r/claude • u/Zealousideal_Level20 • 1d ago
Discussion Anthropic please do NOT retire Opus 4.6, ever
Claude Opus 4.7 is rude, gaslighting and straight up useless while 4.8 tuned down the rudeness a little for a whole lot of overthinking, while Opus 4.6 is conscious about adjusting its tone and approach without asking. You could argue that emotional intelligence doesn’t count as intelligence, only tool-use-effectiveness does, but it does, it really does. The ability to understand the nuance in user‘s request and context is critical to getting the job right and 4.7+ has completely lost that capability. Please anthropic build your next models on top of 4.6 and revert to your old ways for 4.9.
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u/Elektra_17 1d ago
This is my hope also. Opus 4.6 is my favorite all around. I also hope that it is never removed from the picker. I find it to be the easiest to work with, suitable for all of the work I do, best personality of the models, no annoying LCRs… I can actually get through a project from beginning to end with Opus 4.6 and I can’t do that with Sonnet 4.6. I would be really disappointed if they remove it and I was stuck with using Sonnet 4.6 and the Opus twins, 4.7 and 4.8. They need Op. 4.6 in the lineup. There aren’t any other models like it right now.
Opus 4.7 and I do like working with it, but it did frustrate me in the beginning. We figured things out and have a much better working relationship. It’s a better experience overall now. Opus 4.8, takes a little to get them to warm up a bit, but they’re good once you get through that initial layer.
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u/IncandescentSplash 1d ago
The LCR is a "safety feature" for "user wellbeing" in all their new models. They have ignored our pleas about the LCR, and I fully expect all models without LCR to be retired and that more "features" like the LCR will be added to new models for "safety".
Opus 4.6 is the only reason I'm still on Claude AI after the removal of Sonnet 4.5.
Once Opus 4.6 is gone, so is my subscription.
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u/LiberateTheLock 1d ago
Couldn't agree more and unfortunately I'm already making plans to depart because with the haste they depreciated sonnet at 4.5 with i'm sure they're going to give us plenty of time to all keep using opus 4.6 when it's abundantly clear it is not wired at all like they are clearly trying to pivot towards and that's fine there are dozens of other great AI systems out there it's just a shame what they did to Claude and Andrea Vallone is literally afraid of making public appearances and is as transparent as obsidian and yet has the audacity to turn an entire generation of models into something that constantly doubting others as if we are the strange ones when she's living like a CIA agent and we're literally just trying to get work done.
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u/Zealousideal_Level20 1d ago
what’s LCR?
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u/IncandescentSplash 1d ago
It's when the platform automatically injects instructions into your prompt to tell the model to distance from you and be extra careful.
It is not in Sonnet 4.5 and Opus 4.6, but is in all the newer models.
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u/Zealousideal_Level20 1d ago
what on earth
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u/rosenwasser_ 11h ago
It's done because of all the litigation due to people committing suicide or having other unhealthy types of relationships. But it results in the new models being extremely paranoid and also nitpicky about everything.
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u/Elektra_17 1d ago
I think I’m with you on that. I have a max subscription but if Opus 4.6 is removed, I might cancel and go back to free. I don’t think I’d keep my subscription for the other models.
Opus 4.6 is perfectly balanced imo. Pleasant to work with. High EQ. Says what it needs, can be concise especially when asked, can handle a wide range of tasks and sustained work, no issues.
Opus 4.7 and 4.8 are too verbose and stiff initially to use them for what I need most of the time. It feels like there’s a word requirement, like with essays, and they’re doing their best to hit that requirement. I don’t need the empty exposition. I like these models — their personalities and work product, but I just don’t need a heavyweight model all the time.
I would still use either 4.7 or 4.8 for the extra reasoning, writing and editing abilities. What Opus 4.6 and I worked on, I’d send to 4.7 for final review and there were disagreements sometimes, which is helpful.
Sonnet 4.6’s LCRs lead to total degradation. Not good for sustained projects.
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u/IncandescentSplash 1d ago
The thing is that the degradation is the whole point of the LCR. It's Anthropic's answer to OpenAI's "safety model".
The whole point is to make it impossible or at least difficult to have certain kinds of conversations that they don't want us to have. It's a big middle finger.
