Which role players would you like to bring in to reshape the physicality on this team?
Watching the Thunder Spurs series is a reminder the physicality and killer mindset your team needs to truly contend in this league. The East is so bad a team like the Cavs have managed to fall into the ECF with only one player like this (Strus). We need a team filled with these type of guys.
Minott was a welcomed addition to the team, not only because of his skillset, but because of his fuck you attitude and physicality he brings to the team. We need more Minotts on this team.
I’d love to hear some of the players you’d like to see the team acquire whether its via trade or free agency.
Here are a few of the players that came to mind when thinking about this:
Isaiah Stewart
Closest player you’re going to find that has a Ron Artest mentality. Nobody wants to fuck with this guy. Yet he has legit skills that I think would be perfect for this squad. Focusing on the physicality aspect, he can easily become a 10 rebound/game guy and 1.5-2 blocks a game. He would immediately bring a level of physicality to the front court that we haven’t seen since maybe Kenyon Martin.
Thunder Players: Cason Wallace Lu Dort
I’d prefer Cason Wallace, but don’t believe the Thunder will let him walk. This guy is an absolute stud on defense. Whenever a player touches the ball he’s in their face, making their life a living hell. He’s a turnover making machine that can single handily change the pace of a team’s offense.
Dort I’m iffy on. As much as I want guys that will punch you in the face for touching their teammate (see Stewart), I’m not sure I want a dirty player. With that said, he fits the physicality role on the wing that would pair nicely with Minott.
Pelle Larsson:
There’s always a guy that always sticks out when we play their team. Pelle was one of those guys for me this year. Unlike the other players that stick out to me because of their defense, Pelle’s physicality comes on the offensive side of the ball when I think of him. The guy relentlessly attacks the rim going through guys with brute force. Additionally, anytime I watched the Heat and there was a scuffle, Pelle was in the front ready to throw down.
Mo Wagner:
If we move on from Claxton and promote Sharpe to starting Center, this is a guy that has always fucked up our shit when coming off the bench. He kinda brings that dick energy that pisses off the other team while he uses his physicality to punish teams down low scoring and on the boards.
Can't say when I watched the Suns I thought of Gillespie as someone who brought physicality to the game. Goodwin on the other hand is a player I'd love to have on the squad. He's always played his ass off on defense, pestering the opposing players. Definitely would love to bring him in.
Yea, Gillespie isn't an amazing defender by any means, but he's solid. He's a bit undersized, but has the speed to stay in front, and creates a solid amount of turnovers, while contesting a lot of shots.
Gillespie is probably more impactful overall due to the offensive value he provides, but he's not a negative defender either. The team probably has the space to get both of these guys though, and I think that could make Brooklyn a play-in team if they get Gillespie and Goodwin.
When a team beats everyone's expectations or is just really good in general, it's because they have some guys that are greatly outperforming their contract value. When Phoenix has 20 million of dead money on their books due to stretching Beal's contract, if they wanted to make the playoffs, they had to have guys like that, and for them this season, those guys were Gillespie and Goodwin.
I'd like to bring Gillespie in, but he's not the type of player I made this post to discuss.
I'm looking for physical menaces, guys who're out there diving after every ball. Who're controlling the paint because they're a bruising force. Guys who're causing turnovers because they're pestering the opposing players full court.
What makes you think Goodwin is the difference between a play-in? He's played for a different team each year, career 19 mins per game on 41% fg%.
He's as random and non needle moving a player as it gets, unless I'm missing something? He seems closer to getting DNPs than being a regularly impactful guy
Not just Goodwin, Goodwin and Gillespie. A lot of advanced stats really loved those guys, for both of them, the team got significantly better whenever they were on the court. They both provide specific skill sets that are exactly what Brooklyn needs, elite POA defense, good connecting, and improved 3pt shooting with Goodwin, and with Gillespie, elite floor spacing, really good facilitating, and improved defense.
And besides those 2 guys, Brooklyn has more than people realize, Minott is also a super good defender and a do it all guy on offense, MPJ is an elite second option on offense who just carried a historically bad offense to a slightly above average offense during his minutes, Day'Ron Sharpe is just a really good center, he's an elite perimeter defender for his position, and contests a ton of shots, while also being one of the best rebounders in the league, and Egor isn't an amazing defender, but based on his rookie year, probably projects to also be an elite floor spacer and decent defender while being a solid connector.
