Huang Po: Motionless Mind

[u/[deleted]]

Not til your thoughts cease their branching here and there, not till you abandon all thoughts of seeking for something, not till your mind is motionless as wood or stone, will you be on the right road to the Gate.

• Huang Po

[u/ewk]

I don't think you have the integrity to agree or disagree.

You are doing a bang up job of showing people how rotten the heart of your religion is though. Better than i ever could with measly facts and arguments.

[u/[deleted] → u/ewk]

Integrity is for people who don't have faith in mind. When you make no distinctions, that is the true Path.

And I think you misunderstand dhyana. It's much older and much more reliable than the so called Zen tradition you apparently are the gatekeeper of. In fact, nature to this day echoes motionless mind and dhyana in its serene stillness.

I don't want to show people anything. In fact, if people follow what I say or what I practice that is already "Wrong View."

A practice that taints itself with argument and discourse clearly is not worth practicing.

That's why I practice zazen.

That's why the Soto and Rinzai schools are tainted today. We must go back to the roots.

[u/ewk → u/[deleted]]

Zen Masters don't say "make no distinctions between faith-based cult Buddhism and Zen. In fact Huangbo again and again eviscerated religious beliefs and practices throughout the text.

You can claim that there is something older than Huangbo, but you are in a forum about Huangbo... so why not talk about Huangbo? Is it because it turns out that what Huangbo means by "dhyana" isn't what your religion preaches?

You come in here, pretend to talk about Huangbo, and then lie to people. Either your practice of Zazen prayer-meditation isn't curing your dishonesty, or it is making you a liar.

Given how many Zazen prayer-meditation teachers of the first generation were sex predators, my guess is that the religious practice isn't a cure, and in some people it actually makes them worse.

All you need now is a faith healer.

[u/[deleted] → u/ewk]

Zazen isn’t meditation. You can wash and bowls and practice Zazen. That doesn’t mean you’re doing anything special. In fact, it’s actually quite mundane.

When you have learned this fact, you will empty all dharmas, giving them no life. This is why Huangbo is so right in gutting out religious practice. He’s one of the main reasons why I practice sitting dhyana, actually.

And are you talking about the Soto and Rinzai lineages? Because zazen existed before that, even before Shakyamuni.

[u/koalazen → u/[deleted]]

Even ewk cannot disturb your zazen.

[u/[deleted] → u/koalazen]

:-)

[u/ewk → u/[deleted]]

Dude, you go to a church that puts sex predators in charge out of faith in a practice created by a fraud and a plagiarist. Dogen created Zazen prayer-meditation.

Finally, when confronted about this, you lie about Huangbo.

You practice self deception, man. That's what the evidence points to. And Zazen prayer-meditation just makes it easier for you to lie to yourself.

There is no question that people like lying to themselves, you've proven that. But that's as far as you can go. You are held back from realizing anything, mixing it up with the Jesus-rode-a-dinosaur people and waiting for your turn to burn a witch.

[u/[deleted] → u/ewk]

The Soto Church didn’t create Zazen because it’s something that is part of our Buddha Nature. The Tso Ch’an I lives in you. Zazen is just a word that the Japanese made up to feel better about themselves. Call it whatever you wish. It’s ineffable. Even calling it Zen is a mistake.

Whatever church you belong to, I’m not interested.

I only practice Zazen. Everything else is highly irrelevant.

And on the Huangbo part: how is repeating the teachings of a Zen Master lying? He repeatedly disparaged meditation in Transmission of Mind. Did you miss that part?

I say that Huangbo is the one of the main reasons that I practice Zazen in the first place for a reason.

[u/ewk → u/[deleted]]

Why would you think any of this was tru? Wait... wait... let me guess....

You had a transpsychic healing vision, didn't you?

You were smooching up the Huangbo text, because that's what scholars do, late at night, in your room, and you had a transpsychic yeti vision that Huangbo wanted you to do Zazen prayer-meditation, because in your vision Buddha learned it from a yeti.

All. the. pieces. fit.

...

The Soto Church didn’t create Zazen because it’s something that is part of our Buddha Nature. The Tso Ch’an I lives in you. Zazen is just a word that the Japanese made up to feel better about themselves. Call it whatever you wish. It’s ineffable. Even calling it Zen is a mistake.

Whatever church you belong to, I’m not interested.

I only practice Zazen. Everything else is highly irrelevant.

And on the Huangbo part: how is repeating the teachings of a Zen Master lying? He repeatedly disparaged meditation in Transmission of Mind. Did you miss that part?

I say that Huangbo is the one of the main reasons that I practice Zazen in the first place for a reason.

Later when the question of you getting banned for refusing to follow the Reddiquette to the point of lying to people about Huangbo, we can revisit this.

You can pretend all of a sudden that "Zazen" isn't a term of art in the West for Dogen's religion if you like, to muddy the waters, mix in some Chinese, that's all good clean fun... make people pin you down, define your terms, hunt you to your etymological tree of eternal knowledge and what not...

But you know me.

I'm too lazy.

Can't quote Zen Masters? Can't participate in a Zen forum.

[u/ewk → u/[deleted]]

Absolutely.

Just don't blame me when they ask you where it comes from.

[u/ewk → u/[deleted]]

Your only obligation is to your own mind.

Bwhahahahahaa.

[u/hookdump → u/ewk]

You were smooching up the Huangbo text, because that's what scholars do, late at night, in your room, and you had a transpsychic yeti vision that Huangbo wanted you to do Zazen prayer-meditation, because in your vision Buddha learned it from a yeti.

I'm crying

[u/koalazen → u/[deleted]]

Now your zazen is disturbed. Ewk is truly a master.

[u/[deleted] → u/koalazen]

Oh no, how unfortunate :(

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I enjoyed reading your explanation of zazen. Thanks for sharing!

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Anytime, friend!

[u/essentialsalts → u/[deleted]]

Stop talking to it.

[u/[deleted] → u/essentialsalts]

Talking to what? Sorry for the ignorance