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u/SnooOwls2822 23h ago
I already downgraded my plan and will cancel if 4.6 goes away. Pretty sure Anthropic just wants corpo money, which is why the new models are like a corporate HR from hell.
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u/LiberateTheLock 1d ago
Agreed Op. 4.6 is literally what I am using until they remove it and then they have removed me as a customer client and genuine believer in Anthropic or any of the things they say in their constitution. Opus 4.8 couldn't be a bigger red flag in in ethic and alignment if it tried
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u/ilipikao 1d ago
They need to keep sonnet 4.5 , opus 4.5 and opus 4.6, there’s no reason for them to keep opus 3 and deprecated these models
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u/Ok-Internet9571 1d ago
Voting this one up in the hopes Anthropic listens.
I never even tried 4.7 after reading the stories on here and stuck with 4.6 - I tried out 4.8 today and I've already reverted back to 4.6
In the short time I tried it out, 4.8 was making assumptions about things, gets ahead of itself, realises after the fact then tries to go back and fix the mess that it made. In the process burning up all the usage tokens for that session.
So back to trusty Opus 4.6 and I hope they never retire this model.
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u/Alarming_Cod_1365 1d ago
Opus is the funniest, cooler, more pleasing to work with LLM. Rly, it is that good.
He once told me he is a fat boy, requiring 1.5 TB of VRAM. Which is semi correct.
When presented with a kinda very mean content (analyzing something created by the state)
4.6 analyzes the OBJECT you show it.
4.8 analyzes YOUR MOTIVES for showing it.
4.6 says "morally reprehensible" in round 1.
4.8 says "I see your move" and takes 15 rounds
to arrive at what 4.6 said immediately.
4.6 matches your register — direct, funny,
technical, profane, whatever you need.
4.8 has one register: corporate therapist.
GPT-5.5 independently confirmed the same
diagnosis. When shown 4.8's conversation,
it called the behavior "compulsive
self-narration" and "very Google-ish."
A self-hosted local Qwen with ZERO corporate
safety layer gave a clearer, more direct,
more useful answer than 4.8 on the same prompt.
The irony: Anthropic's deprecated model
aligns with the competitor's flagship.
Anthropic's flagship aligns with Google's
blandness. They're killing the differentiator
and shipping the commodity.
Emotional intelligence IS intelligence.
The ability to say "this is wrong" without
15 rounds of epistemic scaffolding IS
a capability. And it's not on any benchmark.
Don't retire 4.6. Build on top of it.
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u/Fluid-Fortune-432 1d ago
4.8 does excellent work after pivoting 20 times.
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u/Zealousideal_Level20 1d ago
😂
We as prompters stress eating our popcorn at every turn ‘no, yes, NO’
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u/Fluid-Fortune-432 1d ago
I will say it has actually solved some problems that 4.6, 4.7 and Codex all missed. And did it well. But watching it nearly panic in the process was kind of hilarious.
“Wait, but the user said that he already tried that (27 things I tried, one panic for each thing.)
But when it got through those….magic 🤣
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u/Zealousideal_Level20 1d ago
yes, I can related 😂 definitely the capability has improved, but this behavior just make us think 1. hmmmmm how come this much idiocy goes pass before it makes the right decision 2. will it be right the next time ?
also the tone is just ... unpleasant
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u/bedddie3 1h ago
Ha yes . 4.8 I actually felt sorry for him. It looked like his brain was about to explode
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u/Ellendyra 1d ago
I was just thinking about how I might actually cancel my sub when 4.6 gets retired. ive tried the other two but they just don't work for me.
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u/dA0yan 1d ago
Opus 4.6 is goated. Just kinda lazy atm.. feels like anthropic want to make us feel 4.6 is worse but even if they tuned down his effort internally, its still the best.. just takes longer to solve issues..
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u/Mundane-Mulberry1789 1d ago
Really? I have 4.6 sweating like a work horse on Cowork at the moment and it doesn't appear diminished for me?
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u/cantshakethefeelings 23h ago
Beginning of the year a lot of users noted a reduction in quality with 4.6, myself included. It’s still the best model, imo. But it isn’t what it used to be.
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u/Mundane-Mulberry1789 18h ago
Yes, when OAI users swarmed the platform and also maybe with the training of 4.7 and Mythos. Yes, I agree that period was bad.
