flying Serpents are an evolved form of the original Dendro Vishap.
Saurians are an evolved form of the original Pyro Vishap. In this case, I decided to add the Stegosaurus, which may have been the Anemo Saurian (if it ever existed).
All Hydro Vishaps and Aberrant Fontemer are direct descendants of the Fontemer, one of the first life forms born from the Primordial Sea.
We know very little or almost nothing about the Cryo and Electro Sovereigns (I'm hoping that Thundersoother's Beast of Thunder is the Electro Sovereign), but, as with the other elements, it's highly likely that the vishaps of those elements are also descended from the original sovereigns.
The broken lines pointing downwards represent an indirect relationship, which does not necessarily imply a direct creator-creation link. For example:
Azhdaha did not create Kun Jun, he merely possessed his body momentarily.
Aino used CL-11's Benevolent Core to create Ineffa.
Sonnet and Canon did not directly create the Crimson Moon Dynasty or the Frostmoon Scions, respectively, but technically they are descended from them.
The broken lines to the side represent a reincarnation, while the normal side lines represent a kind of "transformation" (so to speak):
Dvalin is the reincarnation of the original Anemo Sovereign.
The Firstborn Firesprite may be a reincarnation of the original Pyro Sovereign, Xiuhcoatl.
CL-11's Benevolent Core was used to create Ineffa.
Columbina was originally born as the reincarnation of Canon, the original goddess of the Frostmoon.
Neuvillette is the reincarnation of the original Hydro Sovereign.
I also want to clarify that this is my family tree, because I created it, obviously. It's based on my personal interpretation and what I understand from the hours of historical research I've done so far to write this post. So, if you disagree with something, that's perfectly fine, everyone is entitled to their own interpretation.
Some points that often raise questions:
The Snowland Fae were forged upon the bones of "giant beasts", it's possible that the bones of these beasts correspond to those of the Cryo Sovereign.
Dvalin as the reincarnated Anemo Sovereign. I won't go into much detail here because I already explained it in this post.
Firstborn Firesprite as a possible reincarnated Pyro Sovereign. There's no direct hint or confirmation that this is the case, but from my perspective, it's a fairly likely possibility. (?)
Azhdaha is the original Geo Sovereign. I won't go into detail about this either, because I already explained it here.
Although Egeria is not a dragon, she was born from the Primordial Sea and possessed a draconic nature, since she had the nobility of a dragon.
In the last AQ, we learned that the Irminsul existed before the arrival of the HP. In the age of the dragons, the Irminsul was the first fern to sprout in Apep's court.
Although Rukkhadevata and Nahida aren't dragons, they are manifestations of the Irminsul, and therefore possess a draconic nature. This may explain the shape of their ears. I would like to think that Rukkhadevata was a vessel created by Naberius for the Irminsul after being modified by the HP, giving her the duty of protecting the tree, something similar to Egeria with the Primordial Sea.
Yes, I still believe that Nibelung was born from the planet covered by the Primordial Sea.
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u/VoidCatCallsOutBS 6d ago
Never cook again.
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u/Nara_RyUko 6d ago
Bro sourced his information from tiktok without actually comprehending the lore.
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u/Chaos-Creator-0707 Suffering Sovereign 7d ago
The thing is Nibelung was born from the Sea of Stars not from the Primordial sea
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u/salty-and-bitter Paimon without the 'mo' 7d ago
Yeah he shouldn't be on this tree at all
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u/Revenant092 Lizard Lore Lover 7d ago
He should be near the top of it at least, since Neuvi calls him the "formidable father" that implies he took some part in the creation of the world if not the Sovereigns.
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u/ghhostr 7d ago
Nibelung isn't a descender from the beginning, that is, he was born into the world. Alongside the world is an expression of the fact that he was the first to be born.
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u/Revenant092 Lizard Lore Lover 7d ago
And we don't know how the other three descenders were born yet? Nibelung was always a being who could "rival the world" as he was king of the light realm and Seutervoinen praises him as the greatest thing she had ever seen. The reason he was only classified as a descender is because he was an alien to Phanes' order and could rival their world.
