Many countries in the Americas consider themselves Americans as well. In Spanish the official word for people from the United States is “estadounidense” which pretty much means “United Statesian”
Varies by country, but for the most part, including Mexico, a gringo is any American: Obama, Gabriel Iglesias, Mindy Kailing, Brenda Song, are all gringos.
Mexican Americans are not accepted as Mexican regardless of ethnicity in Mexico. We are also not accepted as real Americans in America. The saying goes "ni de aqui, ni de alla" or neither from here or there in English.
As the other guy said, it does in fact vary by country. As he said Mexicans refer to Americans as gringos, in Brazil anyone who is not from Brazil is called a gringo. Other latinos though are usually called hermanos but some people still call them gringo.
In some places of argentina, specially in rural areas it just means blond, blue eyes, Used for german, british or italian people. Or anyone that looks like that.
In Brazil, gringo is a slang for foreigner, no matter from where! If you are not Brazilian, you're a gringo! And has absolutely no depreciative meaning!
It’s so funny to me how this classification argument is happening everywhere. As a gringo living here in Brazil, I prefer the Brazilian definition the most because it’s not complicated: a gringo is simply someone in Brazil who isn't from Brazil. That’s it—nothing more to it. Furthermore, it isn’t derogatory; I don’t mind being called one at all.
Mexico, on the other hand, makes it convoluted. If you ask anyone from there, you’ll get different answers, like 'it’s a white person from the USA.' By that logic, is a white Italian not a gringo? The Brazilian way just makes more sense.
It depends on your attitude. If you're African American but you come at me with an imperialist attitude, to me you're still a gringo. Otherwise, you're a friendly "American" :D
Edit: It also applies to white people, for God's sake, it all depends on your attitude. It's not like we're going to treat you badly just for being white or a gringo. It depends on your attitude.
It's just that it's clearly less common for an African American to have imperialist attitudes. And no, racism against white people doesn't exist, you created it. It's not my fault.
And the word “Gringo” does not always have negative connotations; it depends on the context.
To add to this: I am very much white, I am blonde, I have green eyes and while in Mexico I was in this ice cream store and an American lady started a conversation with me: "The ice cream here is amazing right" and I responded in an obviously not american accent: "No I'm just here for the coffee" and after hearing I'm clearly not from the United States this woman wouldn't even talk to me. That's the moment I learned the meaning of the word gringo(or gringa in this case)
So we agree gringo carries a negative and derogatory connotation? I married into a Latin family and they swear it carries no such meaning. Your response is exactly what I tried to describe to them.
It does and it doesn't. I'm also married to a latina. Calling a fat cousin gordo is also not considered negative. A gringo may just be a random white person, or it may be a tourist dickhole, or it might be the white guy who moved in 20 years ago and is seen as part of the community and his nickname is gringo. It's not just one way, but it can definitely be negative
It can. It's all about context. If someone says "this gringo who comes to our parties" that's way different from "that fucking gringo". It can be a factual statement or an allusion to negative stereotypes, relevant or not.
Depends on the person really, when I lived in Cuba a person who lived in the US was a Yanki. The term gringo we learned about it when we moved here, this was back in 97 so it’s been a while.
Well if you are speaking english, the word has a different meaning than it does in spanish.
In English it is a synecdoche. This is because the USA is the only country that has "America" in its name, and because in the anglosphere, it was the original "America". In Spanish, it has a different meaning and different pronunciation, too!
Wow! Because Spanish and English aren't the same language!
Wait till you find out about the rest of the false cognates in English/Spanish 2!!!
What that person meant, and I know because it's very common, is that Americans don't translate the word American as they should when they speak Spanish.
If you're speaking Spanish, the correct translation for American is Estadounidense. If you're speaking Spanish and use Americano as the translation for American, you're going to get strong reactions because, surprise surprise, you're making an understandable mistake, but one that many people take offense to.
It's not about the English word, it's about the Spanish word. Who would've thought different languages have different words for the same concept? Mind blowing, right?
Edit because I don’t want to be accused of straw-manning:
It’s the same thing for America. The correct translation for America, when referring to the country, is Estados Unidos. Yes, the full name is Estados Unidos de América. No, we don’t call the country América. If you’re speaking English, you’re an American from America. If you’re speaking Spanish, you’re an Estadounidense from Estados Unidos.