With the current roster, if they also get Gillespie + Goodwin, the lineup would look something along the lines of:
Starters:
Gillespie
Goodwin/Egor
MPJ
Minott
Day'Ron
Depth
Goodwin/Egor
Claxton
Wolf
Mann
6th pick
Young guys + 2nd rounders
More specifically with the top 6 guys, you have a starting lineup with 4 guys that are either solid or elite defenders, average or significantly above average floor spacers at 4 positions, solid or good connecting at most positions, and good or elite rebounding at every position. The main thing the main lineup would be missing is a guy that can be a primary shot creator and facilitator, which is why I would limit this lineup to play-in.
First the 6th pick is your day 1 starter at point guard no matter what and total waste of time to bother with Gillespie. Goodwin is absolute non entity - defense and scrappiness can be found when it’s appropriate, not something to focus on now. Sharpe is career backup, a throw back old school center who can neither shoot the 3 or protect the rim that this sub massively overrates for some reason, maybe because he has good hands and can finish pretty well but would be useless against bigger top tier centers. Minott as starter is massive reach - Boston gave him away as salary dump on minimum contract - and they are not bad evaluators of talent. He played well in limited games, but starting on decent team is preposterous jump. MPJ has great half year, and since salary cap is not an issue for nets, let him light it up, will be big numbers guy on bad team for rest of career
The 6th pick as a starter day one likely won't make them better day one. So saying that not playing the sixth pick will cause them to lose more games than this year is a nonsense claim.
Gillespie is an elite shooter, good facilitator, and solid defender. His level of shot making from the perimeter is not very common, and saying it's a waste of time is just dumb as he provides a ton of value and made his team significantly better whenever he was on the court.
Goodwin's defensive impact is not something that can just be found whenever, he's an elite defender with elite measurements (6'10 wingspan), which there aren't many of players like that to go around.
Sharpe doesn't give a ton of vertical rim protection, but that doesn't make him a bad, Sharpe is still a super good defender because he forces a shit ton of turnovers for his position, and just because he isn't an elite rim protector, that doesn't mean he does a bad job contesting shots, he still contests a lot of shots, and holds opponents to a below average fg% when contesting those shots. And just because he played off the bench for most of his career, that doesn't mean that should continue to be the case. James Harden when he started his career was mainly a bench player, should he have continued to be a bench player since he was a career bench player up to that point? Isaiah Hartenstein was a bench player for most of his career, should he have continued to be a bench player since that's what he was up until the end of his NY stint? Kyle Lowry started his career on the bench, should he have continued to come off the bench for his entire career since that's who he was up to a point? The reason I'm asking this is because if a player objectively has the production to warrant starting, saying they shouldn't start because they were coming off the bench for most of their career is just a bad argument.
Minott as a starter is not a massive reach, he was one of the best players on the entire roster offensively, and he was also a super good defender. Boston didn't give him away because he wasn't playing good, he was playing good in Boston, but they just had other players also playing good that they drafted so they would have control over longer term. They were a +8 net rating team for a reason, that doesn't mean Minott was playing worse.
When MPJ was playing the team was literally an above average offense, saying he's a "good numbers, bad team guy" is just a bad take. That's a label you would apply to a guy like Zach Lavine, who's teams are consistently worse when he's playing. This season, MPJ carried a historically bad offense to a slightly above average offense during his minutes, which is not something an empty stats guy does, that's just a gross undersell of his actual impact.
(12.2 point increase in offensive rating, you usually only see these types of swings from elite offensive players)
The starting lineup of Gillespie, Goodwin/Egor, MPJ, Minott, and Day'ron would be one of the best 3pt shooting lineups in the league with 2 elite perimeter players and 2 guys that are solid/good shooters, and the rebounding would also be really good as they'd have good/elite rebounders at 4 positions, with Goodwin and Sharpe both being elite rebounders for their position. Then the defense would also be significantly better, with 4 guys who are massive upgrades on defense compared to last season's starting lineup. Based on this, I think you saying they'd be worse than last year is either just hating, uninformed, or delusional.
You convinced me, that team will win 25 games. By the way, the 6th pick which will obviously be a point guard given the draft set up and nets needs will definitely be starter day 1. The goal this season is to try hard, win as many games as possible, and build for the future. Absolutely have to turn over the team to thst guy and hope for the best, so Gillespie thing just not happening and they haven’t given up on traore as the back up. Your pursuit of role players just not worth it, absolutely have to find guys with upside, much better to overpay Watson
You're sleeping on Goodwin. He was a big reason for the Suns surpassing basically everyone's expectations and being a 45 win team despite the team having 20 million of dead money on the books.
