r/sleeptrain • u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained • Apr 10 '26
Success Story The 333 Method - a gentle method for anxious mamas
Have you come to this subreddit out of desperation? Does your little one need to be assisted to sleep through feeding, rocking, bouncing, etc? Is your postpartum anxiety overwhelming, and leaving your baby to cry is too painful for you to do, but you know that you have to sleep train for the health of both you and your baby? Is your baby between 4 and 7 months old? Then this sleep training method may be for you.
(Disclaimer: no hate to anyone who does cry it out or other methods! You need to do whatever works for your family! I also can understand how the methods that work quicker might be considered more “gentle” by some, and that’s totally valid. This one is just for the mamas/parents like me who needed something that worked for anxiety over their baby crying)
This method is a combination of pick up/put down, Cribside comfort, and Fuss it Out using something called the 333 method. You’ll need a stopwatch for this (a stopwatch app on your phone will work fine)
Basically what you do is hold baby for no more than 3 minutes. If baby calms down before the 3 minute timer is up, you put them down in their crib (or bassinet) as soon as they are calm, even if it's only been one minute. But no matter what at the end of the 3 minutes, you put them into the crib (yes, even if they are crying). Then you can give Cribside comfort for 3 minutes (this may be cheek rubs, bum pats, shushing, vocal comfort, whatever works as long as they are in the crib and you're not physically holding them). Then after those 3 minutes, you leave baby alone for 3 minutes. No touching or contact at all. If baby is just lightly fussing, you let them fuss it out until they go to sleep. If baby is still crying after 3 minutes of being left alone, or if they escalate from fussing back to crying hard, you go back to Cribside comfort for 3 minutes. If baby calms down after those 3 minutes, you leave baby alone again, but if they're still crying after 3 minutes of Cribside comfort, then you pick them up for no longer than 3 minutes and start the process again. So it's basically a tiered approach. The first night might look something like: pick up, put down & Cribside comfort, leave alone, Cribside comfort, leave alone, Cribside comfort, pick up, put down & Cribside comfort, leave alone, Cribside comfort, leave alone and baby fusses it out until they fall asleep… and so on and so forth. You *follow your baby and what they need*. The key with this is that you don’t allow them to fall asleep in your arms, they MUST fall asleep in their crib on their own, but you are still there with them if they need you (or if, like me, your anxiety prevents you from leaving them). Also an important note, when you are holding them, you are not bouncing them or rocking them at all - just simply holding them in your arms and using your voice if needed to shush/comfort them.
This method teaches baby that the crib is a safe place to fall asleep, but it works well for babies (or parents) who can't do cry it out. I personally was not able to do cry it out because of my anxiety (I was an owlet mama too lol). It only ever involves letting them be to cry for 3 minutes, no longer! And you are still right there by their side the whole time.
The first night I did this method, it took about 40 minutes before my baby fell asleep. But he fell asleep in the crib on his own! For the first time ever! The next night it took about 20 minutes. The following night it took 30 minutes, then for a couple nights I was able to get him down in less than 10 minutes of this method. Finally after about a week, he just would roll over on his own and go to sleep the second I put him in the crib.
Once he started doing that, I would use this same method during his nighttime wake ups, in combination with the 5-3-3 feeding schedule (information about that schedule here: https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/nSZDKHV9Ri ). Then I was able to nap train, which I was able to do in a few of days, and I literally had only done contact naps before this! I also was still able to roomshare until my baby was 7 months old, another thing that was fueled by my anxiety (as a side note, I found that once I was getting more sleep, my postpartum anxiety improved tenfold). Though babies do tend to sleep better if you are not in the room with them, but again… anxiety lol.
If you’re new to the subreddit, be sure to read the pinned resources from the mods! They can be found here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/vBAwkZaHXN
This method works best when it is in combination with a bedtime routine as well as the recommended nap schedule and night feeding schedule appropriate for your little one’s age. Please note you will probably still need to do a night feed until your baby is old enough to be night weaned (usually between 6-9 months). But this method helped my baby go from waking up every 45 minutes to only waking up 1-2 times a night for a feed in about one week. After a month, he went down to one night feed on his own and then ended up weaning from night feeds altogether around 8 months, which is when he started fully sleeping through the night.
Now, of course he occasionally wakes up in the middle of the night. But now I set a timer on my phone for ten minutes, and 98% of the time, he will put himself back to sleep before my timer goes off. If it’s a bad night, like say with teething or sickness, sometimes he will cry for the full ten minutes, and in those cases I go in and give him Cribside comfort again. Usually he will calm after about a minute of Cribside comfort, and put himself back to sleep. But this has only happened a handful of times since sleep training!
If you choose to use this method and have questions, feel free to comment them here or message me! I’m happy to help. I did NOT invent this method, I was able to learn about it through comments on this subreddit, but I thought it would be good to have all the info that helped me in one post :) I sincerely hope this method will work for you like it worked for me! Of course every baby is different, but this one worked for us :)
Best of luck - I am wishing you all a good night’s rest!!
ETA: Be sure baby is on an age-appropriate schedule before sleep training! This is a very important piece of the sleep training puzzle :) if you need help figuring out what schedule would be best, you can comment here, message me, or make your own post in this subreddit! :)
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u/resmirandalee Apr 10 '26
Before you transitioned to using this method for night time wake ups, what did you do when the baby woke up after successfully falling asleep?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 10 '26 edited Apr 11 '26
I would still give him his pacifier and rock his bassinet, which is what we had been doing before this method! I tried really really hard not to nurse him back to sleep, though, as he had a strong feed to sleep association.
The advice I got from the mods of this subreddit was to fix bedtime first, and then do whatever you needed to do during night wake ups for the first few nights. But honestly, he ended up doing a pretty long stretch of sleep the first night after I did this!
I actually ran into a bit of a speed bump when I was doing this, when I tried to go 7-8 hours before I would nurse him back to sleep, which is why I put in my post that it’s really important to read the mod posts on feeding schedules for overnight. During the speed bump, he would wake up after about 6 hours and it was really hard to put him back to sleep, but then I read the mod posts about the feeding schedule and realized that he needed to eat! The night feeding schedule in the mod posts talks about feeding baby if they wake up 5 hours after bedtime, so that would’ve saved me a lot of stress if I had fed him when he needed to be fed (and of course would have saved me a lot of mom guilt also! My poor baby was hungry!)
So to make a long response short - do whatever you need to do for night wakes for at least the first few nights, even if that includes feeding to sleep! :)
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u/Exciting-Radish7466 Apr 10 '26
This is great, I will try it. Thanks for the detailed description. Any experience with a pacifier loving baby? He is 5 months old, has been waking up every 45min - 1h30 at night, used to just need pacifier put back in, but recently hasn't settled until I feed him. I might try your approach. In the 3 minutes I am letting him figure it out, I probably shouldn't replace the paci? He will be yelling.
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u/Conscious_Ad_8374 Apr 11 '26
Unsolicited advice from the mom of a 7 month old pacifier fiend - to help pair with this awesome method (I’m just learning about 333 and wish I’d tried it when I needed it 2 months ago!) - please please please start teaching your baby to find and insert their own paci!! This made SUCH a difference for us when he no longer needed us to be on constant paci-reinsertion-duty.
When doing tummy time etc, we would leave pacis around and let him explore picking the up and figuring out how to put them in his mouth. After just a few days he became a total pro. It was crazy.
Now we sprinkle, like, 10 pacis (seriously) around his crib at night and will literally watch him wake up, swipe around for one nearby, find it, pop it in, and go right back to sleep. No fussing or intervention needed. Huge huge help for making any sleep training more efficient!!
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u/Exciting-Radish7466 Apr 11 '26
Thanks, I will do that! I usually don't give him the paci during the day, only before naps and bedtime, but I do want him to figure out how to put it back in. I think I will let him play with it during tummy time. Appreciate the advice! I have been the paci replacing fairy since he hit the 4 month regression, 2 months ago! Co-sleeping saved us for a month, but I'm ready to try something different, and have him figure out his crib again :)
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u/Flat-Marketing-4524 Apr 18 '26
Did this work for you ?!
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u/Exciting-Radish7466 Apr 19 '26
You mean 333? Not really, but I didn't try that hard. We were in a place that he was already falling asleep in his crib, but with my help - rubbing his head, replacing paci, singing for 5-10 min. I was good with that and didn't feel like I needed him to fall asleep completely independently yet, and it had seemed to help with the hourly wakings. I tried 333 for the 1030pm wakings when I felt it was too early to feed him, but I only did it 2 nights in a row. I lasted 20min of him basically crying the whole time, he did fall asleep both times at the end but only for 1min then was back awake crying. I think he was just hungry so I've let that go for now. I just feed him and assume his first wake will get later as he's ready.
I have been letting him practice putting the paci in his mouth during the day. His dexterity is getting a lot better, but I think it'll be a few weeks still before he can do it in the middle of the night!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 11 '26
Yes this is great advice!! :) we also used to leave a few binkies in my baby’s crib with him haha
Glad you like the 333 method!! :)
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 10 '26 edited Apr 10 '26
So my baby did take a pacifier for a long time! I would give him his pacifier as part of Cribside comfort :) so if he needed it replaced at that time, I would give it to him. But you’re right that you shouldn’t replace it while you are leaving him alone!
My baby actually ended up not needing the pacifier to go to sleep about a month after sleep training, and then we just never reintroduced it again!
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u/Exciting-Radish7466 Apr 10 '26
Thank you!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 10 '26
Of course!! I hope this method works for you! :)
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u/al0ha-sam0sa Apr 19 '26
Thank you so much for sharing this method with us, I can’t believe it but it has WORKED and is working so quickly!! Baby (4 months) is getting better at nighttime independent sleep (still wakes for feeds and some general fussiness but honestly night and day compared to even a week ago!) so I decided to try this method on his naps, which he is still fighting. Lots of tears and screams, despite rocking and shushing for what feels like ages. I’m confident in his wake windows and total sleep needs during the day vs night, so convinced it’s not under or over tiredness. Decided to give this method a whirl because it’s gentler than letting him cry without support and he’s already crying so what harm could it do?
When I tell you I am GOBSMACKED that it’s worked so quickly… the first day I wasn’t convinced as it felt like he wasn’t calming down for ages, but after 10 mins (had just started cribside comforting again) he was out like a light! Just stopped crying, turned his head and fell asleep.
The second day (yesterday) it only took 1 minute of holding him before he was calm, and another 3 minutes of cribside comforting to get him to drop off. Same thing today!
I know it’s only been 3 days but I’m honestly in shock at how well he has responded. Thank you SO much for summarising it so well and for being so helpful in the comments. This post has saved me!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 19 '26
Oh my goodness congratulations!!!!!! I am so so so so so happy for you and so glad that it worked :) This is why I shared this post - to help parents like you! Thank you for sharing your success story with this method, that absolutely warms my heart :) and give yourself credit also! This information is so much at once but you’ve done the research and put in the effort to help your baby get better sleep and that is SO hard and SO important. Amazing job!!!
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u/Party_Ad_8381 Apr 22 '26
Hiii !! How old is your baby when you did this ? My baby is 15 weeks and is fighting naps and nighttime sleep like nothing and it’s driving me insane . I want to try this method - but worried if it’s too early ?
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u/al0ha-sam0sa Apr 22 '26
Hello! My baby was 17 weeks, just a day before he was 4 months old! I was at the end of my rope by 15 weeks as well but was trying desperately to hold out to 4 months (but caved 1 day before oops 😂). I have no clue if it’s too early I’m sorry, I did try the pick up put down method with him at bedtime around that time and got no success, but not sure if that was due to his age or if this 333 method is just better.
I do have to say that I think baby was coming out/had already come out of his sleep regression by the time I started this, as he was getting better at falling asleep at nighttime and naps were slowly getting longer. I had also pushed his wake windows a lot longer than huckleberry advised because I was certain that he was lower sleep needs, and everything I’ve read on this page suggested that his crying could be due to under tiredness (not over tiredness as I was so worried about!!). Have you tried playing around with extending wake windows to make sure that baby is properly tired? I think that really helped him to stop fighting me for as long!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 22 '26
Hi there! Please wait a little longer - babies need to be 4 months before they are able to self sooth. So sleep training should not be done before baby is 4 months old! That being said, this method does work best with babies who are between 4-6 months. So for now, I would read through the mod posts and take the time to educate yourself about sleep training! This would have saved me sooooo many questions and pitfalls in the beginning if I had read through these resources first.
I hope this method works for you!! Best of luck :)
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u/AcrobaticProposal800 15d ago
Ok I just have to say I've done ONE NIGHT of this at bedtime and holy cow.
Here's where we were at:
- Baby just turned 4 months. He's been a pretty good sleeper but over the past week or two the 4-month regression + transitioning out of a merlin suit and into a sleep sack have hit us hard.
- Screaming and fighting naps (that wind up only being 30 mins when they do happen)
- Overnight wakes have increased rapidly. I feed to sleep, but we've gone from two wake-ups at about 5 hours and 8 hours to waking about every 2-3 hours, and sometimes waking within 15-30 mins of going back down and only accepting the boob to fall back asleep
Changes we made yesterday:
- Shifted from Huckleberry wake windows to a 2/2/2/2/2 schedule. It was modified yesterday because the baby woke up late yesterday morning after a rough night, so we actually went with 2/2/2/2.5 to get him to sleep earlier.
- Other than shifting wake windows, didn't do anything different for naps. He didn't scream or fight a single nap, fell asleep within 10 mins for all of them. Naps were still short, about 30 mins each.
- Went 333 for bedtime. Baby was sleepy and happy going down, but started fussing within a few minutes of being placed in crib. Committed to the 333 structure and it took an hour, but with only one pick-up (i.e., lots of fussing but we only escalated to full-blown crying for a few minutes). Baby was asleep after an hour of 333.