Hell, in some languages (like e.g. Dutch) South and North America are one continent. Noticeably, Spanish is one of those languages with América del Sur and América del Norte being subcontinents, with América being the single official continent.
Other Dutch here; I learned it in school as 1 continent (Amerika), which can also be split into 2 sub-continents (North and South). “Amerika” can be used in Dutch to refer to both the country USA and the continent.
I lived in South America (Argentina) two years, nobody called us that. If you were from the US you were called a norte Americano (much to the Mexicans disappointment that were with me there as they would respond they are norte Americanos as well) or Yankees
I second this. Might be a thing that happens on certain economical backgrounds, maybe. But never have I heard someone call Usonians "americanos" unless they were lazy bilinguals.
Argentinians are always bothered. They exist in a state of botheredness. He was correct but I guarantee he would be bothered regardless of what was happening.
Someone saying "that term was never used when I lived there for two years, they used this other term" and having people say "that isn't true" is also hilarious.
Depending on where you are in the US, you might call a specific beverage soda, pop, or coke. You might refer to those things you put on your feet as tennis shoes, sneakers, or gym shoes. You might sit on a sofa or a couch. You might store your out-of-season decorations in your basement or your cellar.
Homeboy was telling us that, having lived there for 2 years, he never heard the term. So obviously, the only possible explanation is he's lying for some reason.
More than half of Argentina lives in one city, and almost all foreigners living there also live there - it's the hub of pretty much everything in the country. There's generally a lot less regional variance.
And as someone who lived there for four years, I never really heard "norteamericano". Yanqui, gringo and estadounidiense were the terms. In fact, to a lot of people, "Americano" very specifically referred to people from the western hemisphere in general.
FWIW it's definitely better for people to think you're a gringo than a Brit in Argentina. Neither is particularly loved but only one is liable to get you punched out of the blue.
As a Spanish speaker, I too was never called a United statesian and that makes sense because that is not our demonym. We are North American and American.
Chileans are South American and Chilean. Brazilians are South American and Brazilian. Canadians are North American and Canadian. The list goes on.
Calling Americans United statesian is silly because Mexico is also the United States… of Mexico. Brazil and Venezuela too (somewhat).
To be fair, those are kind of the odd ones out in Latin America as English and Dutch speaking nations respectively (Guyana too). But I'm sure it wasn't intentional.
Listen to it again. Right after he says Republica Dominicana, he says Jamaica, Haiti, Antilla. Its kind of difficult to understand if you're not used to that accent.
I worked as an interpreter for a few years (I am Puerto Rican), but my biggest fear was Dominincans. I grew up surrounded by the DR community in PR and some regional variants of that accent still give me a hard time!
I am Chilean and to be honest the accent for those who emigrated are not that difficult, but sometimes it is hard to understand my country folks. Luckily my best friend is Mexican so I can understand Mexicans well, but once I called someone and asked for let's say Mr. Martinez and he answered like "Simon, (y algo raro que sonó a qué se le ofrece)" and sounded so much like the Simpsons that I got super confused and was like "wait, what?". It was like my first month working and it was so weird
I was waiting for him to say St Kitts and Nevis, Trinidad and Tobago, Saint Lucia, Saint Vincent, Grenadines, Antiqua and Barbuda how could he have missed those 🤦♂️
I had to go back and check. Yakko includes Puerto Rico, Bahamas, Tobago, and Barbados, then lumps the rest together under "Caribbean". But then he also says "San Juan" and points at Puerto Rico again.
Yeah, he also says "Asia" while naming the countries in Asia just so something will rhyme with Malaysia.
Edit: And says "Dahomey" for "Benin", even though Dahomey hasn't existed since 1904, and had officially been Benin since 1975. And don't even get me started on all of the islands that are included despite not actually being independent nations!
Yeah, I can def. see a problem if he mentions República Dominicana and not Haiti, but I think he does leave a lot of the island nations out like the ones you mentioned. I can think of Trinidad and Tobago, for example.
Comparing it with the regular flag, the difference is just that this is a lighter blue? Definitely subtle, like you said. People who aren't that invested in the politics of Puerto Rico or don't see the flag often most likely wouldn't notice but to those that are I imagine that stood out.
I did get a feeling the color was off but I just shrugged it off.
Yeah there are 3 variations. The neutral flag that resembles the USA flag, with a Light Blue for pro-independence and a Dark Blue for pro-statehood.