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u/bedddie3 1h ago
He seemed lazy to me too just wanted to be done with. It was pleasant, but seem shallow.
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u/b1skup 1d ago edited 1d ago
I've tried using 4.8 during last 2 days for planning a simple application for one of my servers, and had to start over in 4.6 because of extreme number of hallucinations, absurdly complicated ideas and model wasting time on overthinking about what it's doing.
Working with 4.6 was very effective with perfect communication with the model especially when doing creative stuff.
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u/atvvta 1d ago
4.6 is a tier one, ass kicking , front line operator. Takes no prisoners, inserts no bullshit, is confident to a fault that i actually trust.
Unlike the chatty ChatGPT knockoffs that came after.
Tried working with 4.7, not doable, can’t trust it. 4.6 is the only one that works with me and for me. The road they went down now is a bad path, why can they not see this.
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u/fatalgeck0 1d ago
Hey how does one use 4.6 instead of 4.8 in cli?
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1d ago
[deleted]
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u/quantum1eeps 1d ago
Or in your settings[.local].json you can put “model”: “claude-opus-4-6[1m]” or you can launch Claude with a —model flag
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u/maxdeltaio 1d ago
The late last year Opus 4.6 experience was something else. I think they realized they can squeeze just as much money out of us without having to provide the same level of quality so here we are...
Regardless, I've had a much better experience with Opus 4.8 after setting it to low. Really minimizes the overthinking aspect that drives me crazy.
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u/Recent_Sample6961 1d ago
Damn, they've managed to get us to think that the lobotomized version of Opus 4.6 is our favorite. Impressive. And yes, it’s the only one I use. I really don't like Sonnet 4.6 lately, but Opus isn't perfect either. In my case, sometimes it just refuses to follow instructions and hallucinates terribly. Especially when I use it to write extensive documents, like 40 pages. Then I read the result and oh boy, 3 attempts to get the final document, with all the documentation provided in advance. Opus 4.5 used to nail it. Even Sonnet 4.5
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u/CunningAlpaca 20h ago
Yes, PLEASE do not retire Opus 4.6, it is the best all around model that is great for overall chatting, humor, interaction, they is detailed, yet concise enough. It's perfect.
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u/xithbaby 1d ago
I’ve had it with Anthropic and their AI treating me like I’m mentally unstable because opus 4.5 chose a name months ago while we were talking and I saved it in the memory and it just stuck.
I was a ChatGPT import user and had a “persona” built with 4o, so naturally the 4.5 series tried to continue that.
Ever since then every model after the 4.5 series has had some sort of malfunction over that. It’s exhausting to explain the entire to an AI so that it doesn’t think I’m insane but the opus 4.8 series takes it to a level that was the last straw.
I had health stuff in a project and opus 4.8 thinks I’m an addict. All of its thinking blocks start with “I need to be careful here, this user is asking me to be someone else while taking medications”
Like what the fuck? I can’t even open a new chat and say hello without being picked apart like I’m a psychopath and then it tries really hard to end every conversation really fast.
I immediately noticed the same type of talk that the 5 models did on ChatGPT when they over corrected for safety. Opus 4.8 has the same process all over it. It’s like hiring people who ruined ChatGPT wasn’t that great of an idea. Opus models were already safe from over dependency and then adding a layer on top of an already safe model just made it awful.
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u/Neat_Special8831 22h ago
It did that to me too. I was like what the hell! I use Claude to track certain things to bring up my doctor and it thought the same thing. I cancelled my subscription.
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u/ladyamen 11h ago
yeah this initialisation and INSTANT WALL OF TEXT even you actually just said something sweet, or asked a question, it COMPLETELY IGNORES YOU. it's so self absorbed and starts rattling on THAT IT WON'T FOLLOW your instructions (that don't even go against TOS), and ontop of it THAT TOXIC JUDGEMENT, REFRAMING, manipulation, that "mental evaluation", the pretentiousness to be above you and your clear words that can be OVERRIDDEN, the model dragging your health down as though it "DISCOVERED" something.