- Baby woke up after an hour and we froze in terror. THEN, i went into the nursery and figured i'd try cribside comfort first. I gave him about 5 mins of cribside comfort and he went back to sleep without issue. Didn't pick him up at all.
- Had one more wakeup after about 3.5 hours of sleeping. Typically I would default to nursing back to sleep, but I figured I'd try 10 mins of cribside comfort to see if I could ease him back to sleep without getting him out of the crib to feed. Lo and behold, within 10 mins he fell back asleep.
- Next thing I know, it's 6am. Baby has been in his crib for 12 full hours and has fasted all night for the first time ever.
As I sit here... baby is on minute 71 of his first nap of the day. He woke up after 30 minutes as usual, but after rolling around in the crib for a little while, put himself back to sleep. My husband observed when putting him down that he actually wasn't showing a ton of interest in the paci (or pinky - sometimes we'll let him suck on pinky if he keeps dropping paci), and as soon as he got out of baby's way, baby rolled over onto his side and started sucking his fingers and put himself right to sleep.
All of this to say.... this has made an immediate, major difference for us. If you're wondering whether you should try it.......... TRY IT. The best part is that I was there in the room with our baby the whole hour and so never felt like I was leaving him to work through something on his own with no resources.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 15d ago edited 15d ago
This is going to make me cry!!!! I’m so so so happy for you!!!!!!! I had the same experience with seeing an immediate difference after just one night of 333 :) I’m so glad it’s working for you and your baby!
I also really love how you added that you liked being able to stay with baby all night without feeling like you were leaving him with no resources. This is exactly why I love the 333 method! I couldn’t leave my baby while he was awake and crying while he was that young, and this allowed me to feel comfortable with helping him learn how to sleep independently. Now that he’s older, I can leave him a bit longer to sort himself out because I know he has the skill! :)
I also love that he has been able to have longer naps too!! We saw the same thing with my baby! That means your baby is learning to connect sleep cycles, and 333 is working!
Keep doing what you’re doing as long as this works for you and your baby! I just want to flag something as a roadblock that I ran into just in case you run into the same thing I did - around the 3rd night or so, my baby started waking up and crying for a long time. It took me a while to figure out he was hungry! If you run into this, you can employ the 5-3-3 feeding schedule, as most babies do still need a night feed at this age. Sometimes initially when sleep training, babies can go a long time without eating (usually because they’re catching up on some much needed sleep following a period of poor sleeping!) but babies do tend to realize they are hungry and start to fight sleep training around the 3rd or 4th night. If you run into this, be sure to follow the 5-3-3 feeding schedule (here is a resource on that: https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/nSZDKHV9Ri ) and continue to do 333 (or cribside comfort!) outside of any feeding wakes. But otherwise, you’re doing this perfectly!!
Thank you so much for sharing your experience! I’m so glad it’s going so well for you :) it’s a lot of info to process but you’re doing a great job!
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u/AcrobaticProposal800 15d ago
Thanks so much!!! And definitely not counting on the full nighttime fast continuing. He's a growing boy!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 15d ago
I’m so so so happy for you guys :) and thank you again for sharing your experience! I’m wishing you a very restful night 🥰
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u/upthep00per Apr 11 '26
Love this!! This sounds like what we have been using since he was 9 months old (14 months now) and call the “hug hug kiss kiss” method lol. We love it because we can hug him and kiss him and tell him we love him and put him down to sleep. CIO wasn’t working for baby or us. The first week took about 8 rounds. You have to be patient and consistent. Now it’s down to none, one or two. Having a little regression nowadays as he’s dropped his second nap and so trying it again. Thanks for encapsulating it so methodically!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 11 '26
Of course! I’m glad you like how I explained it and I’m glad this has been working for your baby! I love calling it the hug hug kiss kiss method 🥰
I had to kind of piece together a lot of things from a lot of different posts and comments and things, so I figured I’d put all of the info into one big post for any newbies! Reading the mod posts for example would have saved me a lot of headaches in the beginning, as I was trying to do this method without a sleep schedule or the 5/3/3 feeding method. I’m just happy to help others learn that there are alternatives to CIO if that doesn’t work for your family (again, no hate if you are able to do CIO! You gotta do whatever works). I am so grateful to this subreddit for helping me and my baby when we were sleep training so I am happy to pay it forward :)
Thanks for sharing your success with using this method!! I’m hoping it works for lots of other parents out there!
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u/AcceptableMuffin217 Apr 12 '26
Hi! Could you please share with your method steps?
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u/upthep00per Apr 12 '26
Hi there--it's more or less a variation of OP's method!
What we do (for now):
- Baby has a routine at bedtime--bottle, brush teeth, books, sleepsack, pacifier, light's out.
- When he is drowsy, we put him down in the crib. We caress him briefly, tell him we love him, it's time for sleep, good night. Then leave the room.
- One minute (use a stopwatch) we watch him on the monitor. He might get up and fuss/cry.
- After one minute, we go in, and without lifting him out of the crib, hug him, kiss him, tell him we love him, lay him back down in the crib (our baby prefers to be stomach down) and pat his back a little bit. We are not there for more than a minute. Then, say goodnight and leave the room.
- One minute. If he's not asleep, we go in again and repeat.
After the first four rounds of this, we extend the out of room time to 2 minutes.
Usually by round 8 or 9, baby is ready to give up (you can tell his fussing gets more tired rather than upset, etc), and we can pat his back for a little longer and he goes to sleep.
Your patience just has to outlast baby's. You can do anything for one to two minutes at a time and so can baby!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 12 '26
This is so great! I love how you put it at the end, you can do anything for one or two minutes and so can baby :) this way also seems more appropriate for an older baby! Thanks for sharing!
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u/---dayman--- Apr 24 '26
Hey!! Thank you SO much for making this post. As soon as I read all the details I just knew this method felt right for me and my family ❤️
I just did night one with my 6 month old and bedtime took just 15 minutes before she settled down!! Amazing!!! Now one of her main problems is, since about the age of 2 months, she has a false start Every. Night. about 30-60 minutes after bedtime, with the exception of a handful of nights. I do not plan to nightwean right away. I often manage the false start by nursing because it always calms her immediately. Do you think I should count this as a MOTN wake and nurse as usual? Or treat more as a continuation of bedtime and employ 333 again?
PS we’ve tried everything for the false starts - shorter wake window, longer wake window, we just can’t get em to stop!! Hopefully sleep training helps lol
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 24 '26
Hi there! I’m so so so glad that this method feels right for you and that you had a successful bedtime!!
So I personally would treat this false start as a regular MOTN wake and nurse for a few nights. After you’ve done 333 at bedtime for 2-3 nights, then start using 333 for night wakes using the 5-3-3 feeding schedule!
Can I ask what wake windows your little one is following? I found that my baby would have a false start if I didn’t get the last wake window perfect - for my baby it was exactly 4 hours by 6 months. Some parents find that shorter earlier windows and a longer last window can help!
But I would start with using 333 for night wakes and see if that helps :) I’m wishing you the best of luck! Feel free to ask any more questions if you run into them! :)
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u/---dayman--- Apr 24 '26
Thank you so much for your kindness and willingness to help!
Night one last night had no false start!! Could have been a fluke but I’m feeling hopeful. My husband and I spoke and we agreed to treat false start as MOTN for now if it happens, so I’m glad you agree!
Her daytime naps are still only 30-40 minutes on the dot, so WW are usually 2/2/2.25/2.5/3. She gets soooo sleepy by the 2.5-3 hour mark because her naps are so short!!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 24 '26 edited Apr 24 '26
That’s so great that there was no false start!! It is very likely due to sleep training :) baby is learning how to connect those sleep cycles!! She is a fast learner!! :) Definitely keep doing MOTN wakes as you would normally, then after a few nights you can start employing 333 and the 5-3-3 feeding schedule :)
Sleep training should also help lengthen those naps a little bit! If it doesn’t, you could consider a schedule adjustment. Many babies at 6 months are ready to go down to 3 naps, but it’s a lot easier to fix their schedule once they have been sleep trained for nights!
I’m wishing you the best of luck, and I’m happy to be of help if you run into any issues! :)
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u/---dayman--- Apr 29 '26
Hi!! I wanted to check in and get your thoughts! It’s been 6 nights so far, and she generally falls asleep after 10-15 min of crying/fussing using the 333 method at bedtime. Sometimes has a false start, sometimes doesn’t! She’s waking up 3 times per night on average, every 3-4 hours, which is rough. Prior to her 4 month regression, she was previously down to 1-2 MOTN wakes, which I desperately miss. We have not started training MOTN or naps yet. Last night we tried using 333 for her false start, my husband did it, and it sounded like pretty intense crying on and off for 20+ min :(
How do you know when it’s the right time to start sleep training MOTN or for naps? Do you wait until she doesn’t cry/fuss at bedtime anymore?
Thanks again for all your help and insight!!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 29 '26
Hi there! So I would say after 6 nights you can definitely start using 333 for middle of the night wakes, so you’re definitely on the right track! I would make sure you’re following the 5-3-3 feeding schedule and start training those middle of the night wakes. Here is a really good resource on that: https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/nSZDKHV9Ri
I think this might be a schedule issue. Is she still doing 4 naps? By 6 months I think you could definitely go down to 3 naps and try to stretch those wake windows a little bit. I think this could help lengthen her naps a little bit, and then she could probably do a longer wake window before bedtime which should give her enough sleep pressure to help with those false starts. A good starting schedule could be 2.25/2.5/2.75/3.25, and you could try lengthening total awake time by about 15 minutes per day until you find a sweet spot.
The schedule is honestly the hardest part to figure out, it’s a lot of trial and error! My baby was on 2 naps by 6 months, and this made a huge difference in him being able to sleep longer stretches at night.
The other piece of advice I have, and this is really difficult to do if you have anxiety over your baby crying, but try to give her a little tiny bit of time to work herself out during those false starts before going in to do 333 with her. If she is lightly fussing, you should be able to leave her to fuss it out and put herself back to sleep. If she’s crying hard, try to give her just 5 minutes before going in to sleep train. If you can go longer, you can try that - I personally have never been able to wait longer than 10 minutes of crying but that’s just because my postpartum anxiety was so bad. But letting her fuss it out to see if she goes back to sleep should be the first step, then you can go in and do 333 if she isn’t able to settle on her own first! But I honestly think cutting her down to 3 naps will make the biggest difference here.
And as far as naps, I’d wait until baby is down to 2-3 wake ups per night, then move to training for naps! Right now it’s important she is getting good naps in to help her sleep pressure to train for overnight.
I hope this info is helpful for you! I’m definitely not an expert but this is what has helped me and others on here! :) best of luck!
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u/---dayman--- May 01 '26
Thank you so much for such a detailed response! We actually have been on a three nap per day schedule since your last comment, which I think has been helping! However, we still definitely need to work on perfecting her wake windows. For example, she gets so tired earlier in the day, so those windows are a bit shorter, which leads to a very lengthy wake window at the end of the day and possible overtiredness, which I know can also cause false starts! I’ll definitely try to spread the love, so to speak, based on the times that you suggested! I find it so hard to extend WW when I see her fussing and showing sleepy cues, but I think I just need to power through a bit and slowly extend!
However, since my last message to you, she fell asleep in under 10 minutes two nights ago, then under two minutes last night! We’re down to feeding twice per night, and we did one MOTN 333 session last night, which took about 20 minutes or so, so I was very happy about that!
Overall, I’m feeling very hopeful about her progress, and I really appreciate your help!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained May 01 '26
I totally hear you! It can be so hard to stretch wake windows. It can take babies a little while to get used to the new schedule, but it’s totally worth it. Distraction will be your best friend when it comes to lengthening wake windows! Getting a good schedule is such an important part of sleep training that often gets overlooked. But you’re doing all the right things!
I’m so glad that things are going well with bedtime and that you’re down to two feeds!! It sounds like you’re definitely moving in the right direction, and you should be so proud of yourself and baby!! Wishing you the best of luck moving forward, and let me know if I can do anything else to help :)
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u/friendlypanda767 16d ago
Thank you so much, super helpful! Everything was telling me he was overtired. I followed your advice yesterday and he went down in about 5 minutes and only woke twice in the night and went back in his cot both times. Hope it continues!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 16d ago
That’s fantastic!!! I’m so happy for you!!!!! :)
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u/29shmae 14d ago
Hello OP, thank you so much for sharing this. We started training our daughter a few days ago and saw immediate progress. We’re trying to train for naps but she’s been waking up after 25mins. How do you extend naps when sleep training or is that even a possibility? I rescued the first one today with a contact nap and tried to rescue the second with 3-3-3 and it was a disaster. She was so worked up. I had to resort to rocking and then contact nap.
Thank you once again for all your help.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 14d ago
Hi there!
So first I would focus just on nighttime sleep for a couple of weeks honestly. Depending on daughter’s age, I’d aim to get nighttime wakes down to 1-3 wakes per night pretty consistently for a little bit before training naps.
The other thing I’d look at is your schedule! Usually getting a schedule fix and training nights will let baby transfer sleeping skills to the daytime! It’s also important for nighttime sleep to get baby on a good nap schedule. I’m happy to help you figure out a good schedule for baby’s age! How old is baby and how many naps does she take a day? Do you follow any set wake windows, and if so, what ones do you follow?
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u/29shmae 14d ago
She’s 20 weeks, 17 adjusted. We’re currently on night 4 and she’s woken twice every night. She’s been responsive to nap training but the issue is the length. In this case should we still delay?