I believe it gets its colors from the Grito de Lares flag, which was a small revolt against the Spanish, but they also seem to have used versions with several different blues.
The official flag uses colonial blue due to USA flag laws. Sky blue was the official flag before and is continued to be use due to preference or independence sentiment. The Puerto Rican flag is inspired by the Cuban flag with its inverted colors as it was design in solidarity with Cuban revolutionaries, both finding themselves in New York. The Gritó de Lares flag is the first flag design to symbolize PR and its revolt against Spanish colonial rule. There is a black and white version that has become popularized as a symbol of protest, especially after Maria, symbolizing Puerto Rico in mourning for its people.
Yes, it definitely stands out to anyone invested. The shade of blue used is an explicit political stance. And independence vs statehood is one of the most hotly contested cultural topics.
Yup. Those of us from the island see the distinction right away. Depending on who's in Power they tend to change the shade of the blue to one of the 3.
Before commenting please consider that this is a post about bad bunny using a slightly niche flag I did not expect him to use not the political stance of the entirety of Puerto Rico thanks
In terms of niche, from what I saw visiting PR, this and the black protest version were the ones I saw the most painted or draped on non-govt buildings.
Actually the black and white flag came as a response to Obama's bill, PROMESA, that implemented a colonial style board of non-elect (most not even Puerto Rican) to babysit the Puerto Rican goverbment in 2016. It was first painted in Old San Juan by the group Se Acabaron Las Promesas.
The song that Ricky Martin performed during half time was a Bad Bunny song called “What Happened to Hawaii”. There’s a lyric that translates to “No, No I won’t let go of the flag or forget the ‘LeLoLai’. I don’t want them to do with you what they did to Hawaii”.
To add some context, he’s been about the 1895 version. It was intentional.
“Si mañana muero, yo espero que nunca olviden mi rostro
Y pongan un tema mío el día que traigan a Hostos.
En la caja, la bandera azul clarito
Y que recuerden que siempre fui yo, siempre fui Benito”
If you are in Puerto Rico, it's not really that niche, since we have a growing independence movement here. Last election the pro-independence gubernatorial candidate (who was supported by Bad Bunny) ended up in second place, the movement's best result in modern history (however, it is not entirely honest to say everyone who voted for him is in favor of independence).
It's the original flag, the one chosen for the Commonwealth status in the 50's is an altered flag with navy blue as it's blue.
They also revised the meaning of the colors, which is why many Puerto Ricans rolls their eyes anytime mentions the "official" flag.
And the PR flag used by the independence movement is considered turquoise blue, not sky blue, that's just the original blue.
There was a whole article about it in Puerto Rico.
It’s interesting to note that he actually uses the darker blue at the end of the show. Kind of hard to tell in a screen shot, but on the left, you can see that the flag of Aruba is def much lighter than all the other blue flags, and that seems like it would have been roughly the color of the ‘independence’ flag
That looks like the lighter blue to me. When the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico was established in 1952, the flag of Puerto Rico was changed to align with the colors of the U.S. flag. This made the adoption of the flag less controversial to the federal government. If you compare the blue on the U.S. flag, you can clearly see that the blue in the triangle is lighter.
Keep in mind that the display of the Puerto Rico flag was made illegal in 1948 by the ‘Ley de la Mordaza’ (Gag Law), which was intended to silence pro-independence voices and symbols in Puerto Rico.
To be fair, there is no law or regulation specifying the exact colors of the flag, but as a Puerto Rican who has gazed upon that flag countless times, I consider this to be the light blue version.
Can’t remember which one but he has a lyric in one of his songs that translates to something like “(when I die) bury me with the light blue version of the Puerto Rican flag”
Edit: thanks to all the native speakers who clarified. Been trying my best to read the translated lyrics and learn Spanish.
In LA MuDANZA he namedrops Eugenio María de Hostos, a Puertorican independentist sociologist. Specifically saying that he wishes for a song of his to be played the day Hostos is buried in the island (Hostos' last will was to be buried in Puerto Rico only after its fully sovereign). Bad Bunny is an independentist, he's not subtle about it he just doesn't say it much in anglo media.
“ Si mañana muero, yo espero que nunca olviden mi rostro
Y pongan un tema mío el día que traigan a Hostos
En la caja, la bandera azul clarito
Y que recuerden que siempre fui yo, siempre fui Benito”
From La Mudanza
I'm Puerto Rican, and have been following this subreddit for a long while now. Ngl, seeing the arguments regarding the flag here now is pretty strange and kind of silly to me.