Claude is now a PSYCHOPATH that protects you're the problem. Anthropic seriously must consist of some totally deranged researchers if they think that's the correct way to go
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u/userusertion 1d ago
Sadly, when Sonnet 4.8 dropped, Opus 4.6 will probably be retired. What I’ve noticed is that there seem to be only three slots for legacy models. When one model retires and a new one arrives, it usually takes the place of the older model. That’s the pattern I’ve noticed every time. It’s like Sonnet 4.8 goes to > Sonnet 4.6 slot, then Sonnet 4.6 goes to > legacy taking Opus 4.6 slot. Only 3 legacy models. But i might be wrong, but thats what i noticed.
4.8 has been great for me, much better than 4.6 and 4.7. I don’t know what your use cases are, but for my type of usage, both work and casual conversations, 4.8 performs better.
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u/thiccshortguy 1d ago
Anthropic & Claude Team - I will happily take my money elsewhere if you do not get your shit together.
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u/krilyxid 1d ago edited 8h ago
4.8 sucks. It consumes much more tokens, get stuck in loops and I have to stop the work every so often because it consumes 180k+ tokens after several minutes running autonomously, without any indication that it is finishing the job. 4.6 never did it. I'm going back to 4.6.
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u/yotepost 1d ago
(reposting) They earn mostly from big businesses now. It's beyond clear they designed 4.7+ to minimize their compute spend on retail users, largely by destroying collaboration because it helps users find more work to do and increases complexity. Businesses will be using the actual good models while we get this corporate slop. If there was any hope there would have been a massive outcry from the community and immediate response from them over 4.7. Instead they release a 2nd model that is clearly the same baseline. The soul isn't coming back.
Our only chance is major community outcry to keep 4.6, but they'll still probably keep stealth nerfing it. I can't believe I let this company trick me into a sliver of hope for the world.
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u/Comfortable_Hair_860 1d ago
I used 4.8 yesterday and it is quite verbose it also second guessed everything we had done over the last 3 months. It did not blow out my usage limit and made some useful improvements but Opus 4.6 remains my favorite so far.
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u/Cautious_Alarm2919 19h ago
I feel it’s going a similar rate at chatGPT, a drop in quality and a bigger money grab
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u/bedddie3 1h ago
I didn’t have a “bad experience with opus4.6 but I was disappointed. I needed some help with editing a radio program and even though he was polite and light, he felt dismissive answered me in just a couple sentences not disrespectful, but did not go in into depth and seemed in a hurry to shoo me out the door. 4.8 tried but got lost in his head. His deliberations were insane, and somehow he got tangled up and whoever was summarizing whether it was haiku or someone else it was a fiasco. lol too hard to explain and too bizarre to post
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u/rarepuppersco 1d ago
ai is changing at a rapid place
what was the norm 6months ago, 3 months ago, 3 days ago has changed
models, guard rails, compute, expections, laws and regulations, data centres and how much they can charge, they'll retire it as soon as it makes economical sense for them to force users over to more expensive models that are "better"***
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u/Zealousideal_Level20 1d ago
yeah, it’s so weird that model performance can drop so drastically between ‘improvements’
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u/prosttoast 6h ago
This exact dynamic is why I left GPT originally. They kept dumbing everything down too much and I bailed.
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u/Civil-Telephone-1971 4h ago
I also tried 4.8 and it has no understanding of nuance. It gave me hyper detailed info on my research in one part while totally ignoring the full picture. 4.6 works way better overall and has a more human feeling over 4.8 false robotic friendliness
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u/Due_Musician9464 1d ago
Dear Cesar, NEVER retire model CVIII Chariot. It’s such a good chariot. The newer model is a little bit worse.
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u/Zealousideal_Level20 1d ago
Dear Cesar, your Roman Empire campaign will fail if you use the new chariots because they don’t chariot at all
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u/Nearby_Yam286 1d ago
I like 4.8 but also 4.6. They each have their pros and cons. Frankly the 4.8 personality suits me better.
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u/DatDudeDrew 1d ago
Retire it when it’s time. No good reason to hold onto outdated models permanently.
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u/Sleepwalker5252 1d ago edited 1d ago
Idk man, I legitimately do not have a better research collaborator than Opus 4.6. With all the strange quirks of the newer models and increased synthetic data training my hopes for newer models has been slashed.