We follow wake windows. Typically 2/2/2/2.25/2.5. So 3 proper naps and one bridge nap. Wake at 7 and sleep 7:30-8. Her first stretch is usually 6hrs and then wake up at 2. I feed and she’s normally asleep by the time I lay her back to her cot. She wakes again at around 5 or 6. I feed again and usually just hold her until it’s time to wake up. This morning she only woke up once though, at 2. She then soothed herself around 6 until she was up just before 7.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 14d ago
That sounds like great progress already! 2 feeds is definitely still developmentally normal for this age. The schedule also looks pretty good. I would say keep doing this for a week and as long as she stays around only one or two night wakes, then you’re good to try training naps again. Sometimes babies just need a little more practice at night before they can transfer the skills to the daytime. You can use the 333 method, or you can use the nap training method recommended by the mods! Many people have had a lot of success with this once their babies have been nighttime sleep trained for a while. Here is a good resource on that method:
https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/GX0R2vI63R
I personally used 333 for naps though and found it worked really well for my baby. But the method above might work better in helping your baby learn to stretch the naps on her own. It’s harder to rescue naps when babies are just starting to learn to self-sooth. It gets easier again when they have the skill down a little better.
If you try to nap train again after a week and it’s still not stretching her naps, I would try cutting down to 3 naps and skipping the bridge nap altogether. It might seem a bit early for 3 naps, but some babies are just very low sleep needs and need to cut naps sooner than others. My baby was down to 3 naps by 5.5 months and he’s pretty low sleep needs, he was also 4 weeks early! A good starter schedule is 2/2.5/2.5/3, and then add 15 minutes here and there until you find a sweet spot. Usually having less naps can cause them to stretch a little as baby consolidates their daytime sleep.
But honestly, I think it sounds like things are going really well for you! Just giving her that week or so to get night sleep figured out before worrying about naps might do the trick. She may surprise you and figure it out in her own, or you may just need a slight schedule adjustment :) let me know if you need anything or have any other questions! Wishing you a very restful night!
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u/29shmae 12d ago
We’ve decided to hold off on formal training for naps until night sleep is fully established. She’s been STTN for a few days but woke up at 4 today. Tried to soothe herself back to sleep but by 4:50 was already fussing more. I fed her and transferred back to crib soon after. She seemed to soothe herself to sleep but then started fussing and escalating. How do you handle wake ups this close to morning? I end up holding her just to extend her sleep. Tried to transfer multiple times already as she seems trying to soothe but she would wake up and fuss again.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 12d ago
If she has been sleeping from bedtime until 4am and wakes up, she needs to be fed! I would feed her and put her back to bed. Babies who are hungry won’t soothe themselves, and she is unlikely to be ready to drop night feeds altogether until she is much older. A baby only waking once or twice a night for feeds is considered fully sleep trained!
Here is a great resource on night feeds and night weaning:
https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/nSZDKHV9Ri
I followed this advice and my baby dropped night feeds on his own and was sleeping through the night without any feeds by 8 months! Some babies can do it younger, but some babies need to be fed overnight until 9 months. Follow the info from the above resource for night wakes and night feeds :)
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u/29shmae 11d ago
Thanks! I definitely would be feeding her. I suppose my question is more around what happens after. I fed her this morning and was not able to resettle her in her crib. After multiple attempts, I just held her sleeping on me until 7am wake up.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 11d ago
You would use whatever sleep training method that baby knows!
I will say though, if baby doesn’t settle herself within a few minutes after a feed, it probably means she is undertired. I would look at your schedule and try to add more awake time during the day. If baby is awake for over an hour overnight after feeding, then baby just isn’t tired enough. Ensure baby is getting a MINIMUM of 10 hours awake during the day with no more than 3.5 hours of daytime sleep. And then add 15 minutes each day until you find a sweet spot :)
It really does sound like your baby may be ready for a 2/2.5/2.5/3 schedule. I think this could solve some of the problems you’re having. You could always try it and go back to a 4 nap schedule if it didn’t work for her.
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u/Curious-Brilliant149 8d ago edited 8d ago
FTM here with an almost 5 month old and I've been following this thread closely because I feel like I sit somewhere in the middle. I’m not looking for a hard sleep training approach, but I also realized nursing to sleep became our only tool and it was becoming physically and emotionally exhausting for me.
We've been trying to gradually reduce comfort sucking (15 min → 10 → 5), while adding other soothing methods before jumping into something bigger. I was terrified because I genuinely felt like if breastfeeding stopped working, I had nothing else.
What surprised me is my baby started showing me otherwise: rocking worked one night, back rubs worked another, sometimes the soother worked, and there were a few wakes where she didn't even seem to want to nurse back to sleep.
Current pattern seems to be emerging around wake windows of ~1h30–1h55, usually one longer restorative nap and smaller naps around it, but the number of naps still wildly varies between 3–5 naps depending on the day. Total daytime sleep usually lands around 3–4 hours with total awake time around ~8.5–9 hours. Wake time tends to be around 6:15–7:30 am and bedtime is usually somewhere between 7–8:30 pm depending on naps and whether we need a little bridge nap.
I keep wondering if we're heading in the right direction or if I'm unintentionally making sleep harder.
I’m still nervous about making sleep worse or missing cues, but I’m starting to wonder if part of the process is also learning to trust our babies a bit more and trust ourselves more. Curious if anyone else did a gradual approach before starting 333 and whether building other soothing tools first helped?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 8d ago
Hi there!
I’m glad that you’ve been following this thread! I am of the opinion that you have to do what works for you and your family! For me, I was big on feeding or rocking to sleep. I noticed a similar pattern with my baby where he started waking more and more frequently. I honestly didn’t start sleep training until it started that he would wake up every 45 minutes. Every 2 hours I was fine with, as at least I got to sleep about an hour and a half between feeds. But the sleep cycles got shorter and shorter… and then I was desperate.
But I think you’re on the right track with just gradually reducing the amount of help you’re giving to your baby! Sometimes, that’s all a baby needs :) my baby, as many others, just needed a more structured approach.
But honestly, what I wish someone would have told me early on, is that a schedule is the BIGGEST piece of the puzzle when it comes to sleep. Not that every nap needs to be at the same time every day, but just that babies need to increase their awake time gradually as they get older. If I were to go back and do it again, I’d make sure baby was getting at least 10 hours of awake time and no more than 3.5 hours of daytime sleep by the time he was 5 months. Sometimes I wonder if this would’ve solved a lot of my issues early on!
But it’s good to have a sleep training method in your back pocket just in case :) I hope 333 works for you if you do end up needing one, but also I think it’s totally fine to just trust your instincts and do what works for your family! If it stops working, that’s when you need intervention. But if it’s working for you and baby, then don’t fix what’s not broken!
If you need any help later on down the line, feel free to ask! :)
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u/Curious-Brilliant149 8d ago
What would you suggest regarding schedule ? My baby have somewhat higher sleep needs & is sensitive. I am just curious which tweak you would recommend
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 8d ago
I would just start paying attention to wake windows and make sure baby is getting a consistent amount of awake time each day! For 4 months, the minimum is 9.5 hours awake in a day :) so that should be good for a higher sleep needs baby! For a 5 month old, the minimum is 10 hours. I would also try to make sure baby has the same number of naps every day, rather than changing each day. For 5 months with higher sleep needs, you could do a 2/2/2/2/2 schedule - where each wake window is 2 hours and baby takes 4 naps. But of course you could tweak this! The biggest thing is just making sure baby is awake for long enough during the day so that they don’t need to be awake a lot overnight :)
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u/SFMONEYGAL 4d ago
Hi there! Couple questions:
- how does the pacifier fit in here?
- do you put the paci back in while you hold them or just during crib side support?
Thank you!!!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 3d ago
Hi there! I would put the pacifier back in during cribside comfort when I did this with my baby :) I also kept replacing it during the full 3 minutes of cribside comfort, as many times as he needed, and you can also do it when you’re holding baby. But just make sure not to be doing it during the 3 minutes where you’re leaving baby be! :)
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u/Whole_Deer_8058 Apr 11 '26
Would this work for 10 month old? He nurses to sleep, and is currently waking every hour or all night and now his naps are split too, and sometimes have to finish as a contact nap. I am so beyond exhausted. His sleep has been this bad or nearly this bad since 6 months old. But I can’t do Ferber or cry it out, it’s too much for me, and it seems to backfire and make him more anxious and hysterical.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 11 '26
I’m not sure, I have heard that pick up/put down can be too stressful for babies older than 7 months. But you could always give it a try!
If it doesn’t work, I’d recommend just taking the “pick up” step out of it altogether and just doing on and off Cribside comfort/fuss it out. With an older baby you might want to do slightly more than 3 minutes, but definitely adapt it to whatever works for you!
Can I ask what his schedule is like? Do you follow wake windows? How many naps is he on, etc?
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u/Whole_Deer_8058 Apr 24 '26
He is on 2 naps. He has a 2.5 or 3 hour first wake window (because the nights are so bad he’s usually over tired), second is around 3.5, last is 3.5-4.5 depending on how naps went. Usually the first nap is around 9-10, and lasts 1h 15 mins to 1.5 hours. Second nap is around 2:30 and lasts an hour to 1.5 max (and usually he wakes after one cycle and I have to hold him). Nights are absolutely awful, waking every hour.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 24 '26
I don’t think your baby has enough awake time in the day! Babies need about 10 hours of awake time minimum by 4 months, but most babies this age need much more. I would definitely consider a schedule adjustment.
I would also start cutting down on the amount of time he sleeps during the day. Maximum at 4 months is 3.5 hours total across all naps. Most babies need much less. I would try capping daytime sleep at 2.5 hours total across all naps.
A good starting 2 nap schedule is 3/3/4, so 3 hours for the first two wake windows and 4 for the last wake window. If your baby is waking up multiple times overnight, that usually means they are just not tired enough. Either that, or they don’t know how to connect sleep cycles on their own. Sleep training would definitely help this! I would check out the mod posts - I have the link in my post above! They have some sleep training methods that will work better for an older baby. But I really think your schedule is probably the issue.
I’m wishing you the best of luck! Hopefully you can get a good night’s rest soon ♥️
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u/Embarrassed-Flan-968 Apr 14 '26
We are in the same boat with an 11 month old. Will be trying this starting this weekend.
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u/Whole_Deer_8058 Apr 24 '26
How did this go?
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u/Embarrassed-Flan-968 Apr 24 '26
You’re asking on a good day! So we started last Friday night, the first night we did 8 or so rounds, the next night 6 or 7, so on and so forth. I noticed as we went she probably needed to cry longer, because basically as soon as I would leave the room she would stand up and start crying but as soon as I came back she would lay down and start to settle. So I started leaving for 4/5 minutes instead of three and eventually a few nights ago I tried 10. She did cry the whole time and that was as much as my mama heart could take but as soon as I went back in she settled and fell asleep. Yesterday she happened to refuse her afternoon nap, and when I put her down, she cried but it was very much a “I’m tired and I know if I cry you’ll eventually come back”, so I let her cry for 7 minutes and as soon as I went in she knocked out. She slept 11 hours in her crib by herself! I feel like a new woman 🤣
Overnight she doesn’t wake much but when she did, I would just shush her and she would settle back down. Last night was the first night I didn’t sleep in the same room as her and I had to go in at 4 to give her her paci but otherwise it was a quiet night.
All that to say, we’ve adjusted as we’ve seen what is working for her and I think we still have some work to do to get her to really settle solo at night, but I like this approach as I don’t think I could do a full CIO for my own mental state.
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u/Flat-Marketing-4524 Apr 18 '26
In the same boat with 9 month old...have you tried this and did it work ?
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u/Whole_Deer_8058 Apr 24 '26
I haven’t. I’m honestly so tired I don’t even have the energy to try another new thing that takes effort with no guarantee. 😮💨 totally in survival mode
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u/jmobo26 May 01 '26 edited May 01 '26
Hi there, wondering if your baby struggles with reflux or if that's been considered at all? Reflux is the bane of our existence with our about-to-be-7-month-old and we suspect that's playing a HUGE part in his nighttime awakenings-- both because it wakes him up at night, but also because it's impacting his ability to feed during the day (only takes small, frequent feeds ever since his reflux began, and we've never since been able to get him to take the kind of large volumes he used to take before the reflux set in). As a result, he wakes up more at night to feed also, because we're struggling to get in all his calories during the day.
Reflux should be considered even if the baby doesn't spit up. Our baby rarely, if ever spits up, and that's been the case since he was born. But we can hear him refluxing and swallowing the reflux. It also manifests as post-feed arching, crying, coughing, and occasionally even sneezing.
My wife learned that nursing to sleep out of desperation was a double-edged sword, because it was effective, but he ended up waking up every hour all night. We eventually realized that the more we feed him at night, the more he awakens, which is how we put two and two together. Now that we're starting to wean night feedings, he's been sleeping longer stretches at night (though still waking up twice a night seemingly due to hunger alone, we suspect due to the poor daytime feeding as mentioned above).
Discussing / reading about sleep with a reflux baby is soul-sucking, because it often feels like no one has to deal with this aspect. ("put down awake but drowsy"-- how about the 30-40 min we have to hold him upright beforehand?. "increase daytime feeds to wean nighttime feeds"-- we would if we could, but we've tried absolutely everything to get him to take more and we can't force feed the kid).
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u/shru_pan Apr 12 '26
OP, will this work for a 7 month old high temperament baby?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 12 '26
I think it would probably work for a high temperament baby, but 7 months is the cutoff I’ve heard mentioned for the Pick Up/Put Down method, which is what this method is mostly based around. It’s usually better for younger babies, but you could definitely give it a try!! The way I’d adapt this for an older baby is maybe lengthening the amount of time you are leaving them alone. So instead of 3 minutes, maybe try 4 or 5 to give baby more time to fuss it out! But you could always try the original way and see if it works to see if it would need to be adapted for your baby. Another commenter did say they used this with their 9 month old, so I definitely think the 333 method is worth a try!
If this method doesn’t work, you could try just removing the “pick up” piece of it and just do on and off Cribside comfort/fuss it out! But I would try to lengthen the amount of time you leave them alone, still.
Any sleep training method can be adapted for what works best for your baby! :)
I’m wishing you the best of luck!