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u/ghhostr 7d ago
I disagree, but that's fine. He became the second once he left Teyvat and returned during the War of Funerary Flame.
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u/Revenant092 Lizard Lore Lover 7d ago
We should be getting more Nibelung lore soon anyways I suppose.
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u/ghhostr 7d ago
I hope they don't make us wait too long 🙏
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u/Revenant092 Lizard Lore Lover 7d ago
The Moons were his children and their story is essentially concluded so we should be moving on to the big one soon I would suppose right?
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u/Jesyka_ The Sustainer f Heavenly Principles 7d ago edited 7d ago
There is info in the new artifact set that may imply Nibelung was a descender from the beginning because the voyager refers to HP as the “new” descender, implying there was an “old” descender. I haven’t looked into the CN text to see if there are any mishaps in translation but wanted to share.
- Heavensent Decree She called on memories long consigned to dust, memories of how, once upon a time, she had visited the sovereign who ruled that world. Where had its former master gone? And why had the *new Descender** built the shell that bound all life within?*
I do still think Nibelung can be considered the “second descender” in the rankings the Harbingers gave because they would start with HP as it is a “new world.”
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u/ghhostr 7d ago
That could be a good point, but the fact that it's "new" doesn't imply that there was an old one, it just means it's recent.
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u/Jesyka_ The Sustainer f Heavenly Principles 7d ago
Perhaps, but I think if that were the case the voyager would say something more like “a descender” or “the descender” like the dragons do. Since voyager is a chronicler I think it may hold some weight but again I haven’t found the CN text to really dig into the intent.
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u/narium 6d ago
One need not be an outlander to be a Descender. Check Nicole’s about Albedo line.
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u/ghhostr 6d ago
Albedo is not a descender, if that's what you're implying.
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u/narium 6d ago
He has the potential to become one, and only isn’t because we are here.
6.6 AQ
”Primordial Human” is also used to refer to the Heavenly Principles in the AQ. It’s slightly mistranslated in EN but in CN the characters are the same. This is not the same as Primordial Being for Nibelung in the Song of the Welkin Moon teaser, I went back and checked and the CN words are different.
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u/ghhostr 7d ago
At that time, the primeval dragon nurtured by the perfumed sea sailed deep into the skies, disappearing into the mists among the stars.
Someone who speaks chinese confirmed to me that it does refer to the Primordial Sea.
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u/Chaos-Creator-0707 Suffering Sovereign 7d ago
In this context even if it's the primordial sea it doesn't matter
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u/ghhostr 7d ago
Why wouldn't it matter?
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u/Chaos-Creator-0707 Suffering Sovereign 7d ago
Let's take the 2 words literally ""born alongside the planet" and Nurture which means "To supply with nourishment Or to support growth of something" what do u see?
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u/ghhostr 7d ago
Alongside the world is an exaggeration, he was the first to be born into the world. He is the second descender, not the first.
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u/Chaos-Creator-0707 Suffering Sovereign 7d ago
What does being the second descender have to do with this?
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u/ghhostr 7d ago
Dudeeee 😭, Nibelung wasn't considered the first descender because he was born in Teyvat.
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u/Chaos-Creator-0707 Suffering Sovereign 7d ago edited 7d ago
Gang he can only ever be considered a descender because he was an alien or outlier to the current order of the world established by the HP. And so was HP to order established by Nibelung during the light realm era. Descenders are most prolly beings who could disrupt the order established in a the world by their remarkably strong will and other bs we don't know it's most prolly not because of birth that means how was the 3rd descender even born
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u/rloco 7d ago
It is the primordial sea, but it was the first; the other sovereign dragons were born either naturally or through the influence of Nibelungo himself (though it hasn't been confirmed how), and the rest were born after these had already come into existence.
It’s important to remember that the concept of “death” doesn’t exist for dragons; it’s merely a state, and the only way to kill them permanently is to literally erase them from existence.
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u/X_GamerTY 7d ago
Nibelung was indeed born from the Primordial Sea. I am just gonna link the explanation.