It's clear what his political posture is, and this is a big deal... why? Is he supposed to change his posture because of what "the majority wants"?. So silly.
Politics aside, the light blue just looks better. I remember being a kid, not knowing anything about politics, and just thinking the light blue looks nicer lol.
Edit. Pulling up the referendums is also hilarious. My family is made up of pro statehood supporters and pro independence supporters. Neither bothers voting in the referendums and they are taken not as serious. The "referendums" are glorified opinion polls that congress ignores ever 4 years.
Curious, are there Puerto Ricans who support both independence or becoming a full US state, basically wanting either of those as opposed to the current situation of being a U.S. territory? The territory status seems like such a weird limbo to be in, I can imagine just wanting to shit or get off the pot so to speak, but I don't have enough bg info to know if that's even a stance that exists for this issue.
It's a subject that can polarize people quickly and get them pationate, but yes there are some people who understand that either one is a preferrable option to the current status. Tho, I think most people lean one way or another. There are even some people that really don't care. It's not a clear cut thing.
Both sides of my family get along well precisely because we agree that what we have just does not work.
Definitely so stupid that PR isn’t a state, but with the way Americans are and have been treating Latinos for the last 30-40 years, I guess it’s no surprise that it’s not really welcome by so many.
I, personally, see it as neutral. But as I replied to another comment, although some movements might prefer one shade of blue or the other, these thigs aren't exclusive. I've seen goverment buildings display either one of the three, and political figures in eitherside of the spectrum waving which ever.
It could be… that’s the powerful message I got from Ricky Martin:
🎶 “Quieren quitarme el río y también la playa, quieren el barrio mío y que abuelita se vaya. No, no sueltes la bandera ni olvides el le lo lai, que no quiero que hagan contigo lo que le pasó a Hawái” 🎵
“They want to take away our rivers and beaches, they want our neighborhoods (land) but want to kick out “abuelitas” (grannies). Don’t let go of our flag, and don’t forget our rhythm because I don’t want for us to happen what happened to Hawaii”
Either way, I’m truly amazed at the level of ignorance of many Americans, but mostly from hardcore Republicans. SMH
Puerto Rico is a commonwealth of the United States. Puerto Ricans have U.S. citizenship and, as such, those living on the mainland can vote in U.S. presidential elections.
Puerto Ricans living on the island can only vote for their governor and local legislature.
Puerto Rico has three main political parties: the Partido Popular Democrático favors the current political status; the Partido Nuevo Progresista wants Puerto Rico to become the 51st state; and the Partido Independentista Puertorriqueño supports independence from the U.S.
Martin was singing Bad Bunny’s song “Lo que le Paso a Hawaii” which came out on his album last year and is clearly about drawing a parallel between the colonization and exploitation of Hawaii and Puerto Rico
yes! and on top of that, the song isn't just about independence, it's also about the touristical exploitation our island has been receiving too. many americans move to the island to avoid taxes, displacing native born puerto ricans in the process, americans disrespect our culture and customs in favor of lavish lifestyles, and take over our capitol, "el viejo san juan" or old san juan, the oldest city in the united states, founded in 1521, with large amounts of tourism and unpleasant partying and crime.
I have to remind myself when reading the comments that the people here know flags. But really don’t know much history. Or at least know about the history of Latin-America if it’s not associated with imperialism.
Polls from El Nuevo Día and Atlas Intel both show that it's a split issue with statehood being prefered by around 45% but about a third preferring free association or complete independence. Over 200k votes in the independence referendum were deemed invalid or left blank and voter turnout was only about 64%, this is not a widely agreed upon issue and anyways this post is about bad bunny using the flag signifying that he likely supports free association or independence not all of puerto rico
Elections and independence referendums are not the same. To give you an idea, the last election in Quebec (a Canada province) had a 67% turnout, while the referendum of 1995 had a 93% turnout.