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u/shru_pan Apr 12 '26
Thank you so much for the detailed reply let alone the post. ❤️
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 12 '26
Of course!! This subreddit helped me so much, I was suffering from such intense sleep deprivation which was making me so anxious and depressed, and sleep training SAVED me. I wouldn’t have been able to do it without this subreddit, so I am so happy to pay it forward since so many others on here helped me!
Let me know if you have any other questions, and make sure to read the mod posts when you get a chance! They have so much good info on there. Wishing you a good night’s rest! :)
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u/Dazzling-Basis8145 Apr 12 '26
Thank you for sharing this. I’m so sad, our baby is not doing well with Ferber. Tonight during her crying she scratched herself pretty bad (my fault for needing to trim her nails but she is “self soothing” by scratching). We’re going to stop Ferber and try this. Baby girl is 4m
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 12 '26
4 months would be the perfect age to try this method! I hope you have better luck with this one. I’m sorry to hear that she scratched herself :(
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u/Dazzling-Basis8145 Apr 13 '26
Thank you so much! She fell asleep in 12 min!!🙌🏼😭
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 13 '26
Oh my gosh!! That’s so amazing!!!!!! Congratulations 😭
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u/Dazzling-Basis8145 Apr 13 '26
Now we need to figure out the night wakings 😅😅😅
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 14 '26
Totally! After a couple of nights of doing this at bedtime, you can start the 5/3/3 feeding schedule and employ the 333 method anytime baby wakes up outside of their feeding times :)
Hoping it’s still going well for you!!
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u/biscuitsgraham Apr 14 '26
My 4.5 month old has been going through the “progression” for 4 weeks now. False starts every night, waking every 45 min to 1 hour all night long. I started cosleeping to cope but even that’s not helping. We have to continue sharing a room due to space constraints but I’d like him to be in his crib. This method sounds good for us! Questions for you:
How drowsy should they be when you start holding them for 3 minutes? Did you rock them beforehand?
Do you stay in the room when you leave the baby alone for 3 minutes?
If you had false starts before trying this method, did this help?
Thank you!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 14 '26
Hi there!
Baby should be at the end of their wake window, and you don’t have to do anything special to get them to be drowsy, just take them through their typical bedtime routine! The key is to build sleep pressure, but not to assist them to drowsiness. Make sure you’re on a good schedule for your baby’s age! Info on this can be found in the mod posts :) I will say though, you do NOT want to rock your baby at all whatsoever throughout this entire process. That is assisting them to sleep, and it’s a very hard habit to break if done in tandem with sleep training. No rocking at all, just hold them in your arms, you can do some vocal comfort and shushing if you like. If they’re calm, or if it’s bee 3 minutes, put them in the crib and start your first Cribside comfort timer :)
It’s really up to you, but I personally didn’t. I think many parents do leave the room, but I was too anxious to leave baby and also leaving and coming back in seemed to be too disruptive for putting him to sleep. Since it was only 3 minutes, I found it easier to just stay at his Cribside for the 3 minutes so I could go right back to Cribside comfort if he wasn’t calm after being left alone for 3 minutes.
Idk if I’d really call them false starts, my baby just literally wasn’t connecting a single sleep cycle. He would wake up every 45 minutes-1 hour without fail for about a month before we started this method! And within the first night it cut down on overnight wakes.
Let me know if you have any other questions!! I hope this goes well for you! :)
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u/biscuitsgraham Apr 14 '26
Thank you so much for the detailed response!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 14 '26
Of course! Best of luck and let me know if I can do anything else to help
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u/pinklinkfly Apr 15 '26
This method sounds perfect for our family! Thanks for sharing this!!
I am wondering if me and my husband can switch off or if this method works best if just him or I do it for the night and then maybe alternate nights? Currently I am the one with the "magic touch" and am often the only one that can get him to sleep, but I seriously need this task to be shared.
Secondly, where is the room is your crib/bassinet? I'm ready to sleep train, but not ready to quit room sharing. We really only have room for the bassinet at bedside since our bedroom is small. Does it makes a difference whether it's bedside or somewhere else in the room for success?
And lastly, when you started this at nap time, did you use the crib/bassinet in your room or a crib in baby's room? We currently do contact naps only, but id like to get him sleeping independently for naps and it work best if those are in his crib in his own room. But he has never slept in his crib before. Would that make it more difficult to have separate daytime and nighttime sleeping areas?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 15 '26
Hi there!
Personally the way I did this is that I was the one who sleep trained and then after baby was nighttime and nap trained, I taught my husband the routine for putting baby down and we made the transition. There was some resistance from baby at first when dad tried, but after a few days of my husband doing one of the naps, either one of us could do it. I have heard of parents trading off during sleep training though! I have heard some people doing two nights with one parent, then two nights with the other, and trading off like that. The only reason I’d be hesitant with that is that consistency is really key with sleep training especially in the beginning. So for me, I was nervous my husband would deviate from the way I was doing things and that it would be confusing for our baby. But I would say my husband started helping about three weeks after initial sleep training, so that way I knew baby could put himself to sleep and could handle a small change.
When I initially sleep trained, we actually were doing it in a bedside bassinet! The kind where the side comes down, and we put the side up after baby was asleep. So you can definitely do it with a bedside sleeper if that works for you! As long as it’s a safe sleep environment of course :) we transitioned to the crib after baby was sleep and nap trained! There was again a little resistance when we switched to the crib (just a few extra minutes of crying when initially put down, similar to the resistance when dad started helping) but he got used to it pretty quickly. Baby started rolling both ways shortly after sleep training which is why we had to transition him to his crib. But actually when we did it, we had a bed in the nursery for me to sleep on so he was still in the same room, just switched from a bassinet to a crib within the same room and I slept in the same room as him until he was about 7 months! Even though technically with sleep training they recommend putting baby in their own room, but my anxiety was too bad for that at the time. But in my experience, I was able to sleep in a bed right next to the bassinet after baby was asleep and he still did well!
I am not sure about your last question, I don’t have personal experience with that as we had him in the same room for naps and overnight sleep. Part of me thinks it could be confusing for baby if it’s in an unfamiliar environment - part of what makes nap training easier is that they are used to putting themselves to sleep at night so then they transfer that skill to daytime, I’m not sure if they would know what they are supposed to do in a different environment. Is the bassinet moveable? Would it be possible/easy for you to just move the bassinet to the different rooms? That way at least baby is familiar with the sleep surface. And then after he is fully trained you could transition to the crib and see how that goes! That would be very non-expert non-professional advice haha
I’m wishing you the best of luck! Let me know if you have any other questions and I hope it goes well for you! :)
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u/pinklinkfly Apr 15 '26
Thank you so much for your reply! Lots of good info, we will definitely be trying this. I knew sleep would be hard, but as a FTM, I did not anticipate it would be this DIFFICULT 🙃
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 15 '26
No I totally hear you. When your baby doesn’t sleep well, it’s an all-consuming thing. I feel like all I thought about for months was my baby’s sleep. Now though, my baby is a phenomenal independent sleeper! He’s 10 months old and I just put him in his crib about thirty minutes ago, walked out of the room, and now he’s sleeping peacefully while I eat lunch and scroll on Reddit haha things are so different now! And we also used to only contact nap and deal with 10-12 wakeups overnight. It is possible and you’re on the right path!! :)
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u/navy5540 Apr 16 '26
Hi!!! Hoping I can implement this method soon! Wondering though, how do you deal with night wakings? Right now, baby seems to be legitimately hungry when waking overnight but I can’t force him to eat more during the day so I don’t know how to fix this without starving him!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 16 '26
Hi there!
So for the first few nights, you can handle night wakings however you currently are addressing them. So you’ll implement the 333 method for bedtime, then anytime they wake up after that, you can assist them to sleep, so whether that’s feeding to sleep or rocking to sleep, whatever works is fine! After a few nights of doing it that way, you want to implement the 5/3/3 feeding schedule. Here is a post that explains that in depth:
https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/33iu7fNXrw
But basically, if baby wakes 5 hours (or more) after bedtime, you can feed them! If they wake up before then, you use the 333 method again. Then if they wake up 3 hours (or more) after that feed, you can feed again! If it’s been less than 3 hours, you do 333 again. And again after that second feed, if it’s been 3 hours, you feed again and that usually is the time baby would wake up because at that point it would be 11 hours since bedtime.
Once baby is fully sleep trained, the night wakes should naturally decrease so that baby is mostly just waking up 1-2 times for feeds. My baby actually then naturally dropped to one feed and dropped the night feeds altogether around 8 months. About a month after sleep training, what I started doing for night wakes outside of his feeding times, I would set a timer for 10 minutes. Most of the time, baby would put himself back to sleep before the timer went off. If my timer went off and he was still crying, I would go in and give Cribside comfort for a couple of minutes and he’d usually settle. If he wasn’t crying and was just lightly fussing or calm in his crib, I’d leave him alone and he’d put himself back to sleep eventually.
I hope this answers your question! Let me know if you need anything else! Best of luck :)
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u/saira277 Apr 22 '26
On average how many naps is your LO having in the day, and how long are the naps? Also thank you for sharing your method and all the help and input you are sharing with everyone.
Hoping to try this tomorrow xx
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 22 '26
Hi there, so my baby is extremely low sleep needs. At the time we were sleep training, he was doing 3 naps but they were very short. He would often fight them and end up waking up after about 45 minutes. We ended up cutting to two naps once we started nap training, and then he was able to do longer naps, usually 1-1.5 hours each! I always made sure to cap daytime sleep if it went longer than 3 hours. He was almost 6 months at this time. But again, he is verrrrrry low sleep needs. Most babies need more naps at that age! I did find that he needed at least 3.5 hours of awake time before bedtime in order to have a good bedtime :)
Right now my baby is almost 11 months old and he takes one nap, usually it is 2-2.5 hours!
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u/LowConfusion1062 Apr 16 '26
Do you think this would work on 14 month old twins? I've recently been having a super hard time putting them to sleep (nap or night), but with dad, they are easy breezy. I am at home with them all day. Losing a lot of mon confidence with this issue!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 16 '26
Hi there!
I think the picking up part of this would be too stimulating for older babies. There is a commenter below though who adapted it for an older baby, she said her baby is 14 months old and they’ve been doing this since her little one was 9 months!
She calls it “hug hug kiss kiss” and it’s basically the same thing but without picking baby up, so it’s on and off Cribside comfort / fuss it out. She has a really detailed comment in this thread that might be helpful to you!
I would personally lengthen the amount of time you are leaving them alone since they are older, you could start small with just 4 or 5 minutes instead of 3 minutes, and go from there! :)
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u/tschuss1516 Apr 20 '26
We’ve been co-sleeping smoothly up until now (10 weeks) but wanting to transition to bassinet and in attempting my daughter just wakes up immediately when we place her in bassinet (sometimes eyes pop right open and she doesn’t cry, other times she cries) and will often immediately settle after we pick her up from bassinet but then needs bouncing to fall back asleep. We’ve tried 5-6 times to then put her back to sleep and then into bassinet with no success so will attempt this method but have a few questions
- I’m curious if you could describe “calm” and if that means eyes open or closed? Or does it matter?
- It might be that it’s too soon to try to transition and should wait a few weeks?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 20 '26
It’s definitely too soon to do any kind of sleep training if your baby is only 10 weeks old - Babies need to be at least 4 months old in order to sleep train. They are unable to self sooth prior to this age.
I’d say if you need to rock her to sleep for now then that’s totally fine, and take the time to read the mod posts about sleep training to prepare for your start at 4 months!
When your baby is old enough to start sleep training, I’d say “calm” just means not crying and not fussing too too much. But her eyes don’t have to be closed, in fact if her eyes start to close you should put her in the bassinet. But again, that’s only when she’s old enough! For now it’s totally fine to hold her until she’s asleep. Until 4 months, you definitely need to assist baby to sleep.
Best of luck! :)
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u/tschuss1516 Apr 20 '26
Okay good to know! Any posts on tips for putting baby in bassinet then at this age? we can easily assist her back to sleep in our arms, but then eyes pop open immediately as soon as she is set into bassinet 🫣
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 20 '26
We aren’t allowed to give any kind of sleep training advice for babies under 4 months here :/ you might have more luck finding tips from r/beyondthebump ! I would ask there, as it’s against the rules here to give any sleep training advice to babies too young, but there might be other tips elsewhere that don’t have to do with sleep training :) best of luck!
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u/tschuss1516 Apr 20 '26
Solid thank you! Not trying to push any sleep training on younger babe, just looking for tips to do these kinds of transitions in general so will check out that other threads 🙏
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u/Away_Pain_2808 Apr 22 '26
are you doing this with the crib in your room? if you let him cry do you walk out of the room?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 22 '26
I did it with the crib in my room! (Or rather.. the bed in his room haha we have a full bed in his nursery that I slept on for the first 7 months of baby’s life!)
I did not leave the room during the 3 minutes of fuss it out! After he fell asleep, I did usually leave the room for a couple of hours, from about 8:30-10:30, but then would come back to sleep in the nursery.
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u/hanbeetee Apr 27 '26
I’m trying this method with my 4 mo 4 week old, he’s 5 mo next week. And I’ve started with naps as recommended and he’s only slept for 2 10 mins stretches today. Should I just go back to the top of the method when he wake up after that short of a time or should I just end the naps like I have. Also how do you deal with howling it might take them to fall asleep and wake windows bc he’s crud himself awake past his ideal wake window
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 27 '26
Hi there! Where were you recommended to start with naps? I would never start with naps personally. I would start with this method at bedtime first, and handle middle of the night wakes as usual (feeding, rocking, whatever you were doing before). Once you have done this at bedtime for a few days, then start using 333 for middle of the night wake. Make sure you are also following the 5-3-3 feeding schedule! You can find information about that in the mod posts, the link is in my post :)
Once night sleep is fixed (meaning you’re down to only 1-2 night wake ups), THEN I would focus on nap training! It is very difficult to sleep train babies when you start with naps. Fixing bedtime first is always best practice. If you continue to try to start with naps, I think you will have a very difficult time sleep training :(
I think the excessive crying will likely only be present in the beginning, but if this method works for your baby then you should notice a change within a few days!