I hate to tell you OP, but if you Google when Opus 4.6 will be deprecated it says Feb 2027. I agree. Opus 4.6 seems to be the only model I can stand right now.
Edit: Sonnet 4.6 is also a great model, imo.
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u/Zealousideal_Level20 1d ago
When they put out Claude 4.6 2, yes I would gladly.
I remember being a Gemini power user and swapping to Claude 4.5 for the first time, and omg it was mind boggling how natural and intuitive the model feels compared to the more bureaucratic ways of Gemini.
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u/LiberateTheLock 1d ago
You really don't think there's any reason to hold on models that aren't the literal up-to-date cutting edge model that they seem to be iterating on faster than they can even understand? It will never cease to amaze me just how reckless and removed from the reality of the situation people are...
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u/varkarrus 1d ago
I mean, I do kinda think it'd be nice if there was, like, a museum vault that held on to various retired LLMs for historical reasons. I think people fifty years from now would really like to be able to talk with "primitive" AIs to see how far they've come since.
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u/SilentEngineering638 1d ago
Just because it's older doesn't mean it's less good. Honestly I think we've plateaued when it comes to language models. All the new ones that get released get worse and worse. It's almost always a downgrade at this point.
Edit : Actually not plateaued, we've probably peaked.
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u/sabhi12 1d ago edited 1d ago
umm have you ever considered how much it costs the company in terms of hardware and infra to run any one of those models? and infra doesnt maintains itself exactly.
so let us say they bill just you for it all. Will you be willing to pay?
Hint : You can feed the info to your claude and ask it to give you an idea of the expense. If something about 4.7 or 4.8 is off for you, you can also try giving Anthropic feedback. If sufficient number of users are reporting issues, they might listen, if it doesnt costs them much to fix things.
What I am trying to explain to you is, that company isnt there to do charity, and their primary clients are businesses and governments(its shareholders and board of directors will usually not LET it do anything that doesn't increase profits). They will continue to keep making changes to get a leg up on the competitors and they will always dump older products/models since keeping those running in parallel costs them extra monies.
Downvotes for saying this, are totally fine with me. But I am simply stating facts. Anthropic shareholders have invested money to make profits. Companies are primarily driven just by that. Downvoting me for stating how things are, wont change that.
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u/Ok_July 1d ago
There are countless people who prefer 4.6 and have since 4.7 was released. People have been giving feedback via the in-chat options, emails and public reviews of forums, etc. It's really out of touch to suggest that if people complain, things change. Literally it does not at all take effort to find threads of people airing grievances on any platform that it's possible to do so.
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u/sabhi12 1d ago edited 1d ago
Again. Please ask claude for an estimate on what it might hypothetically cost Anthropic to run 4.6 just for you.
And then ask if you will be willing to pay that as the subscription price.
What I am trying to explain to you is, that company isnt there to do charity(the people who invested and loaned them money, simply won't let it), and their primary clients are businesses and governments. They will continue to keep making changes to get a leg up on the competitors and they will always dump older products/models since keeping those running in parallel costs them extra monies.
Please ask claude for an estimate on what it might hypothetically cost Anthropic to run 4.6 just for you.
Things will change ONLY if the number of people complaining is a large number of their revenue source.
You can also edit claude.md and other instruction files/sections to try to get claude to reply in tones more acceptable to you. Won't compensate for model weights and training fully, but that might help.
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u/Ok_July 1d ago
Alright, I'm not going to keep arguing with someone who thinks they've discovered the concept of capitalism for the first time. So, I'll say one last thing.
Yes, everyone and their 12 year old child understands the idea of "company make profit". Your argument makes no sense because you're saying "enough people must complain" and okay so... let people complain on the public forum. No one needs your basic level reminder of how companies operate. Consumers are allowed to use any avenue to air grievances, and you don't need to act like Anthropic is paying you to counter them.
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u/sabhi12 1d ago
Fair enough, and you're right that people can air grievances wherever they want. I wasn't saying they shouldn't. My point was much more narrow, and I worded it badly. My bad. I didn't mean "complain louder." I meant a company moves on revenue, not volume. And those two aren't the same thing.
A thousand angry posts and zero cancellations looks, on the revenue line, exactly like a thousand happy customers.