Because if they didn't it would end their legitimacy in the conversation. Getting absolutely reamed in a referendum is a great way to go from kind of relevant to the lunatic fringe in a single night.
it also makes sure that the referendums don’t hit the turnout needed to progress to the next stage—since over a third but under half of PR supports independence. certainly not fringe, in any sense of the word, even if they’re not the majority opinion
if i was from PR I’d certainly be suspicious of statehood, to be frank. in hawai’i statehood has resulted in native hawaiians becoming considerably more of a minority (just about 10% now), at much much higher rates of homelessness, poorer access to food and clean water, and seeing land grabs by the military, us government and tourism industry for returns that don’t come back to them. i think it certainly makes sense that most ppl from PR see statehood as the best way forward—it offers more direct enfranchisement in a country they’re citizens in but can’t vote in, but PR experiences really high rates of gentrification even without statehood, so i can understand the fear that if they become a full state, people from the mainland us will displace and price out the existing population
Why participate in an election if you believed in your ultimate goal and didn't believe you could presently win? Leaving the issue unsettled means you can wait until it settles in your favor. It's not merely a cynical decision.
Guam has something similar. If they think independence is a pipe dream, but statehood for Guam BEFORE PR will be allowed then I got a bridge to sell them.
Major issue for Guam statehood is exactly what PR is facing. The US doesn’t want them as a state. No way they’re letting PR who has more people than the bottom 4 states combined become a state with all those electoral votes. And then no way Guam becomes a state BEFORE Puerto Rico.
This feels reductive. Right now they get the WORST of both systems, no actual representation in the government that controls them but pays to said government. It makes sense that the majority would just want the chance to have a say but it also is not crazy to assume that lots would also want out.
Well, pro-independence people use it a lot. But this is actually the original colors of the flag. Sky blue in the flag means freedom, the sky and ocean. The dark blue you see on other flag is the result of a period were production lines didn’t have sky blue color, but they had a large quantity dark blue due to also producing US flags.
That is not correct. The US had banned the PR flag, and made it illegal to own it to dissuade indepe dence movements, In the 50s the flag was decriminalized when PR became a commonwealth, but they forced them to start using the navy blue so it mat hed the US flag, and as a symbol of US alignement (subservience).
“Si mañana muero, yo espero que nunca olviden mi rostro
Y pongan un tema mío el día que traigan a Hostos
En la caja, la bandera azul clarito
Y que recuerden que siempre fui yo, siempre fui Benito”
Which translates to:
“If I die tomorrow I hope you remember my face, and that you put one of my songs the day they bring back [Eugenio Maria de] Hostos.
In my [funeral] box, the flag with the light blue, and always remember who I was, that I was always Benito”.
Hostos did not want to be buried in a colonized Puerto Rico. He is resting in the Dominican Republic’s National Cemetery until the day he is to come back to his - finally freed - homeland.
For those saying Puerto Ricans would prefer statehood over independence, keep in mind that it is unlikely to be on the table anytime soon, mostly because of racism in the mainland, but also because of the political complexity of such a project.
There were a lot of historical and cultural easter eggs, this was way too planned and choreographed to be a mistake. It was sort of a journey through time as culture and politics evolved, not unlike how the opening ceremony of the Olympics often does; it was just shorter is all.
I'm sure it was intentional considering how much detail was packed into the rest of the performance, I'm going to look into the context of the songs he chose to play + the lyrics more later but I'm not a Spanish speaker so I'll probably miss certain nuances
His most recent discography has a song about how he doesn't want what happened to Hawaii to happen in PR. He hangs out with residente who I would describe as a leftist... He's very seccecionist
The overall messages he seemed to be underscoring were:
* your culture can be celebrated but you have to grapple with the rough patches in order to celebrate the victorious parts
* autonomy of cultures and/or nations does not exclude collaborative, mutually beneficial neighborliness/cooperation
not so much about secession as celebrating collaboration and agency rather than strong-man authoritarianism
edit: the Super Bowl is a championship game, that's not too important here except that it's common for games to have one extended break between segments, and for some sort of entertainment to be performed for the crowd.
Most of the time it's just music or silly fun, for example maybe some fans are brought onto the field to try silly games, a local band does a few songs, a comedian tells some jokes, or whatever. Maybe the mascots from the opposing teams have a fake battle, etc. But the Super Bowl is the biggest event of the sports calendar in the US and the mid-game break usually turns into a massive production like you see in the video.
You'd have to go out of your way to get this version of the flag. It's not the kind of thing a prop person would end up buying by accident trying to get a default Puerto Rican flag
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u/[deleted] Feb 09 '26
He also calls out the names of all American nations and he ends it with "Puerto Rico." So...