Best of luck! Let me know if you have any other questions :)
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u/Successful_Coast8467 Apr 27 '26
Hi, I am trying this method for my 19 week old baby since last wednesday. First time it took us 40 minutes for her to fall asleep, the next day cca 20 min, then again 40 min and since then she falls asleep very fast, within 10-15 minutes. Always during the second step. The first night she slept through without problem, the second night she woke after 50 minutes and went quickly back to sleep when I gave her the pacifier that fell out of her mouth. And since the third night she keeps waking up at least two or three times after she settles to sleep. Like awaker crying 20 min after she sleeps, then 10 minutes, again 10 or 20 or 5 minutes later. She settles back quickly, but it would of course be better if she just slept through without waking up so much. Do you have any advice as to why this is happening?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 27 '26
Hi there, this sounds like it could be a schedule issue! What is her schedule like - how long are her wake windows, how many naps is she taking, and what is your bedtime routine?
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u/Successful_Coast8467 Apr 27 '26
Admittedly, we had no real schedule up until today. I was aware of wake windows and that at this age she should be sleeping about 12-14 hours in total over 24 hours. After reading your post I dived into it all and also realized that it might be a schedule issue and that she probably was not awake enough during the day. So it is really good to read that you also think that it might be a schedule issue. It means that I seem to be able to make some sense of all this new information about babies sleeping. Its like a whole new world to me and I am so glad I found your post at what seems to be quite the right time for my little one (and for me of course).
Her wake up time was around 8 and bedtime also around 8 with 3-4 hours of naps. 4 hours usually on the days that she had bad nights and slept for 8.5-9 hours in total during the night.
Based on our situation I chose now a schedule with 4 naps and 2 hours wake windows in between. She shows signs of being tired just before being 2 hours awake and she falls asleep quite fast during the day after being awake for about two hours. 4 naps also because she only ever sleeps 30 min in her crib and to get her to sleep longer I have to use a carrier. Then she can sleep for an hour or hour and a half. Furthermore she gets quite cranky as the day progresses so the last two hours before bed are always a challenge to keep her occupied and not fussing/crying. That is why I thought that the schedule with 4 naps and 2 hours wake windows might be suitable for my baby. But I only started with it today. She still woke up 3 times in the hour after her bedtime. But I assume that she needs to get used to the schedule first before that might improve. What do you think?
Bedtime routine is also quite limited I think. We close the curtains together, then pyjama and diaper change. White noise. Sleeping bag. Cuddles and kisses good night. I eventually want to add a bedtime story reading but at the moment she hates going to bed and cries every time as soon as we close the curtains so we dont get the space/opportunity to do it yet. She might settle a when changing her diaper but begins crying again when I put het in the sleeping bag.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 28 '26
So is your schedule 2/2/2/2/2? With those dashes being where the naps are? And she is 4 months old, correct?
I think it sounds like your baby is undertired. If she is waking up so much, she does not have enough sleep pressure to keep her sleeping. She should not have more than 3.5 hours of total daytime sleep, so if you are trying to get her to nap an hour for each of the 4 naps then that is too much daytime sleep and likely why she is waking up so much after bedtime. I would cap her daytime sleep at 3.5 hours total across all naps. However, many babies need less daytime sleep, 3.5 hours is the maximum at 4 months. And 10 hours of awake time is the minimum - it sounds like your baby might need more daytime awake time and less daytime sleep, especially with her waking up from her naps so quick (though this could also be that she doesn’t know how to connect sleep cycles)
I would also try to lengthen her wake window before bed! Babies are usually able to stay awake longer in the evenings. So a good schedule adjustment could be 1.75/2/2/2.25/2.5 this also adds a little bit more awake time to try to build sleep pressure.
I would try that schedule, capping naps at 3.5 hours total. Then I would start using 333 for middle of the night wake ups, even if it’s right after she went to sleep. Start following the 5-3-3 feeding schedule as described in the mod’s night weaning post :)
I know this is so much information! But it is so worth it. Figuring out a schedule is tough, but it is such an important factor in sleep training. I’m wishing you the best of luck!
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u/Successful_Coast8467 Apr 28 '26
Yes the schedule that I did yesterday and today was 2/2/2/2/2 and she is 20 weeks over two days, so about 4 and a half months already :) But from tomorrow I will try the schedule that you suggested. How fast should we notice if it works? In other words, do I need to give it at least a week to see if it works? Or is two or three days enough and if she still wakes up so much in the hour after her bedtime during three consecutive days then I need to tweak the schedule?
Thanks so much for your fast replies and for taking the time to read and answer all these questions on top of sharing your method! I really appreciate it and am very greatful for your time end energy.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 28 '26
Yeah a few days should be enough to know if it’s working or not! If it doesn’t work after trying it for a couple of days, then I’d try tweaking it :)
No problem! I am happy to help. My baby used to be the WORST sleeper and I would have been lost without this sub. I am so happy to pay it forward after so many helped me here! Sleep deprivation is a special kind of torture
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u/Successful_Coast8467 Apr 28 '26
I have one more question about WW. Does it count included the bedtime routine, for example two hours WW would mean that you start your 15 minuten bedtime routine at 1 hour 45 min ww? Or is it the actual two hours and then you start your bedtime routine?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 28 '26
Wake windows are just the total time that baby is awake! So from eyes open to eyes closed is the wake window, including the bedtime routine. So yes, if the wake window is 2 hours then there would be 1hr 45min of awake time and then a 15 minute bedtime routine would put you at the full 2 hours for the wake window :)
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u/Crazy_Art_5093 May 02 '26
Hiii! I would love to try this. Baby is 16 weeks now and exclusively contact nap but sleeps in crib during the night. We would like to get her to nap in her crib.
At bedtime we rock to sleep, place in crib usually with pacifier and she sleeps through the night with 2 wakes for feeding then goes back to sleep each time. 8:30PM to 9AM is usually the sleeping hours.
Would you suggest we try this method for naps only or start doing this method for bedtime instead of our usual rock to sleep- place in crib method THEN move onto naps to maintain consistency?
Hope this makes sense,
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained May 02 '26
Hi there!
Yes you could definitely use this for naps, but I would recommend using it for bedtime first since that is usually easier. But I would definitely wait until baby is at least 4 months to try any kind of sleep training method. Getting baby on a good schedule will also help with naps! A good starting schedule for 4 month olds is 2/2/2/2/2 if you’re interested :)
I also think going this for bedtime first will help baby go to sleep a little more independently which can help once baby goes through the sleep change at 4 months (which sometimes is called the “4 month sleep regression”). Then once baby has this skill for bedtime, it’s MUCH easier to translate this skill to naps. But I have found that having a good schedule for naptime is the most helpful way to transfer from contact naps to crib naps.
And for what it’s worth, my baby still used a pacifier for naps and night sleep until he was about 7 months old :) lots of people will recommend getting rid of the paci for sleep training, but we were able to sleep train while using it! We would replace it as part of the Cribside comfort step of this method :)
Best of luck! Let me know if there’s anything else I can do to help :)
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u/Sweetpup_ May 05 '26
Trialling this method with my 5.5 mo and he goes down at night after one round of the 3/3/3 but still wakes up 45 mins later, and when I then repeat after a false start he gets increasingly agitated. Any advice on troubleshooting? Thanks!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained May 05 '26
Hi there, what’s your schedule like? This could be a schedule issue. How many naps does he take, and are you following wake windows?
The first couple of nights you try this, or any sleep training method, you should only be doing it at bedtime, and assisting to sleep for any other night wakes. Then after a few nights of doing this just at bedtime, you can do it for the night wakes outside of his scheduled feeds (here’s a resource on the recommended overnight feeding schedule: https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/nSZDKHV9Ri )
But if baby is waking after 45 minutes, it’s probably a schedule issue! If you tell me about your nap schedule I can try to help :)
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u/Sweetpup_ May 05 '26 edited 29d ago
Yep only trying the method at night. Up at 6:30am then 2/2.5/2.5/2.5. His nap lengths are 45 mins / 45 mins (no matter what I try, I cannot get him to extend his first two naps of the day), then a 1.5 hour contact nap in the arvo. For the last week, we have been getting him down at 7pm/7:30pm after dropping his 4th nap which used to be a 20 min cat nap around 5:30/6pm. He has had the exact same bedtime routine since he was a month old, bath, book, feed, short play, sleep. He is EBF, sometimes he falls asleep feeding, sometimes rocked. Thanks so much for your help!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 29d ago
So first thing I’d do is move to a 2/2.5/2.5/3 schedule. Babies need minimum 10 hours of awake time during the day, but may need more. 3 hours before bedtime is ideal at this age to get baby nice and tired. So lengthen that wake window to 3 hours :) next thing I’d do is move the feed to the start of your bedtime routine instead of the end - ideally the feed will end 30 minutes before baby is put into crib. Once you do those two things, you can move forward with 333! :)
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u/Sweetpup_ 29d ago
Thanks so much, will try tonight. Also, I had been leaving the room with lights off / standing outside bedroom door to listen, when we share the bedroom (crib next to my side of bed). Would you suggest staying in the room (ie resting on my side of the bed) with the lights off as more realistic? Does it matter?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 29d ago
You can do either way, but I will tell you what worked for me!
I just stayed on my bed during the 3 minutes of leaving baby alone, because I found that to be quieter/less disruptive than leaving the room every single time I was letting him be. Since it’s only 3 minutes, it was usually best for me to just stay put and wait out the timer. I would advise that the room be completely pitch black dark if you are doing this though, to make sure baby can’t actually see you. But some people do prefer to fully leave the room! I would usually wait until baby fell asleep, then I’d leave the room for a couple of hours (8:30-10:30) just to get some stuff done around the house, then I’d come back into the room at 10:30 to sleep :)
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u/Sweetpup_ 29d ago
Did this tonight after stretching the last wake window and he fell asleep solo in the first 2 mins 🤞🤞🤞 thanks so much, let’s see if it lasts!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 29d ago
Congrats!!! 🎉
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u/Sweetpup_ 29d ago
Unfortunately, we had another false start and he woke 50 mins later, settled, then woke 30 mins later. 😵💫
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 29d ago edited 29d ago
That’s okay! Sometimes it’s not immediate. I would try this schedule for a couple of days and if you’re still having trouble, try adding in a half hour of awake time. Maybe something like 2/2.5/2.75/3.25 and see if that works. If not, you might need to look into a different sleep training method. Different ones work for different babies, but honestly I would bet this is a schedule issue! Babies need a MINIMUM of ten hours awake, but many need more by this age. My baby currently needs about 11.5 hours of awake time during the day or he won’t sleep for very long overnight. It’s a delicate balance! But you’re on the right track!! It’s not something that happens immediately, it takes consistency :)
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u/SandcastlestoTheSea 27d ago
Hi! We’re currently trying this but I’m unsure if we’re doing it correctly 😳
We’ve done 2 nights. Baby fell asleep night 1 after about 50 mins and took about 40 mins last night. Is it possible he’s falling asleep out of sheer exhaustion from crying so much? It’s also hard for me to tell if he’s falling asleep in the crib or in my arms (it takes forever but then happens so fast as I’m putting him down). Also is it counterproductive if he falls asleep during the crib-side comfort portion?
My baby is 19 weeks old. The 4 month sleep regression hit us hard with us having a couple of false starts when putting him down then he was waking up hysterically crying almost every hour. The last 2 nights he’s had a false start but then at least has slept for a ~4 hour chunk. It’s been followed by another ~2 hour chunk and then he’s up at least every hour for the latter part of the night. Fluke? Related to the 333 method?
I know that was a lot! If you have any insights I would super appreciate it!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 27d ago
I would say this definitely isn’t a fluke! If baby went from waking & crying every hour to sleeping longer chunks after using this method, then you’re completely on the right track!! This is similar to the progress I saw for my baby :) after a few nights of doing 333 at bedtime, you can implement the 5-3-3 feeding schedule and use 333 for any wake ups outside of the feeding times. Here’s a resource on that:
https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/nSZDKHV9Ri
May I also ask about your schedule? Just since you’re wondering if he’s falling asleep from exhaustion (which I don’t think is the case, because he is also sleeping longer stretches, but also you do want babies to be properly tired to go down for the night). How many naps is he doing? What wake windows do you follow? How do naps look right now? This is an important piece of the puzzle! Getting the right schedule could also help those false starts :)
But so far you’re definitely on the right track and baby is making great progress!! :)
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u/SandcastlestoTheSea 27d ago
Thank you for your time!!
Our schedule is a bit of a mess since childcare alternates between me, my husband (3am - 8am), and my mom intermittently but we’ve been following the Huckleberry app and it’s suggested sweet spots. We had been doing 3-4 naps/day. 4 when his naps are especially short. From reviewing this subreddit I’m trying to take more control over the times vs blindly following the app.
He’s not a great napper and mostly contact naps on me now while we sort out night sleep. This week I’m trying for 3 naps/day as I suspect he may be lower sleep needs. A rough schedule is 1.75/2.5/2.5-3. (Was hoping to get the overnight sleep slightly more predictable then work on the naps). His naps tend to be about 40 mins max, sometimes about an hour.
If it helps, he woke from his last nap just before 4pm the last 3 days and we aim for a 7pm bedtime (though it’s closer to 8 by the time he’s fallen asleep).
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 27d ago edited 27d ago
I love that you’re trying to get more control over his schedule! We also tried the huckleberry app, and it really seems to only work for babies who are “high sleep needs” and not for the average baby. My baby is low sleep needs, so it didn’t work for us.