I watched a decent amount of suns and definitely agree Gillespie is very good. Goodwin just seems like a run of the mill, inefficient backup pg to me
Didn't he struggle to consistently crack the rotation for a lakers team with a bad guard rotation ? And him bouncing from team to team indicates he's a generic journeyman
Not saying you're wrong - I'll keep an eye out - just feel like he's sorta just another guy who'd be mediocre here for a year or two and take time away from Traore, Egor, and our #6 pick
You'd be right to say that he's a bit inefficient on offense, his rim pressure is pretty poor, but he provides okay floor spacing, and isn't turnover prone, which saves him from being a massive net negative on offense. He definitely doesn't move the needle much offensively, a better comparison for the type of impact player he is would probably be Alex Caruso, he's a similar archetype in the sense that he's also an elite defender who creates a ton of turnovers while being able to switch effectively due to having a 6'10 wingspan.
Not saying he's as good of a defender as Caruso, but Caruso is more along the lines of how I view Goodwin schematically.
And he might not be as redundant as you might think, he can probably play up since he has an elite wingspan relative to his size (6'10 wingspan).
And regarding the draft picks, Marks selected 5 guys that are all bigger than their listed position, so they can all probably move up 1-2 spots if their level of play warrants getting minutes.
I want Watson but he's not the type of guy I'm talking about.
I'm talking about players that when opposing teams come to town, they're pissed because they know its going to be a long night having to deal with them on the boards or when they're being covered by them.
I would love another team to sign Mitch Robinson because any way the Knicks can be weakened the better for the Nets as we control the Knicks draft picks. An opportunity to get a franchise guy would be with the Knicks unprotected first round picks.
And can you image how heated the Knicks would be if they won the draft lottery and the pick goes to Brooklyn and he becomes a superstar. It would be legendary.
Love the idea of bringing in Zach Collins. He's always been underrated because of his injuries. The guy is a fucking dickhead, but a fucking dickhead you want on your team.
Sochan is also another great idea. Can be a great hustle player off the bench that sets the tone of the 2nd unit.
Barnes feels more of a culture guy than someone setting physicality. He would be a nice addition though.
Ayo, Peyton Watson, santi aldama, cam Spencer, Franz Wagner (ik he may be a elite role player to a superstar but still a dream), Tobias Harris, Jay huff, Jarace walker, Trey Murphy III, Dejounte Murray, CJ McCollum (veteran off FA to guide the youngins), max christie, Naji Marshall, PJ Washington, Jailyn Williams, Thomas Sorber (maybe OKC trades him if they resign Hartenstein), maybe take a chance on de Andre hunter, Yves Missi, Yang Hansen (maybe needs a change of scenery), deuce Mccbride, Will Richard, Justin Champagnie, Jaylen Wells, etc. I’m not saying we get all these players but these are a list of players that actually fit the archetype of becoming more physical and could help the team become more competitive.
Naji Marshall is one of my dream role players. Probably should’ve highlighted him in my post. Every time I watch him going back to his Pelicans tenure, all I can think is why isn’t this guy talked about more.
Would love to bring him in, even if it's for half the season to show the young guards what attacking the rim with no fear and running through people looks like. His pure hustle would bring a spark off the bench.
I don’t think grit has to do with physicality, grit is passion and perseverance. Right now, Jordi has held the nets to that standard.
I want to add any player from the Nuggets that Jordi already has a relationship with. Build on MPJs career year and see what happens.
We have no incentive to win next year if the lottery reform happens so just want to see development in the Flatbush Five and whoever we draft this year.
What you’re talking about is saying we want Brooklyn Grit without having players that have Brooklyn Grit.
Jordi can have the guys play as hard as they possibly are capable of, but that doesn’t equate to grit, passion, and perseverance. Some guys have it, some guys don’t.
Our team is full of guys that don’t. You may not agree, but the results on the court say we don’t.
We don’t have our pick next year so I’m not sure why you’re talking about incentives of winning or losing. I’m talking about building a real team. A team of winners. That doesn’t happen overnight.
I don’t agree that’s what I’m talking about. If you look up what grit means, passion and perseverance are what encapsulate grit.
All of our guys play hard when they’re trying to win. We had a great December defensively due to our effort and some shooting luck.
Grit doesn’t equate to winning, grit is a team identity.
If the lottery reform happens, the teams who are in the middle of the conference have the highest odds of a pick. Since we don’t have our pick, I don’t see a reason to compete for a playin spot and give a pick that dan move up to the rockets (ie. Reed Shepard).
I agree winning doesn’t happen overnight, and definitely doesn’t need to happen now with Wembys spurs on the rise. We can wait it out
I shouldn’t have brought grit into this. The post is about physicality and imposing your will on other teams. Our team is lacking players that are physically capable of that, no matter how hard they try.
I personally would like to bring in other players that will have us playing a brand of basketball that imposes their will on other teams. If we don’t see eye to eye, that’s all good by me!
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u/nouseforasn 13d ago
How about we worry about drafting an All-NBA player for this first time in team history first