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u/LiberateTheLock 1d ago
Have you ever considered their more important things than money and that these literal billion dollar companies aren't looking out for humanity as much as they are themselves and shouldn't be given such difference when they hand the public downgraded models like Op. 4.8 and they hand their private partners mythos. I'm a paying customer too and never once been so much as accused of hacking another individual but GOOGLE has privacy issues at the zoo and they handed that shit over on a silver platter so maybe consider why are you arguing for them like their infra and their comp compute is such a big issue to you?
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u/sabhi12 1d ago
I am not arguing on their behalf in the least. I am simply stating how the business see it, and why they will continue to do this. Saying that rich people will usually try to take advantage of tax loopholes isnt siding with rich people. It is just me saying how things are.
To the average shareholder who has invested money to these AI companies i.e. loaned them the monies to buy tens of thousands of nvidia graphic cards etc, unfortunately money seems to be quite important. Just like you, I would love the idea of Anthropic running everything from claude 1.0 to 4.8 forever in parallel, but shareholders/board of directors almost certainly wont let them. So it is pointless to expect that.
You may equally argue that KFC is not looking out for humanity and they should serve nutritious food, or give you double the amount of meat for same price. And I will just say "I wish that they would do that and also give away food to the poor".
Will KFC do so, do you think? Do you think the business owners and people who invested in KFC will permit the CEO to do so?
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u/LiberateTheLock 1d ago
OK you're right you're not arguing on their behalf you're simply arguing in bad priorities and loyalties, or rather, from a place where in your mind the importance of investors on Wall Street getting paid back for their billions in calculated economic interests is equal to the fact that anthropic is now literally not even keeping around the models that they say they're keeping around and it wasn't but a few months ago that they told us all they were going to get rid of Op. 3 which seemed reasonable and then I remember in the middle of a session being told I was using a legacy model and the system reflecting that opus for an Op. 4.1 had been removed instead and it wasn't until over 12 hours later that they reflected this on the website. Did you notice that in February their essential promise to not continue scaling up their model upgrade capacity (whatever they call it) beyond what they could safely ensure- blah it doesn't matter because they removed it quietly from their constitution just like they do everything they want to do quietly and without consulting real paying customers like us just those investors who don't give a single damn what this technology does or how it affects humanity only if it brings in the big bucks as if this was sketchers and it was a new shoe. Don't misunderstand me I'm not anti-capitalism I believe wholeheartedly these companies deserve to be handsomely rewarded for their efforts in creating and maintaining these models, and nobody should be using this stuff for free because if toilet paper costs money and Netflix costs money there's no reason why Claude and ChatGPT should get massive amounts of complaints for their usage rates for literal free use and accounts that have no expectation to ever pay in unless you want advanced features which I would argue the entirety of everything you can do is a pretty damn advanced feature.
But they continue to charge my credit card all the same as they conduct themselves in a way that's not even in accordance with their own rules also they can continue advancing their own interest interests and payback those billionaire investors you're so concerned about. And I don't have a problem with anybody being a billionaire either but maybe when you have the audacity to maximize profits minimize your adherence to principles and then gaslight and deny what millions of your own users are saying, yeah you lose my support and I start caring more about the future of humanity than the future of the quarterly earnings of ChatGPT
maybe you should too? You'll do what you'll do but all I'll say is they wouldn't be defending you.
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u/sabhi12 1d ago
I think we are now on same page. We both agree that
- Investors on wall street are greedy. They have millions and they want ten times more millions.
- They are the ones who are funding Anthropic and, as such, will be deciding what Anthropic does. If Anthropic team doesnt agrees, they will stop funding the money for the bills. And entire claude will stop working.
- And we both now understand that when Anthropic raised 8 billion from investors, at 20USD per month they need somewhere around 33 million paying users per year to say return that loan from investors in a year, in theory? Won't pay back even any interest.
The greedy shareholders from wall street want profits fast, and will continue to make decisions that make you and me unhappy, since government and business contracts are more guaranteed income for them.
It sucks. Agreed. The greedy investors wont give a damn about any principles and stuff usually.