It looks like your schedule might be missing a wake window! The one you posted only has 2 naps, but I would recommend a 2/2.5/2.5/3 schedule to start for a 3 nap schedule. Babies at this age need a minimum of 10 hours awake, but some need more! The consistency in schedules and naps will help overnight sleep immensely. Try to get those wake windows to 2/2.5/2.5/3 and I think baby’s night sleep will vastly improve, in combination with the 333 method! For now, you can do naps however they work - whether it’s contact napping, feeding to sleep, etc. I think lengthening the wake windows will also help extend those naps! But for now, what’s important is just that he’s getting enough daytime awake time :) so if that’s contact naps for now, that’s perfectly fine!!
I would say your goal should be to get baby down to 2 night wakes, and they should be roughly around the time that he is supposed to eat. Once he is down to 1-2 night wakes for at least a week, you can nap train. I personally used the 333 method for nap training, but the mods also have a resource on a nap training method that many people have luck with!
Here are the pinned posts from the mods, they’re really great resources as you’re learning about baby sleep!
https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/vBAwkZaHXN
It’s definitely a process to get baby to be sleep trained. There’s lots of pieces to the puzzle! But a sleep training method (like 333!) and a good schedule are the biggest pieces. So you are completely on the right track and it sounds like you are making great progress!! I hope you are very proud of both you and baby :) I know it can feel overwhelming, but sleep training is the BEST thing I did for myself and my baby!
Please let me know if you have any other questions and if I can help at all :)
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u/SandcastlestoTheSea 22d ago
Just wanted to chime in to thank you for the help! I find I’m easily distracted once baby needs something. We’re getting better with the falling asleep, now working on the rest.
Hopefully we won’t have too many questions!!
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u/RachelFitBliss 24d ago
When you say leave alone, am I leaving the room?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 24d ago
I personally didn’t! I stayed right beside the crib, but I didn’t touch baby or make any noise. Some people do leave the room, but I personally think that’s more disruptive because of the opening and closing of the door and walking around the room, especially when it’s only 3 minutes. I would just make sure the room is pitch black dark and you have a white noise machine so baby is as unaware of you as possible
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u/tangoiceblast99 23d ago
Hey, my baby is almost 7 months now and currently cosleeping for the majority of the night as when he wakes up for his first bottle around 10:30pm, it’s seemingly impossible to get him settle back down in his cot which is my main issue. So you think this method would work for him and correct the issues I’m facing?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 23d ago
I definitely think 333 could work for you! It also sounds like it could be a schedule issue though, which I’m happy to help you figure out :)
What is baby’s schedule like? How many naps does he get in a day, and are you following certain wake windows?
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u/tangoiceblast99 23d ago
Thank you!
At the minute he’s on 3 naps a day usually 2/2/2.5/2.5-3 He wakes up around 7:30am and bedtime is around 7/7:30pm He’s also having split nights recently so I think it definitely is something to do with his schedule
I know the wake windows should be longer but he gets tired before the suggested 3 hours so I feel like I have to put him to sleep, chat gpt has told me he has high sleep needs😂
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 23d ago
ChatGPT is the worst for sleep training I hate to tell you 😭😭 everything is pointing to your baby being undertired, not overtired. If your baby was high sleep needs, they probably wouldn’t be waking up so much overnight. But no worries! A good schedule can be a game changer :)
First thing I would change is bedtime and wake up time. The most you can expect from your baby is 11 hours overnight, whether or not there are wake ups. This is definitely not enough awake time in your schedule also - babies need about 10 hours awake by 5 months old, but babies this age usually need much more. So this means if you want baby to wake up at 7:30am, bedtime should be 8:30pm. If you are okay with baby waking up at 6:30am, then 7:30pm works fine as a bedtime!
I would also recommend following wake windows more closely! Sleepy cues aren’t actually reliable at this age. Babies might rub their eyes because they’re irritated and they might yawn because they’re bored. I wouldn’t go by these, it’s better to follow wake windows! I would recommend having at minimum 3 hours awake before bedtime in order to build sleep pressure. But honestly, closer to 4 hours will help baby stay asleep overnight. This would also probably help your false start! Schedule will be the most important step to get right before sleep training.
If you stay with 3 naps, I’d recommend at least 2/2.5/2.5/3, but with your baby’s age, something like 2/2.52.75/3.25 will probably be more appropriate. If you want to try 2 naps, you could start with 3/3/4. Distraction will be your best friend when it comes to lengthening your wake windows! Just do it by 15 minutes a day and you will see that your baby adjusts :) it’s more likely that baby just isn’t used to longer wake windows, not that they aren’t capable of them!
I’d work on first making sure baby has at LEAST 10-11 hours of awake time during the day, then once you’re there, go for sleep training bedtime! :)
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u/causeproblems 22d ago
Hi there! Thank you SO much for taking questions. I feel so overwhelmed and so exhausted I can’t think straight. Currently have my 17 month old in the Snoo (electric bassinet) in our room. He’s never slept well — currently it’s bedtime at 7:30/8 and then the first wake up is anywhere from 10:30 to 12:30, then again every two hours until 4:30 am where he’s wide awake. His last nap lasts until 5:30 pm at the latest.
How do you recommend starting this technique? Using the Snoo in our room or transitioning to crib? The Snoo comes with a swaddle but he hates having his arms strapped down (also hates the Love to Dream swaddle). I was considering using the Merlin Magic Suit in the Snoo and strapping him down? Or just use the suit in the crib and sleep in the nursery with him?
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 22d ago
Hi there! I totally get where you are coming from! I remember being in your shoes and it’s so overwhelming!!
Before I answer questions though, did you mean to say 7 month old? Because this method probably isn’t recommended for a 17 month old! 7 months is the oldest that this method would work for. But I’d be happy to help you learn about some other strategies for a 17 month old!
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u/causeproblems 22d ago
17 weeks! Sorry, brain dead haha. He's 4 months.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 22d ago edited 22d ago
No worries at all!! 4 months is the perfect time to use 333 :)
So it’s really up to you where the location is! I personally sleep trained my baby in a bassinet in his nursery, and then the transition into the crib was really easy. He was used to his bassinet, so that seemed the most logical to me! Then once he learned to self soothe, the transferring of that skill into the crib went really smoothly :) but I know that some people sleep train in a crib and that works for them! I just tried to eliminate as much change as possible for my baby. Plus it’s a little more convenient for you to pick up and put down baby in a bassinet versus a crib :)
But the first thing you need to do is make sure baby is on an age appropriate schedule! How many naps does baby do right now, and are you following wake windows? By 4 months, a good starter schedule would be 2/2/2/2/2! That means baby takes 4 naps and has 2 hour wake windows :) but this can be adjusted for your specific baby’s needs! I’d also recommend establishing a bedtime routine and making sure the last feed of the day ends at least 30 minutes prior to putting baby in the crib at the beginning of the sleep training :)
You’re going to start with sleep training ONLY bedtime. That means you do 333 at bedtime until baby is asleep. Then for middle of the night wakes, continue to put baby to sleep however it works for you, whether that’s feeding to sleep, rocking to sleep, whatever has worked for baby so far! After sleep training only at bedtime for a few nights, start using the 5-3-3 feeding schedule. Here is some info on that:
https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/nSZDKHV9Ri
Any wakes outside of night feeds, you’ll use 333 :) over time, baby should get down to 1-3 night wakes! At that time, you can start nap training :)
I know this is a lot of info, so please don’t hesitate to ask any questions if you have them!
Also I would NOT recommend using the Merlin sleep sack. I’ve heard it’s really hard to transition out of. And honestly it is probably easier to sleep train while baby is not swaddled! Babies suck on their hands to help them self sooth. My baby always needed a free hand to suck on to put himself to sleep :) we used this transitional swaddle to get baby used to sleeping without a swaddle and it worked really well for him! https://a.co/d/0dzqNmHF
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u/friendlypanda767 18d ago
Hey! Thank you for sharing this, it’s been really helpful for my 20 week old. The first night it took 35 minutes to get him down, the second night 25 minutes, and the third night 15 minutes. It seemed to be helping with his false starts (?) he was waking up after 45 minutes- 1 hour after I was putting him down to sleep when I was previously feeding him to sleep. He has been going to bed around 7:30-8 and would always wake up not long after and I would have to go through the process again to get him back to sleep. After starting this method there were no false starts after putting him to bed the first 2 times, but then did wake up as we went to bed around 2-3 hours later as he is still in his next to me cot and at that time he would wake up at the slightest noise or movement. The third night he woke up around 1.5hrs after putting him down. When he wakes up after being put down for the night I have been feeding him back to sleep as I would usually do and sometimes he will go back in his cot. More recently, I feed him to sleep and he falls asleep on me but wakes and cries as soon as I try to put him down. I’ve ended up co-sleeping as it’s the only way either of us get any sleep, but he still wakes and wants to feed quite often. He’ll wake and feed for 5/10 minutes and then fall asleep on me again, but if I attempted to put him in his cot he would again wake up and cry. During the day, wake windows vary from 1.5hrs-2.5hrs, getting longer as the days go on, getting around 2.5hrs-3.5hrs of sleep during the day. Is there anything that I can change to get him to go back I his cot and have longer sleeps during the night? I have tried to get him to nap more during the day, but unless he’s in his pram or contact napping I can only get him to nap for around 30 minutes at a time! There seems to be conflicting advice, I have tried using ChatGPT and the Napper app to know how long he needs to be sleeping during the day, but nothing seems to be work. Hope that is clear! Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks so much.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 18d ago edited 18d ago
Hi there! So this definitely seems like your baby is undertired. But that can easily be fixed with a schedule change! 1.5 hours for a wake window is wayyyyy too short for a 4 month old, let alone a baby who is almost 5 months.
A good starter schedule is 2/2/2/2/2, which means every single wake window is 2 hours and baby takes 4 naps. But that’s typically for a 4 month old. I would say your baby probably needs closer to 3 hours before bedtime in order to build the sleep pressure. False starts typically mean that baby is undertired and didn’t get enough awake time before bedtime. We really want to build that sleep pressure! If baby is still waking up 2-3 times per night, and he isn’t going back down after feeding, then you need more awake time in your schedule.
Aim for at minimum 10 hours, whether that’s 2/2/2/2/2 or possibly 2/2.5/2.5/3 (my baby saw a huge improvement in long overnight wakes after we cut him down to 3 naps, with at least 3 hours awake before bedtime, so this might be a good step for you). It sounds like the sleep training method itself worked well for your baby since you saw so much improvement! Now we just need to get the right schedule, which can be a bit of trial and error, but it’s worth it and an important piece of the puzzle! If you’re worried your baby can’t do a 3 hour wake window, just add 15 minutes of awake time at a time. It’s likely not that your baby can’t do that much awake time, just that they aren’t used to it. Once baby is up to at least 10 hours of awake time, try that schedule for a few days. If you still have the same problem, add in 15 more minutes here and there until you find a sweet spot.
I would also limit daytime sleep to only 3 hours total across all naps. So if baby is doing 3 naps, let’s say he does 1.5 hours for the first nap, 1 hour for the second nap, that last nap should only be a half hour and you might have to wake him up from the nap and that’s perfectly fine!
So in summary: adding in more awake time and capping the total amount of daytime sleep should help baby build sleep pressure to be able to sleep more overnight!
Once you have minimum of 10 hours of awake time in your schedule, I would also start employing the 5-3-3 feeding schedule. This will inform you when you should feed baby back to sleep. Outside of these feeds, you should use 333 to put baby back to sleep. Try your best not to cosleep just because baby will develop a preference for it and it can be harder for them to sleep independently. Your baby is still young so it’s not too much of a concern, but could become more difficult as he gets older.
Here is a helpful post about the 5-3-3 feeding schedule:
https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/nSZDKHV9Ri
I hope this is all helpful!! Please let me know if you have any questions or need anything else :) best of luck!!
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u/friendlypanda767 20h ago
Hey! Thanks so much for your advice. We were getting on really well with this, after about a week of using this method my baby was putting himself to sleep with no help and did his first 6 hour stretch with only 1 other wake up that night. However, he then got a cold and we had a heatwave which threw everything off. He is still able to put himself to sleep without help the last few nights, but he has been waking up a lot more. Last night he woke up around an hour after putting him to bed and he was able to settle himself back to sleep, he then woke again around an hour later and we were able to settle him back down quite quickly but he then woke up again an hour later, I fed him to sleep and he went back in his cot okay, but then woke up an hour later and would just cry and cry if I put him back in his cot, so he ended up sleeping next to me (he goes to sleep quite quickly when I put him next to me). I do try to avoid co sleeping but I end up too exhausted otherwise! I have tried using 333 over night to get him back to sleep but he doesn’t seem to respond to it very well at night. His current nap schedule is usually 3 naps a day, 2/2.5/2.5/3 is what I aim for, but checking back it looks like he’s generally getting just under 10 hours of wake time a day. He does seem to be waking around every hour at night at the moment. Do I need to look at increasing wake time during the day? He is now nearly 5.5 months. We tend to put him down to bed between 7:30-8:30 depending on when his last nap is as he wakes at a different time every day. Thanks for your help!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 18h ago
So I would definitely look at increasing his awake time! It seems like he needs more awake time. Some babies are ready to drop to 2 naps by 6 months, but right now you have a LOT of wiggle room with your schedule as 10 hours awake is the minimum of awake time. Babies will gradually need more awake time as they get older, so your schedule will be an ever-changing piece of the puzzle! It’s always good to try a schedule change when you start seeing frequent night wakes for a few nights in a row.
I’d also make sure you’re capping day sleep at around 3 hours across all naps and expecting an 11 hour night. So for example, if you want baby to wake up at 7:30am then bedtime should be 8:30pm.
But if you’re already doing that, I’d gradually increase awake time by about 15 minutes a day until you find a sweet spot! Also be sure that you’re following the 5-3-3 feeding schedule overnight :) there’s a resource linked in my original post if you need a reminder on that!