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u/Chaos-Creator-0707 Suffering Sovereign 7d ago edited 7d ago
Even if the perfumed sea in this text refers to the Primordial sea, The actual word used is "nurtured" which means "to take care of or support the growth of or to provide nourishment" .Which is inline to the Primordial sea as the concept of life and a mother.But,It doesn't mean he was born from the Primordial Sea tho . Since we know he was born alongside the planet we can assume that he was born by the time the Primordial sea came to being but , since he is just a newborn child , he needed nurturing to properly grow from from his young state just like a human baby
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u/LetMetOucHyOURasS 7d ago
primodial sea is also called amniotic fluid right ?
i imagine teyvat is like the egg and nibelung is the baby/fetus. so they were born together.
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u/MegaAssasine_ 7d ago
You could also add Nabu Malikata, Khvarena (the singular entity) Simurgh and the shattered multiple entites also called Khvarena. Nabu Malikata also created the Jinni. While we are at it, because of Nabu Malikata, we can add the other angels, the other Shades and Venti into it. /s
(Wait, I just realised, Rhinedottir became Nicole's "sister")
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u/HURAWRA35 7d ago
i think some -vishaps (hydro, geo, electro and cryo) should be direct descendants of nibelung or atleast a neutral ones and do not corresponds to elemental dragon sovereigns linage as they absorb which element is abundant in their habitat rather than being born with that elemental prowess.
this was explain thru enkanomiya experiments on vishaps.
well, if im wrong, then im wrong
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u/PeterGyrich 7d ago
Enkanomiya only experimented on bathysmal Vishaps which are purely hydro. Vishaps do not absorb elements at all, they evolve them based on selective pressures
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u/revorted_king 7d ago
does columbina made out of primodial sea i think she was born on the moon and sent to teyvat how so she must originated with the help of her sister and primodial sea
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u/rloco 7d ago
- As far as I know, Nibelungo is the creator of the Sovereign Dragons and the Three Moons; hence, he is their king, and—as far as we know—he was born in the Primordial Sea.
- Columbine comes into being through the paradox of time.
- Many elemental beings live off dragons, as Apep confirms.
- Humans, shadows, and angels, as well as the creations of the shadows, come from Phanes.
Therefore, they can be divided into two types: those that originated from the primordial sea—born or created by the Nibelungs—and those created by the Phanes, either through elemental energies or the primordial sea.
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u/F1T_13 3d ago
Where do people base this idea from that Nibelung was born in the Primordial Sea. We're told that he was born alongside the planet. So he would have either been born simultaneously with the elements or before them.
Also, Apep's children are varied because of the nail and the apocalypse displaced them from the path of Dendro.
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u/rloco 3d ago
first, hoyoverse uses scientific theories to create its lore, where it adds the “fantasy” part; That is why there is the primordial sea, which would be something similar to the first seas on Earth, and the “primordial soup” that gave rise to life on Earth. In teyvat it would be the same: a sea that is not exactly water, but birth energy. That energy gave rise to a Nibelungan that is almost at the beginning of the same planet. We have to take into account that it did not happen overnight; The Nibelungan may have been alive for thousands or millions of years.
Now, in history, it is easier and it is also good to say that "Nibelungan was born next to the planet", since it is not something literal, but rather metaphorical: that implies the ancient and that it is the first, before all life in Teyvat.
As for Apep, the elemental creatures that were born from him when they wandered away and ended up living with other species, eventually adopted his form and customs. They gained knowledge and created offspring, where that offspring had part of Apep's elemental being, like the mushroom (which was where they were born from). These mushrooms created a new type of mushroom, much more intelligent than the rest, with even the ability to speak and reason.
It would not be strange if, over thousands of years and with interaction with different species, in addition to humans, new races end up being created. For example, youkai have the ability to control the elements and also illuminated beasts. Not only do they have “adept” magic: they can also reason and even learn spells to adopt human forms, and from there they can have children with humans, inheriting part of their powers and also a long life, as happens with Yanfei, who is half human and half adept.