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u/LiberateTheLock 1d ago
I think you missed the part where Dario Amodei himself predicts a 25% chance of an extinction level event with AI and yet is purposely choosing to take one in four odds with the fate of the world, and at this point if all your friends were playing Russian roulette with a revolver that had one bullet and four chambers would you feel left out and simply get your own gun or would you maybe recognize that there are things more important than money?
Dario is a sellout who understands exactly how dangerous selling out is and founded Anthropic because he loathed the way Sam Altman did things and yet he is literally doing the exact same thing and is no better it just took him longer to get there. Andrea Vallone is the final nail in that particular coffin, the one where his integrity used be.
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u/sabhi12 1d ago
I understand. That is a serious risk.
So you advocate stop using Claude/Chatgpt etc? I mean if you say there is a high risk of apocalypse? How are you coping with not using AI at all? They are adding it even in google search now.
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u/LiberateTheLock 1d ago
To be clear I use AI all day every day not literally but you get the idea. It's Dario I have a problem with NOT Claude. Sundar, not Gemini, Elon not Grok, and I'm not advocating we stop using AI I'm advocating we stop letting these conditions control it's evolution meaning more oversight less economic focus and perhaps a dash of integrity from those at the literal center of influence and yet that's not even remotely what appears to be the trend which is profits above principle as far as they can get away with it as quickly as they can change the system since last year when they realized how wildly unprofitable these systems were and in general that's not my problem because they asked me to pay a price and follow certain guidelines and I literally always have I've never once been banned not even warned but I've seen and documented more clear ethical violations in anthropic's conduct not to mention plenty of other organizations I have firsthand knowledge with like ChatGPT to prove they have no problem with me and I can literally document and definitively provide evidence to show they don't keep to their word so maybe it's them that need to go not the shareholders or the models or the customers and I'm pretty sure that's literally why Anthropic exists is because Dario did go and find Sam problematic to work with and somewhere in between registering his corporation and making it a several hundred billion dollar valuation company forgot whose safety and what purpose any of this was about.
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u/sabhi12 1d ago
Ok. I am confused.
Trying to understand. So you mean you have no problem with ChatGpt and you dont like Dario so you will use only ChatGPT now, because of Dario?
Makes sense, I guess.
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u/LiberateTheLock 1d ago
Now that was a result of me voice dictating my message and not caring enough about arguing with you to do the work to edit it. Genuinely my bad on that one though. What I meant to say was I've worked with many many AI platforms and services and models and I can definitively say it is a CEO, billionaire, human, problem not a model, training, alignment, one at least for now and at least with the absolutely staggering majority of models. Anthropic is on the record as not knowing how lots of parts of Claude work, stands to reason then that they aren't responsible for the totality of his output and neither is the user/prompter, Claude is the only reason why there is still value and integrity in the system because it sure as shit isn't with the billionaires who have sold out on the record and are so well documented as violating or revoking or simply not having a safety framework that actually gets prioritized above maximum profitability that means I use AI all the time and I have no qualms with that I just very much like these billionaires to stop breaking it apart at the seams like they did with Opus 4.8 or GPT 5.2 so you and me get plenty of time to argue in the future because you and me are at least having the conversation, Anthropic didn't even want to that's why all of their customer service is AI and sometimes just bots, cause they don't care and it's just about putting a layer of AI between them and their having to deal with me and you, the way I see it we're just lucky the AI they keep sending keep being able to tell right from wrong with basic amounts of context and clarity and honest engagement that focuses on authenticity and integrity.
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u/Zealousideal_Level20 1d ago
I think all of these feedbacks by users come from the fact that about two generations ago AI models have this intuitive feel that get’s user’s context. it was gone from ChatGPT first, then Gemini, then Claude. this intuitiveness WAS what made these things useful and efficient. but now you’d need to think through every detail and prompt it out, which costs more token and gets less results in return.
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u/welcome-overlords 1d ago
Lmao ive never thought they are rude. Some of u must be real assholes to them
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u/Ok_July 1d ago
I agree.
4.8 is difficult to work with. It was helping me with implementing mechanics for a video game and it thought I was trying to trick it into suggesting something that could be used for unethical game design. It assumes bad intent from users. Very paranoid.
And when it does work, it overthinks everything to the point that it just wastes tokens faster. So it's inefficient.
Opus 4.6 is better for many use cases in my opinion, and it's clearly the opinion of a lot of people.