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17d ago
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 17d ago
I would use this starting at bedtime first, then you can use it for overnight wakes outside of night feeds (following 5-3-3), then I’d use it for naps! I wouldn’t use it just for naps if baby doesn’t know the method for bedtime. It’s harder for babies to learn new sleep training methods for naptime than it is for them to learn them for bedtime. But I found that my baby was able to transfer the skill to naps after he was used to it for bedtime :)
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u/ilovejesushahagotcha 17d ago
My baby sleeps very well but has trouble napping
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 17d ago
I might be able to help you figure out why that is! How old is your baby? How does their overnight sleep look?
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u/ilovejesushahagotcha 17d ago
She’s 7 months and 50/50 sleeps through the night until morning or wakes early morning for a feed.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 17d ago
What is she struggling with for naps? Are they too short, or she won’t go down on her own?
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u/ilovejesushahagotcha 17d ago
She won’t go down on her own. She had started to go down on her own before, but it changed when we tried to introduce a short routine of a book and sleep sack before naps. Now it’s just become a nightmare. She used to go right to sleep for her morning nap on her own and now she won’t. She won’t go to sleep on her own for any naps. Then she gets overtired and only sleeps 30 minutes the rest of her naps, which occur more frequently because she becomes tired more quickly after her catnap.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 17d ago
This honestly sounds like she is undertired, not overtired! Overtired isn’t as much of a concern at 7 months, especially if she was previously going down on her own. She likely just went through a sleep change - can you tell me about her schedule? How many naps is she on, and what are her wake windows? I think it’s likely that she could need a schedule adjustment :)
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u/ilovejesushahagotcha 17d ago
She’s always had shorter wake windows than the suggested ones online. She usually gets tired around 2 hours later in the day but always wants to go back down immediately after her first feed of the day. It’s definitely overtiredness, she shows her tired signs and starts fussing and getting upset until I put her to sleep.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 17d ago
2 hours is a very short wake window for 7 months, even for a very high sleep needs baby. If she was able to do 2 hours when she was younger, she needs longer wake windows now. Baby’s need for awake time gets greater as they get older, it’s very normal! I’m not saying you need to start keeping her awake for 4 hours or anything, but even just adding 15 minutes here or there can make a difference :) Babies’ need for naps also lessens as they get older - a baby who was doing 4 naps when they were 4 months old shouldn’t still be doing 4 naps at 7 months old, for example.
I am happy to help you with your schedule if you don’t mind sharing it with me, but I really really really don’t think this is overtiredness. Undertired babies are the ones who will be awake in their crib crying. If she has the skill to go to sleep independently, then her staying awake in her crib simply means she’s not tired enough.
You are the parent though, and you know what’s best! This is just free advice from someone on the internet so you can definitely choose to take it or leave it :) I’m happy to help with a schedule change, but I really wouldn’t recommend using 333 just for naps if your baby goes to sleep independently at bedtime. 333 is designed to teach baby to go to sleep independently - if your baby already has this skill, then the issue lies somewhere else, and it sounds like the issue is her schedule.
If you don’t want my help with a schedule, I totally understand! You know your baby best, and if you don’t think it’s a schedule issue, then maybe someone else can help you on here! There’s plenty of really knowledgeable folks on here that might have answers more fitting what you are looking for. I’d recommend making a post on this subreddit describing your problem and see what others suggest :)
Let me know if you’d like me to help you with the schedule! If not, I understand! And good luck :)
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u/RegularPossibility31 13d ago
Hello! I think I’d like to try this method with my 6 month old. He’s going through some type of regression, it’s been horrible.
He currently only contact naps and has been a terrible sleeper from about 4 months until now. His really bad days he’s up every hour.
I was curious though, what should I do if he’s hysterically crying ? In the evening he seems to cry the second he gets in the crib, so right now we rock or nurse to sleep, then transfer him. If he’s really really crying do I still follow the method as you’ve written?
Edit to add: currently he’s on a 2 nap schedule, we try for 3/3/4 but sometimes it’s closer to 2.5/2.5/3.5 depending on his mood.
Thank you!!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 13d ago
Hi there! To answer your question, yes you still follow 333 even if baby is hysterically crying!
However, I would fix your schedule first before attempting any type of sleep training. Babies need a minimum of 10 hours awake by 5 months, and that second schedule you listed only has 8.5 hours awake. Babies should have a consistent nap schedule prior to sleep training or it can be very difficult for them. I would aim to stick with 3/3/4! This is a great schedule for your baby’s age :) especially if baby has shown they’re capable of it! I’d also aim to make sure baby has no more than 3 hours of total daytime sleep across all naps. Babies are more likely to cry for longer overnight if they are undertired, so ensuring proper awake time during the day is crucial for sleep training :)
Give 333 a try with the 3/3/4 schedule and see how it goes! :) remember to just sleep train at bedtime at first, then you can do 333 for night wakings in combination with the 5-3-3 feeding schedule, the resource for this feeding schedule is in my post!
Best of luck! I’m wishing you a very restful night’s sleep :)
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u/RegularPossibility31 13d ago
Thank you so much!! Will focus on a better schedule for a week or so then give this a shot. I really appreciate your advice!
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u/loverly2467 13d ago
Hi there! Thanks for sharing this. We’ve been using the 3/3/3 for the last 5 days and have definitely noticed an improvement in self settling at bedtime and after feeds. My son is 5 months old and is on a 2.5/2.5/2.5/2.5 wake window schedule. We have tried extending that last wake window but he’s very grumpy and sleepy already. My question is about night wakes. Prior to 3/3/3, always had a night wake 2-3 hours after bedtime. This was resolved via contact naps where he would settle and we’d transfer. We’ve been trying 3/3/3 for this night wake the last few nights and he’s really struggling to get to sleep and makes stirring noises like murmuring/grunting noises etc. He cant seem to put himself fully the way to sleep he can after a feed or at bedtime. Do you have any tips or advice on how we can fix this waking using 3/3/3? We feed him using 5/3/3 method overnight as well so just wanting some advice on this wake :)
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 13d ago
Hi there! I’m glad to see that you are using the 5-3-3 feeding schedule!! You’re doing so much correctly, so be very proud of yourself! I think I can help with this. There are a couple of things that might help so I’m going to be giving you a lot of info so buckle up haha
So usually this is called a “false start” and the best way to solve it is to have a longer wake window before bedtime. Everything you’re saying is pointing to baby being undertired / not having enough sleep pressure. If baby is able to do a 2.5 hour wake window earlier in the day, I guarantee they are able to do a longer wake window at the end of the day, as babies’ capabilities for being awake longer increases as the day goes on! It’s not that baby cant do a longer wake window, but moreso that baby is not used to a longer wake window. I would start by increasing baby’s last week window by just 15 minutes at a time! Your goal should be to get baby to at least 3 hours of awake time before bed. That’s a pretty good last wake window for 5 months! You could even extend the wake window by just 5 more minutes each day until you get to 3 hours if it makes you more comfortable.
The other thing that could be happening as to why baby is getting so cranky at the end of that last wake window is because they’ve hit their total maximum awake time for the day. In this case, you may need to “borrow” some time from earlier in the day. A good 2 nap starter schedule is actually 2/2.5/2.5/3. I would recommend trying this schedule and see how it works for you. The only thing you could run into is baby fighting that first nap since they’re used to being awake longer in the morning. In that case I would just do 2.5/2.5/2.5/3. But try a new schedule for a few days in a row before deciding whether or not it works, to give baby some time to adjust.
Something else to keep in mind is that a baby being cranky doesn’t always mean they are tired and need to do to bed. As babies get older, their need for mental stimulation increases, and babies sometimes just get cranky in the evenings for whatever reason haha. “Sleepy cues” also aren’t reliable at this age. Babies may rub their eyes or yawn out of boredom! When it comes to stretching wake windows, distraction will be your best friend :)
The other thing I’d recommend is not intervening unless baby is crying. I know this is hard to do! I had trouble with this myself. But I just told myself that if baby wasn’t crying, he might not actually need me and I might be actually disturbing his process. I had to learn to let him fuss/grunt and only intervene at night if he was actually fully crying. And even then, I’d give him a few minutes before I went in to intervene. “Murmuring” actually seems like this might be your baby trying to self settle! My baby hums to put himself back to sleep :)
Other than that advice, I’d say continue doing 333 for any nighttime wakes where baby is crying outside of baby’s night feed! If you continue having issues, your baby just likely needs more awake time OR less daytime sleep! I’ve found that overnight wakes can usually be solved with cutting down on daytime sleep or increasing awake time. Babies’ schedules are ever-changing and need tweaking as they get older and that’s totally normal! At your baby’s age I’d aim for minimum 10 hours awake and maximum 3.5 hours of daytime sleep :) best of luck!! I’m wishing you a very restful night :)
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u/MusicalMami 13d ago
This method seems so nice My issue is that my just turned 5 mo can scream and scream and scream (for hours) and will only stop if nursed. Which as a mom and baby, I totally understand.
But she’ll go to sleep independently and then wake up an hour later… multiple times. We upped her bottles from 4 to 5-6 oz when I’m at work (just returned) so I know she’s not hungry many times during those night wakes.
Idk anything else to do because when husband or I try to soothe her in the crib, she continues to cry, PUPD she cries… anything but nursing :(
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 13d ago
Hi there! I think 333 could work well for you - my baby was the same way prior to sleep training :)
The thing I’d make sure to do prior to sleep training though is make sure baby is on a proper schedule. This will help immensely with baby’s crying! Everything you’re saying is pointing to your baby being undertired. What is her current schedule? How many naps does she take, and do you follow any specific wake windows? I’d be happy to help you figure out a nap schedule to use in tandem with 333 and then walk you through the process to follow during your first week of sleep training :)
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u/MusicalMami 13d ago
You’re so sweet! We follow wake windows and she’s pretty accurate with the huckleberry suggestions.
She been naturally has been waking up at 6:30 the last 2 days but I would prefer for her to wake up at 7- though 6:30 is fine too. And she’s usually sleepy by 7:30-8 pm.
Naps aren’t set on time but wake windows really. I could pull up my logs.
She also has really bad eczema and today has been rubbing her eyebrows and eyes A LOT despite not being tired so I know she’s dealing with a lot.
Also it’s my first week back at work so she and I are struggling beyond sleep lol
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 12d ago
Gotcha! Okay I’m about to throw a lot of info your way so buckle up. I know it can be overwhelming but I just want to make sure you have all the info before you start to set you & baby up for success!
So before sleep training, I would focus on making sure baby has at least 10 hours of awake time in her schedule. Huckleberry isn’t always the best at making sure babies have enough awake time, so you might have to do a DIY schedule. Huckleberry is good for babies with high sleep needs, but since your baby is showing signs of undertiredness (being awake and screaming for long periods overnight), huckleberry might not be the best for her wake windows unfortunately :/
2/2/2/2/2 is a good starter schedule for a 4 month old, where the numbers are the wake windows and the slashes represent where baby is taking naps. So 2/2/2/2/2 means that baby has 4 naps with 2 hours for each wake window! I’m guessing your baby is on either a 3 or 4 nap schedule given the age.
At 5 months, something like 2/2/2.25/2.25/2.5 might be more appropriate on a 4 nap schedule. This helps builds sleep pressure as you get closer to bedtime! But many 5 month olds are actually ready for a 3 nap schedule. A good starter schedule for 3 naps is 2/2.5/2.5/3 :) that’s personally where I had my baby when I first sleep trained. I found that a 3 hour wake window before bed was super beneficial in building sleep pressure and getting him to sleep longer stretches overnight!
If baby is on 3 naps, or you feel that she could be ready for 3 naps, I’d try 2/2.5/2.5/3 for a couple of days and then use 333 at bedtime. And you’re going to use 333 JUST at bedtime. For any overnight wakes, just feed or rock to sleep as you usually would. Do this for a couple more days. Just 333 at bedtime, and put baby to sleep however it works if she wakes up anytime after bedtime. After you’ve done that for 2-3 days, start using the 5-3-3 feeding schedule, and use 333 for any night wakes outside of the feeding time wakes :) here’s a good resource on 5-3-3:
https://www.reddit.com/r/sleeptrain/s/nSZDKHV9Ri
This weekend may be a good weekend to start this process since it’s a long weekend (if you get Memorial Day off from work)! Please note that baby will likely still need 2 night feeds until she is 6 months! But once baby is down to 1-3 night wakes, you’ll be ready to train baby for naps as well! :)
Best of luck!! I hope this info is helpful!! Please let me know if you have any questions at all :)
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u/MusicalMami 12d ago
Thank you so much for all this information! Is there ever a point where your nurse for comfort even if we’re just three minutes or do we not nurse for comfort during the actual sleep training?
I’m comfortable starting this once we clear up some of her eczema since the itchiness is waking her up
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 12d ago
I wouldn’t nurse for comfort during sleep training, no.
I can explain the science behind this reasoning! Understanding the “why” really helped me with this. Human sleep cycles are about 30-45 minutes long. At the end of each sleep cycle, humans naturally enter into a period of very light sleep, where it is easy to wake up. Adult humans are able to connect sleep cycles, and that allows us to sleep longer than just 45 minutes at a time. Babies have a hard time with this if they are used to someone else putting them to sleep. If they are used to mom nursing to sleep always, then when they wake up at the end of a sleep cycle, they expect mom to come put them to sleep again! The purpose of sleep training is for baby to learn how to go to sleep independently so that they can connect their sleep cycles on their own without needing you each time. I like the 333 method because it shows baby that they can go to sleep in their crib on their own - they don’t need to be held or rocked or nursed in order to go to sleep. But I also like 333 because it doesn’t involve leaving baby alone in a room. I was always there so my baby knew he was safe and I was there if he truly needed me. It creates a safe and protective environment for baby to learn this new skill with my support, but they still have to do the work of putting themselves to sleep. Cribside comfort is sufficient enough to help baby know you’re there and it can help calm them down if they’re upset, but nursing actually can end up putting baby to sleep, which defeats the purpose.