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u/ghhostr 7d ago
I also thought that Nibelung created the sovereigns, but when I looked for a source to confirm it, I couldn't find any.
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u/Nara_RyUko 6d ago
Apep and Neuvilette are literally right there. They are literally the living Sovereigns. Go on wiki and read through their pages.
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u/I_hate_myself069 6d ago edited 6d ago
Neuvi calls Nibelung ‘Formidable Father’, and Deep Gallery's Distant Pact says that Nibelung was born alongside the planet of Teyvat. So it’s likely that the general creation order was:
Primordial Sea > Nibelung > Everything else
Edit: Or it could also be Nibelung first. The Moonlit Offering’s Final Hour only says that ‘Primeval Dragon was nurtured by Perfumed Sea’. It doesn’t say anything about being born from it. So it’s possible that Nibelung unconsciously created Primordial Sea moments after being born, and then used it to nurture himself.
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u/Arios84 5d ago
hmm looks wonky af to be true...
Electro vishaps exists because Orobashi experimented on Hydro Vishaps, there has never been a connection to the electro sovereign as far as I'm aware.
What are the high heavens in the context of dragonkind?
Naberius is a shade of the Primordial One and did not originate from the light realm...
Apep did not create Irminsul, Irminsul was not connected to fate or wisdom during the time of the dragons, it only took on those functions after the HP conquered teavat.
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u/ghhostr 5d ago
Those aren't electro vishaps, it's like saying the geo saurian is a geo vishap or the hydro saurian is a hydro vishap. Dvalin was born from the elemental cingergencua in the High Heavens of Mondstadt. I didn't give Naberius any lines indicating that she was born in the realm of light. The Irminsul was born in the age of dragon. Yes, it didn't have the same functions as it does now, but it existed, and it existed in Apep's court.
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u/SurtalogiTheCalamity 5d ago
Man nibelung was born alongside the planet from the light realm, the planet was still scorching flames and lava when nibelung was born, htf he was born from the sea he probably predated by tens of thousands if not millions of years ? Even his nature as the purest light contradict the claim he was birthed from the sea instead the LIGHT REALM, even if, teyvzt was formed with him, would that mean the sea predated teyvat and smh existed in teyvat ?
Also naberius isn’t born from the Primordial sea, she use the core and hold nibelung’s/teyvat’s authority yes, but dhe was born from the PO self
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u/ghhostr 5d ago
The planet was originally just water. And I didn't add any line to Naberius indicating that she was born in the Primordial Sea.
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u/Mtebalanazy 2d ago
Every planet starts off as a sea of lava,
I personally have a theory that teyvat was originally a star before becoming a planet
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u/EstablishmentSea4995 Sinner 7d ago
I thought nabu malikata through khaverna and egeria made up the harvispotkhm. Rukkadevata just facilitated it (maybe even mixed some of her powers).
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u/MegaAssasine_ 7d ago
After Egeria died, she turned into the Amrita, then Rukkha created the tree to anchor her conciousness.
Nabu Malikata created Khvarena which Rukkha forged into Simurgh, who crashed into the Amrita Pool, shattering itself and fusing with it, creating the Pari.
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u/EstablishmentSea4995 Sinner 7d ago
Ohhh, got it. Being so long that i forgot the lore. I guess the placement makes sense then.
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u/IvyLestrange 6d ago
Question: did I miss something that I just don’t remember or is there really a 7th type of saurian?
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u/esmelusina 7d ago edited 7d ago
Snowland Fae were created by Phanes— not ready to think of them as part of the dragon family tree just yet.
Vishap should all share a common Vishap ancestor, shouldn’t they? Don’t they all evolve elemental specializations?
Edit: oops. I guess not.
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u/ThinkLettuces 7d ago
Snowland Fae were created by Phanes
Weren't they created by the artisans of Hyperborea?
And the furnaces of the deep galleries thundered day and night. Turning to forbidden methods, artisans forged countless fae spirits upon the bones of giant beasts.
Such authority to create was once the lord of the firmament's divine prerogative, yet it was handed to mortals by the rebellious envoy
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u/adastrajay 7d ago
I love that Aino is on this