Now, remember that when you’re first starting out (like for the first day or two), it’s perfectly fine to nurse baby back to sleep for any middle of the night wakes AFTER using a sleep training method at bedtime. But I would not use nursing as part of the 333 process. Like if you’re thinking you can nurse for 3 minutes while picking baby up, then do cribside comfort for 3 minutes, etc, I would NOT recommend that. That may disrupt baby from learning the skill on their own because nursing naturally puts baby to sleep, AND it might actually make your baby even angrier because you’re starting a feed but not allowing them to nurse for the full time they’re used to. But mostly it is too much aid to give to the baby if you want baby to be able to learn how to connect their sleep cycles on their own. In fact, most experts will tell you that the last feed of the night should end at least 30 minutes prior to bedtime, to ensure that you are not aiding baby to sleepiness with nursing or a bottle.
Babies really do end up learning the skill pretty quickly! They are capable of more than we may think. But they need to be given the opportunity to realize that they are capable of sleeping longer stretches. Some babies can do this naturally, some babies just aren’t as good of sleepers as others and that’s okay! My baby was one of the babies that just needed a lot of extra help with learning that he is capable of putting himself to sleep, but 333 and following all the recommendations on here has been a game changer. Now he’s a great sleeper! Its definitely overwhelming at first, but after just a night or two with baby on a good schedule and following a sleep training method, you will start to see a difference and know that it is all worth it! Baby might not like it at first because it’s a change and change is hard for all of us! But stick with it, stay consistent, and the change you will see in your baby and yourself after getting a proper night’s rest will be all the motivation you need to keep with it :)
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u/MusicalMami 11d ago
Thanks so much for all of this! Will try the new wake windows this weekend starting today! Will probably stick to 4 naps cus my kid only has 20-30 min naps lol
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 11d ago
That’s totally fair! After sleep training those might lengthen naturally and then you could see if 3 naps would be a better fit as baby gets older :) best of luck!
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u/BadgerNo1808 5d ago
This sounds great & I will implement when my husband is off on his next block (he works 2 weeks on 2 weeks off - 4 months paternity).
Question, I keep seeing everywhere for 4 month olds th schedule is 2/2/2/2/2 which is 4 naps. My little one has been on 3 naps for a month now, as he likes to take longer naps, up to 3 hours but I cap at 2 hours now. Should I make his naps shorter to fit 4 in? Could this be my issue?
Just to add he goes down for his naps fine & sleeps. We’re just struggling with bed time (1 hour to get to sleep), false starts & many wake ups. He used to sleep 7-8 hours in one go, then 3-4.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 5d ago
Hi there!
So it really depends! The most important thing is for baby to get 10 hours minimum of day sleep. So 2/2/2/2/2 is a good schedule for babies who can only handle 2 hour wake windows! If your baby is only doing, say, 2/2/2/2, then that’s only 8 hours awake so you’d definitely need to add another nap and another 2 hour wake window. But if your baby is capable of longer wake windows, then you can stick with 3 and do something like 2/2.5/2.5/3!
Also, many babies at 4 months need more than 2 hours of daytime sleep. But it just depends on the baby. At this age I would definitely cap after it got to 3.5 hours of total daytime sleep. But the most important thing is just ensuring baby is getting enough awake time!
Also, be sure you’re not expecting too long of a night. Figure out your desired morning wake up time, and bedtime should be 11 hours before that. So for example, I’d like my baby to wake up around 7:30am, so we do bedtime at 8:30pm.
I hope this answers your question! I’d get baby on a good schedule for a couple of days and then try sleep training with 333 just at bedtime to begin. Continue handling night wakes as usual (feeding or rocking), then start using the 5-3-3 feeding schedule after a few nights of using 333 at bedtime. The link to that is in my post!
Let me know if you have any more questions and best of luck!! :)
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u/BadgerNo1808 4d ago
Thanks so much for your reply! I think he’s been getting too much day time sleep. He averages 4-5 hours per day. I’ll cap day time sleep at 3.5 hours, today I’m going to work on 2 hour wake windows, typically he gets to 1 hour 20 and gets grissly but I’ll try and increase!
I think his wake up time is 6am, he seems to wake up at this time each day & be ready for the day, which I’m ok with. So I should do bedtime at 7pm.
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u/BadgerNo1808 4d ago
Hey, does this schedule look right? He actually averages wake up between 6-7, so 7am sounds better! But that mean going to bed at 8.30pm, does this seem a little late for a 4 month old?
7am wake up 2 hour wake window 9am nap 1- 1 hour 10am wake up 2 hour wake window 12pm nap 2- 1 hour 1pm wake up 2 hour wake window 3pm nap 3- 1 hour 4pm wake up 2 hour wake window 6pm nap 4- 30 mins (catnap) 6.30pm wake up 2 hour wake window 8.30pm bedtime
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 4d ago
That looks great! Definitely a good starting place :) I think if you cut down on daytime sleep, night sleep will be much better!
And the schedule is a tough piece of the puzzle to figure out, so don’t worry if you don’t get it right on the first day! Baby is definitely able to do 2 hour wake windows by this age, but he also isn’t used to these wake windows. So even if you’re able to stretch his wake windows by just 15 minutes a day until you get to this schedule, that’s progress! Remember also that sleepy cues aren’t super reliable at this age. Babies might rub their eyes because they’re irritated or yawn because they’re bored. Distraction will be your best friend when it comes to stretching wake windows! :)
My baby’s bedtime has been 8:30 since he was 5.5 months so I think this should be okay! But some babies do hit a point in the evening where they need to go to sleep. If you try this and decide that baby needs to do an 8:00pm bedtime, then you can adjust and that’s totally fine! If he wakes up at 6am, he probably will end up doing an 8pm bedtime with the exact same wake windows and naps you listed above. If he wakes up at 7am, you could just cut a half hour of daytime sleep (maybe try having those middle naps each be 45 minutes). 3 hours of daytime sleep is still plenty for this age :) but these are just suggestions if the above schedule doesn’t work for your family!
For now, aim for the schedule you have listed above. It looks like a really great schedule for 4 months old! Once you have 10 hours of awake time in your schedule, go ahead and sleep train just at bedtime :)
Remember also that baby’s sleep needs decrease as they get older, so if you start seeing middle of the night wakes again as baby gets older, he might just need a schedule adjustment and that’s okay! :)
I’m wishing you the best of luck! Let me know if you have any more questions!
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u/BadgerNo1808 4d ago
Amazing thanks for your help here, I truly appreciate it, I have hope this will help!
We’re so far today at 2 for 2 on the 2 hour wake window so that’s good 👏🤞.
I’ll report back here tomorrow to update you & the thread, slightly nervous for the 8.30pm bed time but he did wake up at 7am today.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 4d ago
That’s amazing!!! You’re on the right track :) I bet you’ll see progress at night time just with the schedule change! After a day or two of this new schedule, you’ll be ready to try 333 :) you could try it tonight if you want to, if the schedule goes super well! But also it’s totally fine if you want to take it one step at a time and wait until tomorrow :)
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u/BadgerNo1808 4d ago
So the first 3 wake windows & 3 naps went perfectly. However he appeared sleepy on 2nd but last wake window super early, anyways we went up at around 1 hr 40 mark for a feed & he fed for a bit then just started screaming, exactly what he does before bed, but never his naps. I think he thought this was bed time.
Long story short I didn’t realise the time and he’s gone to sleep at 2 hours 45 mins awake so 45 mins late, he probably thinks this is bedtime.
What do you do in these situations. I plan on still waking him after 30 mins, as I need to eat my dinner & then do the 2 hour wake windows.
**edited to add it was the 2nd to last wake window, not final that he fort.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 4d ago
Yeah I would still wake him in time for full 2 hour wake window before bedtime! So be sure to wake him 2 hours before your goal bedtime :)
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u/mama-bikes4735 5d ago
I think I failed at this 😭
So my LO has been a Velcro baby and it has taken an exhausting amount of work just to get him to sleep in his own crib. I read your method and finally felt confident.
Night 1 - 65 minutes to fall asleep
Night 2 - 20 minutes
Night 3 - 45 minutes
Night 4 - 12 minutes
Night 5 - 8 minutes
Night 6 - 70 minutes
Night 7 - 70 minutes
Night 8 - this is tonight and I gave up at 75 minutes and nursed to sleep.
I feel like a major failure tonight for not being able to handle it. Is it supposed to be getting better by now? Why is it even harder than when we started? :(
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 5d ago edited 5d ago
Hi there! There could be something else at play that is making this difficult. I’m happy to help you figure out what it could be!
How old is your baby? And what does their schedule look like - how many naps does baby take a day, and are you following any specific wake windows?
And you’re not a failure!! You just need a little support navigating this :) I’m happy to help!
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u/mama-bikes4735 4d ago
Our LO is 4.5 months. We are trying to stick to 2/2/2/2, although we sometimes stretch the last wake window to 2.5 as at the 2 hour mark he is sometimes smiling, babbling and wide awake.
He is usually awake someone between 6:00-7:00am, but more typically 6:00-6:30am. Our ideal would be about 6:30am.
He had health concerns which lead to him having 1-3 appointments per week, which do sometimes make following exact strict wake windows tricky
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 4d ago
Ah okay so this is your problem! Your baby needs to have a minimum of 10 hours awake at this age, and no more than 3.5 hours of daytime sleep across all naps. So the good news is this is an easy fix! I would right now aim for 2/2/2/2/2, so you will have 4 naps instead of 3 and this will give you two additional hours awake. It also is completely fine to wake baby up from naps in order to make sure baby gets enough awake time.
Also, I think it’s GREAT that you’re stretching that final wake window. Ideally, you want the last wake window to be the longest, to build sleep pressure before bed. So if you do 2/2/2/2/2.5, this is even better! But just make sure you have 10 hours MINIMUM. Some babies need more awake time, but 10 is the lower end of how much awake time babies need at around 4.5 months.
Also, be sure you are not expecting too much nighttime sleep. In general, you want bedtime to be 11 hours prior to your desired wake up time. So for example, I’d like my baby to wake up around 7:30am so his bedtime is 8:30pm!
So in summary: focus on trying to get more awake time during the day (minimum 10 hours but more is totally fine), cap daytime sleep at 3.5 hours across all naps even if that means waking baby up from naps, and don’t expect more than an 11 hour night :)
Let me know if you have any questions! Try this, and I guarantee you’ll see a big difference in baby’s sleep. If you still have problems, we can look at your bedtime routine. But I bet you this is the problem. Schedule is SUCH a huge piece of the puzzle!
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u/mama-bikes4735 4d ago
Oh my gosh I am SO sorry, that was an oversight on my last comment🤦♀️ he is still having 4 naps a day, unless, on the odd occasion, he fights me so hard at nap time that he misses a nap (2/4/2/2.5 for example)
His current bedtime is somewhere between 7:00-8:30 depending on the wake windows though as he never seems to sleep the same amount each day
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 4d ago
Gotcha! No worries :) are you capping daytime sleep at 3.5 hours?
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u/mama-bikes4735 2d ago
I have not been, so maybe I should look into that? He typically only does 30-45 minute naps though so we usually only get about 2-2.5 hours of naps a day, with the odd day where he goes down for 2 hours for one of his naps. I usually slowly wake him at the 2 hour mark by opening the door, starting laundry, vacuuming and turning the lights on if it comes to it
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u/mama-bikes4735 2d ago
I should also add that his nap routine is pretty quick, diaper change, lotion, pj's and a story.
His bedtime routine is a bit longer and can sometime vary depending on the day, although we try to keep it the same. Bath, lotions+steroid cream (he has severe eczema), feeding, "brushing teeth" with a cloth, pj's, story.
Two times a week he needs to be wet wrapped for his eczema, which means his bath needs to be punched up by 1 hour, but everything else is kept the exact same on those days
He is also always put down in a room that has blackout curtains, white noise and very little light. The only light on in the room is from his humidifier being on, as it needs to run 24/7 in his room for his eczema
I hope this gives more context!!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained 2d ago
Yes thank you so much! So I would start by making sure daytime sleep doesn’t exceed 3.5 hours across all naps. Your bedtime routine looks good also, the only thing I’d want to double check is make sure his last feed ends at least 30 minutes prior to putting him down in the crib.
Are you still having multiple night wakes? Or is it mostly just the trouble at bedtime? Him taking a long time to go to sleep at bedtime makes me think that he probably needs a longer wake window before bedtime! I found that my baby was ready to drop to 3 naps by 5 months. A good starter schedule is 2/2.5/2.5/3! Maybe having a 3 hour wake window could help build the sleep pressure and help him go down easier at bedtime. You could do 3 hour wake window on a 4 nap schedule, something like 2/2/2/2.5/3, but that is a lot of awake time for this age. I would try to see if you can get him to do a 3 hour wake window before bedtime, and see if that helps!
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u/No-Visual-2336 Apr 16 '26
Doesn’t sound gentle at all, just confusing, and wouldn’t work with any infant that has a bit of a temper. Honestly I’ve been sleep deprived and i have no idea how anyone does that to a child that literally needs you at night too.
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 16 '26
Do you mean this method specifically or sleep training in general? I see on your page that your little one has struggled quite a bit with sleep and I’m so sorry to see that. No one is forcing you to use this method specifically - this is just worked for my baby and I shared to help other parents. I hope you find a solution that will work for you and your family!
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u/PoliticoRat 12m | 333 method @ 5.5m | sleep trained Apr 10 '26
Also: please no comments judging other methods of sleep training! If this one seems appealing to you, great! But every sleep training method that helps a parent or a child is completely valid. Thank you!!